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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Helen Webberley

978 replies

Signalbox · 05/07/2021 11:59

Looks like Helem Webberley's substantive case has finally been listed for 26th July 2021

www.mpts-uk.org/hearings-and-decisions/medical-practitioners-tribunals/dr-helen-webberley-jul-21

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Thread gallery
43
Datun · 31/07/2021 16:58

Nefelibata33

Transwomen are men. Biological, adult human males.

There is zero evidence, anywhere, that says they do not follow the same crime patterns as men who don't identify as women.

In fact they are massively over represented as sex offenders in prison.

No one is blindly believing made up shit in the newspapers. In fact, many newspapers get their information from here.

FairPlay for Women, and Keep Prisons Single Sex have submitted FOI requests, to the MOJ, demanding the information, that is then reported in the newspapers.

You are ill informed about what constitutes evidence. It is not newspaper reporting.

Perhaps you are unaware of all the court cases, at the moment.

Eg, the Tavistock in prescribing puberty blockers, Sonia Appleby their safeguarding lead being ignored and the female prisoner who was assaulted by a transwomen and inmate trying to get the MOJ rules changed.

The women here have been aware of Helen Webberley for years.

titchy · 31/07/2021 17:00

@Nefelibata33

Hi, what is goady? Have I missed something? But thanks for being generally reasonable, I get so much sh*t off people. Seems like this place is just an incredible hate factory. I just wanted to appeal to people to have heart, that's all
Just click the 'new thread' button Smile
Datun · 31/07/2021 17:01

@FloralBunting

Seriously everyone let's try and keep this one on topic. Weeks more of this tribunal to go, and Nefelibata has been invited to start another thread.
Yes you're right, of course.
titchy · 31/07/2021 17:01

Cool @Nefelibata33 Just to add, this is a UK site, and it's late afternoon here. I'm sure we'll have good nights later though Wink

RedDogsBeg · 31/07/2021 17:01

Nefelibatta33 : If you want to talk about Helen Webberley fine, but I think I'm fighting a losing battle on this website. But give me your views, if you want

Yes we do want to talk about Helen Webberley and the GMC tribunal she is facing hence the title of this thread.

If you genuinely want a discussion on what you have posted, start a new thread and I will happily contribute to the discussion.

Tibtom · 31/07/2021 18:02

Is there a type of drug doctors aren't allowed to dish out? Yes, oestrogen or testosterone.

Both oestrogen and testosterone are in the BNF and are regularly prescribed

Theeyeballsinthesky · 31/07/2021 18:10

Yep! I’m taking both at the moment

merrymouse · 31/07/2021 18:58

All the drugs prescribed on this thread are prescribed for various conditions. Doctors aren’t allowed to hand out any drugs or treatments on demand and are supposed to follow procedures, hence this court case, the Keira Bell case and many U.K. court cases where doctors refuse to give particular care that they think will be detrimental against the patient’s/parent’s wishes. Drugs are also restricted through NICE.

CardinalLolzy · 31/07/2021 19:10

I've been taking oestrogen, prescribed by my gp, for years. Has something changed and I'm no longer able to access this? I've not heard anything.
(Unless corrected I'll assume it's false. )

StellaAndCrow · 31/07/2021 22:29

@Tibtom

As ever, so much of it is based on the treatment of transgender males and not girls and women at all.

And GenderGP's advisors and counsellors are also males.

Flipping heck, yes! I hadn't realised this.
rabbitwoman · 31/07/2021 23:26

@charleyparley, that post is so informative and full of facts, resources, evidence..... I hardly know how anyone could read it and come away still thinking that kids should be given these drugs. Also, the quality of the discourse is really high.

On the other hand, counter arguments from other posters - not just on this thread or even this platform - invariably read like a teenage diary or cult leader manifesto. It is quite frightening how one has such influence over policy makers and society in general. One day, I would really like to examine why. But in the meantime.....

..... Its pretty terrifying to read all the support hw has on twitter and more generally. Don't people understand what she has been doing, don't they understand the effects of these drugs?

I know so many of these children, desperate to get their hands on these drugs, trotting out all the usual tropes, and the adults around them, pandering to their aggressive and manipulative rhetoric like they have forgotten who is supposed to be in charge? Who is supposed to be making decisions. I feel like I am in such a minority, trying everything I can to raise awareness - if I am lucky someone will talk louder over me to change the subject. If I am unlucky, friends I have known for decades will call me fascist and block me....

Makes me want to say, okay then, Helen webberly, susie Green, stonewall, all of you, you have got your way. I conceded and withdraw, you go ahead but you put your name to it, very very publicly, so in 5, 10 years time it will be very clear whose fault this is.

And who tried to stop it.

StellaAndCrow · 01/08/2021 01:37

MoreRainThanAnyYet: "Do they reduce hip width and allow greater stature?"

