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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

A Green Party leader to 'welcome politically homeless women'

281 replies

GreenGretel · 18/08/2021 11:20

A candidate in the Green Party election contest wants to welcome back women who have been left politically homeless by the assault on sex-based rights.

I'd urge any Green-minded people to join or re-join the party by 27th Aug in order to vote for Shahrar Ali. You can join (if only temporarily) for as little as £13 here: join.greenparty.org.uk/

Shahrar Ali stands a good chance of winning, having previously been deputy leader and gaining 24% of first-preference votes in 2020. He is speaking up unequivocally for women's sex-based rights. You can read his full statement on Facebook here: www.facebook.com/ShahrarAliGreenParty/posts/190051301345352.

He is also in the Guardian here: www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/aug/17/green-transgender-rights-row-leadership-shahrar-ali-sian-berry

If Shahrar wins, he will be the first leader of a British political party willing to stand up to gender identity ideology.

A Green Party leader to 'welcome politically homeless women'
OP posts:
MidCenturyClegs · 24/08/2021 11:22

@NiceGerbil

Not for me. It's good someone is bucking the trend but

Greens have no real power..CL was their only MP? Not sure if they have any now.

Handling of challenor.

Many statements from key greens TWAW.

Doubt will get in.

Their policies around 'sex work' are abysmal. Started s thread a little while ago.

What about the sodding environment?

I've been a paid up member in the past. Labour too.

Not getting my cash. Sorry.

CL is still the Green's only MP. Not sure where you live but most ppl in the U.K. know this.

It dismays me to hear that women will not give thought to joining a party where there is a chance of having a leader who will support women's rights. It's taken a lot of effort from women and allied men to get this far, yet we are brought down with a sneer.

It was Shahrar who raised the safeguarding bell with AC. And Shahrar's 'Stonewall disaffiliation motion' has just been published as being the first in the agenda for upcoming conference.

If we say the Greens have no chance so why bother then it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. It's saddening that women are giving up on their own.

GreenGretel · 24/08/2021 12:56

Here's some excerpts from last night's hustings:
"This party has become hostile to women who want to talk about same-sex spaces"
"There is nothing transphobic about talking about the protected characteristic of sex in the Equality Act"
More at: twitter.com/sion___jones/status/1429866076834254851

OP posts:
ArabellaScott · 24/08/2021 21:56

Good to hear, Gretel.

LangClegsInSpace · 24/08/2021 23:25

The recording of yesterday's hustings is up on the member's site for those who missed it.

members.greenparty.org.uk/your-vote-counts/internal-elections-2021/leadership

LangClegsInSpace · 25/08/2021 00:48

The question they were asked is:

What do you believe to be the best strategy to tackle antisemitism, transphobia, and any other forms of discrimination in the party?

Very rough summary of those parts of their answers that had to do with 'transphobia' -

TO: need accountability to shut down transphobic hate speech, get people educated. Our campaign has reached out to LGBTQIA+ community, that's why people are flooding into the party, need to make sure we don't have transphobia locking those people out. Need to be prepared to listen & change. Consult liberation groups weekly to be better spokespeople for them and amplify their struggles

MH: Issue has polarised groups in the party threatening party unity, need to find strategies to deal with it. Not sure transphobia is a particular problem within the party, very few would say they couldn't tolerate trans. Two sides that are essentially shouting at each other. Aware of how much time the disciplinary committee has had to deal with it. Need to deal with it, not sweep it under the carpet, not leave the shouting going on, not take sides. Have a member's assembly, bring people together, random group selected, experts from both sides. Reach a position of balance on how we interpret implications of the statement in our policy - TMAM, TWAW, because implications are complex.

SA: Beg to differ with Martin's portrayal / caricature - too convenient to say people in a slanging match. I find women, while they may be vocal and are being oppressed in their right to speak their minds, are generally extremely polite. Whereas opposition, a vocal minority who are extremely nasty. I've survived many complaints, how I survived is the winning strategy - we speak our minds maturely, moderated by all means, and we speak truth. Need to define terms carefully & closely. Need to recognise that sometimes allegations are used as weapons to avoid difficult conversations & negotiations around balance which needs to be struck, e.g. making changes to women's same sex spaces. Unthinkable that Andy Whiteman had to resign because he had to betray his conscience. He was bullied by the party, according to his report, because he couldn't vote for amendment that would allow rape victims to choose to be examined by person of the same sex. I regard that as a basic dignity. Elect a leader who hasn't been sitting on the fence or keeping quiet. I'm not going to stand by when people in politics receiving death threats like JKR. You want a leader who's going to speak mind truthfully.

AG: Large proportion of transphobia borne of ignorance It's often governments around the world that cause this kind of problem, and so too it is with transphobia. People are afraid of things they don't understand, it's all about education. People need to be told, or informed and have discussions about what it is they're opposing and why, and speak their minds so we can understand where they're coming from, and so they too can understand the reasons why what they're doing is not in the best interests, not only of the people they're abusing, but themselves in the long term.

