10yo Daughter wants to go to pride

[NeedDDadvice]

Deliberately posted on sex and gender topic. Please don't move

Yes, I name changed. I want advice free of my previous posts on Mumsnet. I am an old poster of the COD and Riven era!

My 10yo daughter who has pictures of all sorts of flags on her bedroom wall, asked me to take her to pride.

My response was yes, if I can find a family friendly one. She asked what might be inappropriate and I said men dressed in leather dog suits. We both laughed.

She doesn't have a label yet but is so interested in the pride flags.

She thinks that because I don't believe in gendering, that I am Transphobic. Which is ridiculous. As I pointed out if I don't believe in Christianity that doesn't make me Christianphobic.

All my children have been raised to look for evidence, to debate ideas, not to blindly fall into an ideology.

I am worried about this blind faith in trans and LGBT+. I believe in the Lesbian, Gay and Bi sexualities but the rest is personalities or gender woo woo.

She is very like me at that age wears so called boy clothes etc. I have been very clear that it doesn't matter what DD or my DS wears from any department. Clothes, haircuts mean nothing to me, as a 70's kid.

I don't want her to be sucked into gendering and lose the ability to debate and research the evidence and looking for the science and reality of the subject.

I will start to take her to any womens right march's locally and of course find the best family friendly pride event to attend as well.

How do I help her keep her mind working?

Ps. I said I didn't care if she brought a woman or a man home to meet us in the future but I would struggle not to lol if they quote a genderism label at me. (A joke, I will of course be very welcoming to any new member of our family)

Unfortunately these days Pride is not an appropriate environment for a 10 year old child.
Used to be the worst thing you saw was a bare bum in chaps but now there are all sorts of things I wouldn’t want my kids to see

Your DD sounds fiercely intelligent - takes after her mother.

My DD is aware of all these labels from tik tok I think, but seems more interested in arguing on roblocks at the moment. Many of her friends are caught up in this and declaring themselves all sorts at the moment. Hating JKR is a given :(

I think you're doing a really good job - you can't beat the open-ness you two seem to have - she sounds really happy to chat with you - and you sounds like someone who is happy to really listen to her - AND know when to speak up and challenge her ideas. That sounds fantastic to me.

Re. Pride, I'd maybe just say, 'too young' - when you're 13 you can go with your friends.

You are reassuring me that my first instincts are right.

Be reassuring but wary. Pick my battles (probably with the school!), yet don't roll over. As I am her parent, not her friend!

We are out today on a family day out to a local country park. Where the worst we should see is a bare ducks bum on the lake!

But I will read this thread later this evening.

On a lighter note : if you identify as a suitcase, think of all the exotic labels 🏷 you could have. And you get to change them too.

Helmetbymidnight Thank you for the compliments. We have our moments on both sides but the gender woo, does not stand up to facts, so bring on the sunlight.

@Abhannmor

On a lighter note : if you identify as a suitcase, think of all the exotic labels 🏷 you could have. And you get to change them too.

Lol, love it

I've been to Brighton pride a few times and it's great fun, lots of kids (it was 15 years ago I went) and lots of families enjoying pride and the beach and attractions.

it was 15 years ago I went

15 years ago, the idea that a male could be a lesbian would have been dismissed as offensive. Now it’s the main message.

Id say it's perfectly fine provided you do your research & check out which event is most family friendly. The prude March itself is fine.

We took our own DD to pride since she was tiny. The parade & main park event here were fine for kids, just lists of good music, food & dancing with most people dressed up in fabulous costumes. She loved to dress up for it & join in the dancing etc & we always found it very safe. Our local street party was another matter though, that could get a bit much with kids in tow, way more than just well toned men in skimpy leather. So do be careful to go to the right event.

DD is now 18 & though "cis hetro" she is extremely accepting & very militant in protection of her non hetro etc friends

Sounds like you have a great relationship with your daughter. Lucky girl.

