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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

#AskRapeCrisisScotland

358 replies

MaudTheInvincible · 10/08/2021 19:17

Is trending at number 1 in the UK at present. I haven't been around all day so I'm not sure what this has happened in response to and came here to find out, but there aren't any threads. Heart breaking reading these stories and the effects on rape victims who can't access support services because they've been excluded by male-centring policy.

OP posts:
Bosky · 11/08/2021 15:44

Letter to Newspapers about Edinburgh Rape Crisis Centre.

Background:
forwomen.scot/10/08/2021/the-real-crisis-at-rape-crisis-scotland/

You need to DM @/MaryHowden on Twitter if you want her to add your signature to this Letter to the newspapers about Edinburgh Rape Crisis Centre.
twitter.com/MaryHowden

If Mary is not following you, you cannot DM her so you need to Follow her and tweet to her asking her to Follow you - then you will be able to DM her:

Screenshots of the Letter are in these tweets by @/shirleysascott on Twitter:
twitter.com/shirleysascot/status/1425330162804068354

Doyoumind · 11/08/2021 15:48

@beastlyslumber

Sorry, haven't RTFT, but what's really awful is seeing TRA tweets about how women are trying to close down rape crisis because we don't want transwomen to receive services?????

Is this deliberate, this LIE about what's actually being said? It doesn't matter if it's deliberately evil or just brainwashed stupidity, I suppose. The effect is the same.

Mhairi Hunter is trending for accusing GCs of saying TW shouldn't receive support for sexual assault. No one is saying that. Absolutely no one and least of all GC feminists. Of course there should be adequate provision. There should also be adequate provision of female only services for females who require that.
Jorrris · 11/08/2021 15:50

They're such bloody liars aren't they. This is their tactic for getting people onside. By lying to them. Because no one in their right mind would support this insanity otherwise.

Selkiesarereal · 11/08/2021 15:51

@BuffysBigSister thanks for this - someone kindly pm’d me with this info.

Sadly can’t make the demo because of work but going to create a new Twitter account that is not linked to my children’s school and my job and check out those sites.

littlbrowndog · 11/08/2021 16:03

Scotland my country. 🤕🤕🤦‍♀️😢

#AskRapeCrisisScotland
littlbrowndog · 11/08/2021 16:05

#AskRapeCrisisScotland was trending at 24k. A minute ago. Then disappeared 🤷‍♀️

Beefcurtains79 · 11/08/2021 16:11

Twitter appear to be trying to bury the hashtag.

CharlieParley · 11/08/2021 16:17

Dear lurkermom I am glad you recognise the problems with what MW said. I'd like to clarify a few things though about the rest of your comment.

That being said - some of the comments on here citing MAN and ridiculing pictures of this human. Well to be honest . I’m shocked at this. Why ? Doesn’t really make you any better to be so cruel and SO vindictive.

I am not a believer in the doctrine of gender identity. I am an atheist. Just as I do not espouse any other religious beliefs, I won't espouse this one. So when I use the word "man", I use it correctly as a sex designator word for adult human males, just like "stallion" or "bull" are sex designator words for adult male animals.

Believers in the doctrine of gender identity posit that the word "man" is not a sex designator word, but a personality designator - a man is a person who manifests preferences for masculine-coded clothes or activities or jobs or behaviours.

So to recap,

Believers in the doctrine of gender identity say
A man is a person who has a particular personality and can be male or female.

Everyone else says:
A man is a person who is male and can have any type of personality.

Now I respect the right of those believers to do so. And to say so publicly. In return, I expect to be shown the same respect in not being forced to use (or avoid using) the word "man" as if I too believed it referred to personality and not sex. It is neither an act of bullying nor is it cruel or vindictive for me to refuse to espouse the views of believers in a faith I do not share. This is as true for the doctrine of gender identity as it is for Catholicism, Buddhism or Paganism.

On the Guilty Feminist thread, I posted this about MW:

I've met MW at an event in the Scottish Parliament. I'm hypervigilant, so I read MW as male both in person and on video. There's simply no way I would have been able to disclose to MW even without knowing all of this. I carried so much shame and guilt that I knew no man could comprehend and I needed to talk to a female counsellor.

That's not a judgement on MW's appearance nor an expression of ridicule. It is a simple statement of fact. I read the sex of this person as male. I cannot therefore reach a state from which recovery from the trauma of male violence is possible in their presence.

This is my truth.

According to decades of research into female victims of male violence as well as many frontline workers and a number of surveys of female victims of male violence, this is the truth for 99% of us - we need a female-only therapeutic environment to recover from the trauma caused by male violence.

It is neither an act of bullying nor is it cruel or vindictive for women like me to express our anger, however raw and uncensored, at being condemned because our involuntary trauma responses to the presence of males also happen in the presence of males who identify otherwise. And to be threatened with re-education that is nothing more than brainwashing in aid of an ideology that has no place in counselling.

It is an act of self-care and self-love for a female survivor to express her need for a female-only service. Especially in the face of MW's words. And it is an act of compassion and love for others to defend my right to express my needs and to have those needs met.