CD: Need to take clear, consistent line in support of trans rights internally and externally. That includes acknowledging that UK is in grip of a bitter so-called culture war over trans rights, green party sadly not immune. Not going to be fixed overnight. Things we can do to make party more welcoming & inclusive - create spaces where people can learn and engage. Support the party's liberation & policy groups to facilitate workshops & training to help members understand each other, party policy, our shared mission. Jewish greens have modelled this - virtual roadshows touring to local parties. Carefully facilitated space where there's no such thing as a stupid question. More traing and conversations to allow people to learn & share lived experiences & relate on a human level. Sometimes learning & discussion not enough, we have to be clear abuse, harassment, hate speech have no place in our movement. Need to properly resource disciplinary committee so eveyone has confidence in process. End long delays in decision making, provide adequate traing & resources for volunteers on that committee.

NiceGerbil · 25/08/2021 01:54

There's a problem with anti-Semitism in the greens?

Fucking hell I didn't know that.

Well that's another massive reason it's a no from me.

Jewish people having to do roadshows to persuade people that they aren't .

Fucks sake.

NiceGerbil · 25/08/2021 01:56

'GREEN PARTY
Our analysis of antisemitic discourse amongst Green Party office holders indicates that they seem to have little or no consciousness of the nature of post-Holocaust antisemitism, so that even parliamentary candidates repeat bizarre antisemitic myths without inhibition, and support prominent antisemites in other parties. despite attempts by its leadership to ensure that the Green Party adopts the International Definition of Antisemitism, those attempts have repeatedly failed amidst fierce opposition at all levels.'

WTAF?!

I mean. Labour didn't tackle it. I don't know why I'm surprised. But I am.

NiceGerbil · 25/08/2021 02:39

And how the hell did they analyse this discourse?

It's that open they just had it all written down? Did they go through records or...?

Parliamentary candidates openly saying anti-Semitic stuff?

They were booted out I assume?!

NiceGerbil · 25/08/2021 02:41

Oops it's not the green site it's an anti-Semitism org.

So some of what I said is irrelevant!

WarriorN · 25/08/2021 07:51

Those who've recently joined, please read and consider voting as here:

Green Party Elections - Candidates who know what sex is www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4302663-Green-Party-Elections-Candidates-who-know-what-sex-is

LangClegsInSpace · 25/08/2021 08:31

I don't know how much of a problem antisemitism is within the greens.

A lot of the discussion in the hustings was about whether to adopt the IHRA working definition -

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Working_Definition_of_Antisemitism

LangClegsInSpace · 25/08/2021 08:33

Just to note, Warrior, to vote in that election you need to have joined by 27 July (think that was the cut off date)

ArabellaScott · 25/08/2021 08:46

Thanks, Lang, will watch later.

WarriorN · 25/08/2021 10:02

@LangClegsInSpace

Just to note, Warrior, to vote in that election you need to have joined by 27 July (think that was the cut off date)
Ah gotcha. I missed that sorry
WarriorN · 25/08/2021 10:03

[quote LangClegsInSpace]I don't know how much of a problem antisemitism is within the greens.

A lot of the discussion in the hustings was about whether to adopt the IHRA working definition -

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Working_Definition_of_Antisemitism[/quote]
SA was smeared as far as I can tell and nothing came of it.

Babdoc · 25/08/2021 10:10

How can any Green candidate be regarded as GC, when the Greens have gone into coalition with the SNP, fully supporting their determination to push through their gender recognition act, destroying women’s rights to single sex spaces?

inigomontoyahwillcox · 25/08/2021 10:38

@Babdoc

How can any Green candidate be regarded as GC, when the Greens have gone into coalition with the SNP, fully supporting their determination to push through their gender recognition act, destroying women’s rights to single sex spaces?
The Scottish Greens and the Green Party are separate parties.
Waitwhat23 · 25/08/2021 12:05

@LangClegsInSpace

Just to note, Warrior, to vote in that election you need to have joined by 27 July (think that was the cut off date)
I think it's 27th August.
EmpressWitchDoesntBurn · 25/08/2021 13:10

I heard 27th August too.

GreenGretel · 25/08/2021 13:38

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Babdoc · 25/08/2021 13:52

Ah, I see. Here in Scotland they are referred to as “the Greens”, not “the Scottish Greens”, so I assumed they were linked.
Maybe your English Greens can be extricated from the gender crap, but I fear up here they’re a lost cause!

ArabellaScott · 25/08/2021 14:18

27th of August is deadline to join, best get in soon if you're planning to do so.

WeAreTheWomen · 25/08/2021 14:54

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

LangClegsInSpace · 25/08/2021 15:09

There are three elections:

You need to have joined by 27 August to vote in the leadership election. Voting runs from 2 - 23 September.

The other thread is discussing the election for six positions on the executive committee. I just looked it up and you need to have joined by 31 July to vote in that one. Voting runs from 2 - 31 August, so if you joined in time, you don't have long left to vote!

There is also an election for the policy development committee with the same timetable as the executive committee election.

Hope that makes sense Confused

OldTurtleNewShell · 25/08/2021 15:21

Up to 3000 new members now. According to their website, there are 52000 members (although I don't know if those 3000 are included in that). That's quite a big increase.

A Green Party leader to 'welcome politically homeless women'
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