If it's any help in enabling you to feel more confident about your opinion, I and my partner are older lesbians and we agree with you. I was on the early Pride marches in London when we were literally second class citizens without many of the rights straight people enjoyed. We marched for our human rights. I haven't been to any Pride event for years because it's so male-orientated (it always was) and I became increasingly concerned by the commercialism, the drink and drugs and the kink.

We occasionally encounter a gay man who is on the committee of our local Pride. He makes fun of what he calls 'trannys' in private but in public he's a full-on TRA because a) he'd be crucified if he didn't say the right things and b) because trans is where the money is. Pride is an empty, bare-buttocked travesty of the original movement. You've read the situation correctly. I'd set the age limit at 16!

Keep talking. But not lecturing -i found with my DD that talking about this alongside other topics made more sense. Freedom of opinions, thought, boundaries, etc how to live alongside people with different views and beliefs, looking beyond headlines and memes and actually thinking a bit harder.
Lots of kids embrace the whole flags and pride stuff. Some will be gay, others are still figuring themselves out.
I think a family event for Pride would be fine but it is fundamentally about adult sexuality and it's not all suitable for kids. I'd avoid the big events (which are usually ticketed now anyway) but maybe something a bit more low key?
I'm not gay but ended up accidentally in an event which was for younger adults (with DD and some of her friends) and it was lovely.

Personally I doubt any kids under 15yo has any understanding of sexuality and they are far too young to bother about this type of labelling.

A survey of LGB adults showed that the average age they realised they weren't straight was 12.

Of course plenty of people don't completely know their sexuality at that age, but do you really think that no younger teens do? By that age I was certainly having crushes on other girls, and feeling the 'odd one out' compared to my friends who had boyfriends or fancied boys.

If going to pride is just something she's mentioned and will forget, just forget about taking her. But if Pride is something she's pushing and you're too negative about it, I'd worry whether she'd be comfortable telling you if, in a few years time, she did realise she liked girls.

@Helmetbymidnight

Your DD sounds fiercely intelligent - takes after her mother.

My DD is aware of all these labels from tik tok I think, but seems more interested in arguing on roblocks at the moment. Many of her friends are caught up in this and declaring themselves all sorts at the moment. Hating JKR is a given :(

I think you're doing a really good job - you can't beat the open-ness you two seem to have - she sounds really happy to chat with you - and you sounds like someone who is happy to really listen to her - AND know when to speak up and challenge her ideas. That sounds fantastic to me.

Re. Pride, I'd maybe just say, 'too young' - when you're 13 you can go with your friends.

The problem with youngsters declaring themselves a specific 'identity' (with little flags and all that) on social media is that in the current climate they box themselves into a corner. They'll first be love-bombed with a shower of hearts and new followers, but to then grow, move on, change will invoke a torrent of abuse as an apostate. That's a lot of stress for a teenager to cope with at a vulnerable age.

@Iluvfriends

At 10 years old my dc were only interested in playing out with friends. What the hell is happening to kids these days. Pride is not a family event , I as an adult am uncomfortable with what pride has become and wont be attending another.

Tik tok is what's happening

The problem with youngsters declaring themselves a specific 'identity' (with little flags and all that) on social media is that in the current climate they box themselves into a corner. They'll first be love-bombed with a shower of hearts and new followers, but to then grow, move on, change will invoke a torrent of abuse as an apostate. That's a lot of stress for a teenager to cope with at a vulnerable age

Yy

Its not that they can't know ever. More that we are encouraging kids right now to pick a label. It's not even enough to just pick the label they have to prove it somehow to.

What's wrong with just letting kids have the time and space without all the attention and drama around it all.

As I said I wasn't interested in boys or girls in my teens. I.wasnt a sexual or a romantic or whatever Box I'd have to pick.now.i just hadn't met anyone I wanted to spend 5 mins with let alone a date. And they all hated me too.

And guven the massive bullying problem.in schools I really resent the fact that they only seen ti give a shit what happens to your kid if it onterfers with their outward appearances of "inclusion" of the lgbt.

That alone is reason enough to potentially push someone to label themselves just so someone gives a crap about them.for 5 mins.