It is an act of bullying and unspeakably cruel to deny us the help we need.

Cruelty is never a helpful Way forward . Have we not Learned this?

What I have learned in the four years I've been active on this issue is that appeasement is never a helpful way forward when male desires are conflicting with female needs. And that it is cruel to female victims not to stand up to those demanding that we acquiesce to male desires out of the kindness of our hearts.

It's not kindness when it harms others. And what you are exhorting us to do, to give in to believers of the doctrine of gender identity in order to be kind to them is harmful to us.

ArabellaScott · 11/08/2021 16:18

For anyone asking what to do. Writing to your elected representatives is effective.

www.writetothem.com/

MP, MSPs, councillors, etc.

It doesn't need to be long, or full of information. Let them know that women's rights are under threat and that you are concerned. Direct them to forwomen.scot.

TabbyStar · 11/08/2021 16:23

Does anyone have a Sharetoken for todays article in the Times (Wed 11th)

I just looked but there's no share token option on that story.

Theunamedcat · 11/08/2021 16:32

@littlbrowndog

#AskRapeCrisisScotland was trending at 24k. A minute ago. Then disappeared 🤷‍♀️
Its buried now they are doubling down on the mean women stance
CharlieParley · 11/08/2021 16:35

To be fair, I don't believe there's any current prospect of that happening in Scotland - I've not seen any evidence that they currently have males actually providing services while claiming to be women.

MW has been providing services to female survivors for years, both on the national helpline and F2F. MW is also advocating for more male transgender people to join VAWAG sector organisations.

And Glasgow Rape Crisis refused to guarantee a female counsellor to a raped child as far back as 2014. Told the mother to go somewhere else for help if that's what the child needed.

Most of these stories we don't know about because the cost to survivors to share these things is too high. But it's happening.

beastlyslumber · 11/08/2021 16:38

And Glasgow Rape Crisis refused to guarantee a female counsellor to a raped child as far back as 2014. Told the mother to go somewhere else for help if that's what the child needed.

I saw someone commented about that under the times article. It's just so awful, I don't know what to say.

Women set up these services and now men are taking them away from us and calling us names when we protest. It's intolerable.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 11/08/2021 16:40

I just looked but there's no share token option on that story.

That's a shame, I would love to read the comments.

beastlyslumber · 11/08/2021 16:43

Good article by Brendan O'Neill on this - www.spiked-online.com/2021/08/11/now-even-rape-victims-are-being-called-bigots/

Gets many of the key points across clearly.

ArabellaScott · 11/08/2021 17:11

@Ereshkigalangcleg

I just looked but there's no share token option on that story.

That's a shame, I would love to read the comments.

Comments are 100% in women's favour. And - they do not seem to be constrained by rules about being naice.
ColourMagic · 11/08/2021 17:12

@Ereshkigalangcleg

I just looked but there's no share token option on that story.

That's a shame, I would love to read the comments.

It is possible to register with The Times - then you can read 2 articles a week for free, and read all the Comments and Comment yourself if you want to. It is also then possible to read all the comments on all Times articles, even if you have used up your 2 free articles a week.

So between reading articles via Sharetoken links, reading the archived articles, and registering, it's possible to have quite good access to The Times even if (like me) you can't afford to subscribe.
.

Datun · 11/08/2021 17:27

I feel it’s fair to ask what possible motivation a person could have for wanting to be able to carry out an intimate medical examination on a patient against their will anyway.

And the distance on a woman who has just been violated, ffs.

It's sick.

Datun · 11/08/2021 17:27

*in this instance

midgemagneto · 11/08/2021 17:38

There's an AIBU thread with a link to an archived version of the times article

ColourMagic · 11/08/2021 17:53

[quote TabbyStar]Archive version from Twitter <a class="break-all" href="https://archive.is/2021.08.11-114849/www.thetimes.co.uk/article/bigoted-people-may-be-challenged-comments-by-trans-head-of-edinburgh-rape-crisis-sparks-controversy-xdcpfr0cv#selection-847.0-847.230" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">archive.is/2021.08.11-114849/www.thetimes.co.uk/article/bigoted-people-may-be-challenged-comments-by-trans-head-of-edinburgh-rape-crisis-sparks-controversy-xdcpfr0cv#selection-847.0-847.230[/quote]
TabbyStar posted the link to the archived version of the Times article

Ereshkigalangcleg · 11/08/2021 17:57

Thanks Colourmagic

Grammarnut · 11/08/2021 20:29

Loobyloo, Those words are not compassionate. A woman who has been raped needs help, not being told she is bigoted because she wants to talk to a woman - someone born with a vulva - not a transwoman, who cannot know what her experience means and is a man. To demand she does is so bigoted and misogynist I cannot believe anyone thinks it is ok to say it. It's not ok.

beastlyslumber · 11/08/2021 20:47

Hi, sorry, is the AIBU thread about this still up? I got notifications but when I click on them it takes me to the AIBU posts home and not to the thread??