No, puberty blockers block the pubertal growth spurt, and so ensure that girls end up shorter than they would otherwise have been. Since they are given to girls who want to present as boys/men, this is the opposite of the desired result. Which is why I really don't understand the principle behind giving puberty blockers to girls.

R0wantrees · 01/08/2021 07:39

Quillette
Published on July 30, 2021
'Gender Transition and Desistance in Teenage Girls: Two Psychotherapeutic Case Studies'
written by Susan Evans and Marcus Evans
(extract)
"Case presentation # 1: “Bianca”
Bianca was a 25-year-old woman who came for an individual psychotherapy consultation in London, suffering from depression and anxiety. In the initial consultation, the therapist asked Bianca to talk about her history. Bianca said that she had had a mastectomy and hysterectomy when she was 20, after taking puberty blockers aged 16 then cross-sex hormones aged 18. She said she thought the whole thing was a mistake. (continues)

Second consultation
Bianca started by saying that she was very angry after the first meeting. She said that looking back she probably had doubts during the transition process, but the further she got into it, the more reluctant she was to stop and question what she was doing. She said that she just thought she felt so alone and the support of the online group was so important. Where would she belong if they rejected her?

Therapist: You were desperate to feel you belonged somewhere.

Bianca: I think my brother did question what I was doing. However, I dismissed him as being interfering, and the group said that he just did not understand. I have never really felt that I fit in, but I felt I was joining a group that was different from the rest of the world—a group that could see right through “normal” people and their narrow view of how things should be. After about six months, I went back to the clinic, and it was agreed I would start on the cross-sex hormones. When I told the group, they were delighted, saying that I was making great progress. Initially, I felt this surge of excitement. I felt powerful, and that this was the hit I had been looking for. I increased my social transition, as I started to feel like I was changing sex. I began to grow facial hair and gradually my voice got lower. Looking back, I can see that I had doubts, which I hid from everyone, including myself.

Therapist: The doubts would threaten to interfere with the powerful feeling of being in control. (continues)

However, I was still looking like a girl and felt very self-conscious.

This was when I started to think I needed surgery. I began talking about this in my online group. I became convinced that I had to go through the whole thing—having my breasts removed then having the bottom surgery. I started researching and looking into the next steps. I met up with the trans community at organized events, and they were all so supportive and encouraging. I thought I had finally found somewhere I belonged. Once again, I was advised what to say in the interviews [with therapists and doctors]. It was like an exciting game.

Therapist: The group supported your belief that you could remove that unwanted girl." (continues)
quillette.com/2021/07/30/gender-transition-and-desistance-in-teenage-girls-two-psychotherapeutic-case-studies/

Signalbox · 02/08/2021 09:38

Today's twitter link for live tweets...

twitter.com/tribunaltweets/status/1422112462195810309

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Signalbox · 02/08/2021 09:40

Representatives:

For Helen Webberley (HW): Mr Ian Stern, QC (IS).

For the GMC: Mr Simon Jackson, QC (SJ)

Other abbreviations: Patient A (A) & Dr Young (Y) who is Patient A’s GP.

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Signalbox · 02/08/2021 09:41

Thanks to @StoatlyL for tweeting.

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Signalbox · 02/08/2021 09:44

Dr Young (Y), (Patient A’s GP) is expected to give evidence today.

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Redshoeblueshoe · 02/08/2021 13:00

Does anyone know what's happening today ? There hasn't been any tweets for ages

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 02/08/2021 13:24

Glad I've found this thread! Will read through it later, but just making sure I don't lose it again.

Signalbox · 02/08/2021 15:08

@Redshoeblueshoe

Does anyone know what's happening today ? There hasn't been any tweets for ages
The tweeter appears to have released all the tweets at once about an hour ago in relation to Dr Y’s evidence.
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Signalbox · 02/08/2021 15:16

Seems that Pt A (13) was taking testosterone (from HW) against the advice of the Tavi. And Dr Y was somewhat stuck in the middle.

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Signalbox · 02/08/2021 15:20

I think they must be taking notes and then writing up the tweets later on…

”More notes on this am's evidence to follow later today.”

”This afternoon's session with Professor Peter Hindmarch giving evidence is commencing.”

I’ve no idea who Professor Peter Hindmarch is.

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Redshoeblueshoe · 02/08/2021 15:30

Thanks. I just caught up on Twitter

ThinkWittyThoughts · 02/08/2021 17:41

Is there a link for this afternoon's evidence? I've been struggling to follow the Twitter threads 😔

Signalbox · 02/08/2021 17:48

@ThinkWittyThoughts

Is there a link for this afternoon's evidence? I've been struggling to follow the Twitter threads 😔
The afternoon appears to start here...

twitter.com/tribunaltweets/status/1422183741645000712

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Swipe left for the next trending thread