Deal with any bullying. Make sure they know its ok to be gay/straight etc but these labels they are pushed to assign themselves now ...its too much. Leave them alone for 5 mins to figure stuff out.

whatwouldscullydo totally agree. I was 18 and at uni before I found anyone interesting enough to date. At school I generally detested the boys but not romatically interested in girls either.

I'm really surprised by this, I went from 11 onwards and we always took children in my family. There's nothing overtly sexual at the ones I've attended unless they go reading the sex ed leaflets but most children aren't interested in speaking to the people running info stalls.
The kids love it. There are rides, face painting and bouncy castles. Plus a stage with singers and dance groups that were all family friendly.

I find this quite sad. 10 years old is still so young. Childhood is being eroded faster and faster.

I took my kids then very much under 10 to Pride in 2019. The one around here is tomorrow and not really 'overtly sexual'. (And yes, I have been to a range) Outside of London, outside of a march they don't seem to be full of leather clad folks or anything like that. We got our faces painted, went on the bouncy castle, danced to the music (which included drag Queens) and got a balloon from the Police. Perhaps we are near to each OP?

She's 10. You think she's too young and I agree. I don't think some of the behaviour at pride is appropriate for adults, let alone a child.

Say no and get some Lego out.

I've been to multiple prides in the last few years and would have been happy to take kids to all of them. I never recognise the horrified sexualised descriptions that people give here.
Smaller prides tend to be the most family friendly

If you think she's too young; which is of course very possible, just say no 🤷🏼‍♀️

I would not take my 10 year old to Pride. I don't even go myself. I don't feel like Pride is an event for anyone else but the LGBT community. The parades are totally inappropriate for children and even too camp for me, an adult. It's a ridiculous event all around, in my book. There are other ways of teaching kids about sexuality and equality than to take them to Pride.

I like this forum. Many of the threads are really informative and have made me think about things from angles I would not have previously. But some of the replies on this thread are exactly why this forum gets so utterly dismissed by the woke. Some of the replies here are, frankly, hysterical and do edge a little on homophobia, tbh.

Calling Pride in and of itself a ridiculous event, calling it vile and disgusting! That's honestly not ok. There is no doubt that there are Pride events that are in no way suitable for children. Occasionally this stuff happens in the middle of the day where children would be expected to be and are occasionally even encouraged to be. But that is what the problem is. Not Pride in and of itself. And there are many, many, many Pride events all over the country that are very, very suitable for children. That are designed to be genuinely family friendly. And while yes sometimes as a very straight presenting person/family I have worried about pushing myself into an event that isn't mine, many Pride events specifically invite straight families, so that our children can grow up knowing that homosexuality and bisexuality is normal even if they are in the minority. I don't want my child to ever worry for one second about whether or not my feelings for him would be changed if he is gay/bi. I don't want his feelings for his friends to ever change based on their sexualities. Celebrating that diversity in a setting that is promoting love and fun is a good thing.

Pride isn't suitable for children, I would go so far to say it should be 18+ only. It is a highly sexualised display under the guise of being 'inclusive' and 'diverse' and a 'fun day out'.

I enquired about one pride and what constituted being "family friendly" and I was told by several official sources, that it meant there was no nudity. Pup play fetishists attended and yes, they were fully clothed, with faces covered with pup play masks and butt plus tails. Another pride has seen the same and they had their own tent, with children's toys, a ball pit and actual dogs. I can't imagine why .

Children (and adults) are attracted by bright colours, rainbows and glitter. Bouncy castles and a village fair type atmosphere are all part of the veneer.

Pride is an exercise in corporate competition, who can be the most woke, who can be the most 'inclusive' and have the biggest corporate logo recoloured with rainbow colours, buying their way in, making themselves popular to what used to be called the Pink Pound. Somewhere between this and various internal rows about BLM and other disputes and ideological positions it has completely lost its way. Many gay men and lesbians reject pride parades, for themselves and their children and I'm not surprised.

If she goes there is no way you can predict or control what she will see and be exposed to.