Will Hubbard make people think?

[InspiralCoalescenceRingdown]

I'm not so sure. Certainly doesn't seem to be the case with DW or MIL. I knew DW was Be Kind, but didn't expect my MIL to support males in women's sports.

No. They don't think. Thinking is risky. Thinking leads to wrongthink.

I just find it hard to be the only GC person I know in real life, I guess.

I'm not going to say up is down for anyone, but humans are social animals.

@InspiralCoalescenceRingdown

I'm not so sure. Certainly doesn't seem to be the case with DW or MIL. I knew DW was Be Kind, but didn't expect my MIL to support males in women's sports.

She might not support males in women's sport, but the problem is that lots of people don't define Hubbard as male.

I think the issue is more that it is such a big leap to support this that its hard to backtrack or recant (especially if they are the type of person that doesn't like to be seen to be wrong).

Try to give people a way out without losing face. For example you can say 'I think this is one situation where its fairer/safer to return to the old rules.'

Yes, I think the situation has made some people think, not those who are entrenched in a TWAW view, but some of those who hadn't taken much notice or who had assumed that all transwomen had surgery. Also lobbyists have been caught on the back foot for the moment, although they won't be there for long, especially now that Hubbard hasn't got through. I really think we need to seize this moment (although I'm not entirely sure how....)

I agree that people need room to find a way back without losing face.

The trouble is Hubbard's performance won't really get rid of anyone's confirmation bias.

I'm fastidiously avoiding any debate on the topic today, but I definitely agree with PP that we need to burnish the golden bridges.

I can shrug it off online, but I find it difficult to handle "You're a bigot because you don't think the earth is flat" in real life.

No. People are already saying "See, TW are no threat to woman's sports". This will open the gates to more TW competing unless the IOC decide that maybe fairness should trump inclusivity.

People are already saying "See, TW are no threat to woman's sports".

Yes, that is my concern too. I'm relieved that LH wont be taking a medal from a deserving woman (though I still feel for all the young women unfairly pushed down the rankings).

But we have to keep reminding people that LH is middle-aged, decades older than the female competitors. In other sports, younger and fitter transwomen have been winning women's prizes for years, and will continue to do so.

I think the IOC knows things will quickly get out of hand and the next Olympics could be e.g. Men's Rowing Final and ooh another Men's rowing final.

Lets hope they see where the madness is heading

No, but information about how low the barriers to male participation in female sporting competitions might make people think. Most people still assume transwomen are obliged to have had surgery and hormone treatment and to be "living as a woman". Many think that changing biological sex is actually possible. That's what we're up against.

@Mrsjamin

The trouble is Hubbard's performance won't really get rid of anyone's confirmation bias.

That's a fear of mine too. In fact I'm suspicious that that was the plan all along. Hubbard appears badly out of condition to me.

If Fallon Fox didn't make people think, they are too far down the rabbit hole to see sense.

No. This isn't going to help. Facts are facts, you can't change sex.

@Thelnebriati

If Fallon Fox didn't make people think, they are too far down the rabbit hole to see sense.

THIS x 1000

If you can smash in a woman's skull and boast about it, yet still appear on the BBC then the men in charge either aren't listening or are enjoying causing further trauma to biological women.

I think there should be an enforced wife swap, where their biological female wives are swapped with transwomen for the foreseeable.

LH is a stalking horse.

There to cause the stir and then 'prove' that males who reduce their testosterone don't have an advantage over women.

Nothing to lose, well connected millionaire family.

Next Olympics, 1/4 males will be competing against women. In 20 years, there will be no more female sport

I have always said that the MNetters who thought that LH competing would make the scales fall from everyone's eyes were being wildly optimistic. OTOH, it will have woken some people up. It helps that LH is so obviously XY.

I'm hoping that there's a double bluff going on and NZ have sent an unathletic middle aged bloke into the women's competition on purpose to raise awareness of how ludicrous the current regulations are, create a public outcry, and prompt the IOC and the various other sporting bodies to impose a total ban on male athletes in women's competitions.

The borg sent in LH, (so conveniently just before the IOC are due to change the rules), to throw the competition, smirk, do a head tilt and make a heart. So that the IOC can 'look for the sweetspot' (their words) instead of returning female sports to female.

It was all planned and orchestrated and the BBC are in cahoots. I have just watched the BBC world news and the toadying is creepy.

What did I miss?

Why am I so slow...ggggrrr