Schoolgirl, 15, ‘stopped from using toilet while on period’

[WinnieSmith]

Schoolgirl, 15, ‘stopped from using toilet while on period’ then put in seclusion

metro.co.uk/2021/05/31/schoolgirl-15-stopped-from-using-toilet-while-on-her-period-14680071/

"...we do ask that students make every effort to do this during break and lunch time to minimise disruption to lessons..."

There is a growing trend (because of staff shortages) to reduce lunch and break times. My daughter says there is simply not enough time as the queues are too long.

I agree with the pp who said if it was their dd they’d just tell them to leave and put up with the punishment.
As a teacher when I’ve flooded I’ve just run to the loo during a lesson (and put up with the humiliation of the head telling me off and giving me a warning for failing to follow safeguarding rules once). Worse things happen all the time.

How would you solve the problem then? We can’t have masses of children walking around unsupervised because it is unsafe, we can’t afford to employ more staff to be on duty so what is the answer?

You limit the toilets that can be used and lock the others. Depending on the size and layout of the school you have one toilet that can be used mid lesson, next the HT office or an admin office.

You could make the toilets to be used the accessible ones so the student has to get a key (from the teacher or the office) and the door automatically locks when they leave.

I've done lots of supply, some schools have doors that can only be opened with an ID card, if you have that system then you can automatically lock toilet doors so people can get out but not in unless they have 'permission' on their ID card.

Most schools have SIMS or some thing similar, so you can track who is going to the toilet every lesson and investigate why.

@Thisisus909
To be honest it was just a cheeky behaviour that many children display. Children are designed to push the boundaries. They are achieving well and are motivated enough few years later so I have no concerns. Who wouldn’t like to have a cheeky break from the lesson or work from time to time? But we obviously can’t most of the time. Children like a group tend to repeat each others’ behaviour, so in no time you’ll see 10 children out of the classroom, hence the policies. Children don’t have to be entertained or highly motivated/over the moon happy every minute of every lesson or every day of their lives. Life is life, sometimes we go through boring or uncomfortable and it’s fine. But obviously mainstream school is not for everyone.

Yep it can be really difficult as a female member of staff too to be honest. When I was full-time I often had to choose between going to the loo or eating as there wouldn't be time for both at break between everything else. There's just no way you can leave during a class no matter what! You have a duty of care.

I've recently started supply teaching and I'm considering not going in for the first 2 days of my period. Time is even shorter when you don't know the school and have to run around finding work etc. and sometimes the staff toilets are locked when i find them and I wouldn't have a key. I'm quite anxious about how I will manage.

It seems to me that poor discipline, presumably because you have an inexperienced SLT in place, is being used as an excuse to humiliate and belittle all females within some of the schools here. Not all pupils are badly behaved, not all schools have problems with extremely bad behaviour. But apparently all girls must suffer as a result of this?!

I understand the viewpoints from teachers, and believe me I know how hostile and disruptive a classroom full of teens can be (a few years ago I looked at the google maps image of my school, found that it dumps you at the back of the school on street view- I thought, “that’s odd”, so I moved the little man to the front of the school- there’s a police car coming out the front of my school on google maps. I thought “yeah that sounds about right”).

There’s obviously no perfect solution and girls will abuse it but at the end of the day I’d rather that than making some poor girl bleed through her uniform because the teacher has decided she’s the wrong sort of student.

Most school days are set up for no longer than 2 hours without break and toilet access. It is unlikely that the majority of students can't manage periods on this timetable. Obviously allowing for students for whom periods are new.

Poor behaviour is an enormous problem in many schools. Again, I think adults today are looking back to their own schooldays and are not aware of how much things have changed.

Personally, I let everyone who asks to go go, although I may ask them to wait until I've finished explaining x or if it's close to the end of the lesson.

However, if the mothers on here could see the impact that disruption and misbehaviour was having on their DD's learning, every lesson, every day, they might actually prefer me to take a different approach.

I think it would be really great for every parent to spend a day shadowing a teacher!

There’s obviously no perfect solution and girls will abuse it but at the end of the day I’d rather that than making some poor girl bleed through her uniform because the teacher has decided she’s the wrong sort of student

We also know that we have big problem with a combination of multiple issues, poverty, poor education , mixed sex toilets etc that result in periods being a massive barrier to education. There are many posters on MN who grew up with having to use toilet paper or having no idea how to manage theor periods. A practice that given the number of projects set up to counteract period poverty and a lack.of education about periods, hasn't got much better. In fact an article published a few years back stated girls lost hundreds of hours of their education a year due to periods.

The very girls who would be benefit from being in school the most are those who would most likely be prevented from attending altogether on their periods.

We have a massive catch 22

I’m pretty sure there are free period products widely available in education settings now. We have a bag of stuff in every student toilet (I suppose in some schools this would have to be kept by staff though).

There is a solution to this. Most girls who have heavy periods will have them regularly. Toilet trips can be recorded in some way (either by individual teachers, centrally though this is harder during COVID, or in some kind of a planner). If it becomes clear there is a pattern of excessive toilet usage in class, then a teacher needs to call home and organise for her parent to sort out a toilet pass. If she gets one, let her go in future. If not, sorry, she will have to sort herself out during breaks.

I’m pretty sure there are free period products widely available in education settings now. We have a bag of stuff in every student toilet (I suppose in some schools this would have to be kept by staff though)

Yes but the girls would have to be in school.to access them.

I know this would never happen, I'd encourage the students to say that unless they go now they will start leaking blood onto the seat, which is a very real possibility with heavy periods. Idiot staff.

If it becomes clear there is a pattern of excessive toilet usage in class, then a teacher needs to call home and organise for her parent to sort out a toilet pass. If she gets one, let her go in future. If not, sorry, she will have to sort herself out during breaks

And what's the baseline ?

Periods can take a few months to settle down when they first start. And it takes on average 7 years to get a dx of endo. So what's this "excessive use" yard stick based on?

Well, every lesson for a month is a bit obvious (and happens quite often).

The mother is right; there is no way a child would end up in seclusion just for asking to go to the toilet. Indeed, if you read the whole article, it says the girl was put in supervision for being disrespectful to staff.

I wonder how much the mother got paid for the story?

A phonecall home will generally be sufficient to know whether the student is taking the piss, doctor’s note or not.

Also, once you get a reputation for calling home about things like this, other students are much less likely to try it on.

To those who support all girls being allowed to leave lessons all the time because it's impossible to manage periods any other way: do you think some careers should be closed off to women gor rhis reason? Because I'm pretty sure jobs like surgeons or bus drivers won't be able ti facilitate sudden downing of tools or pulling over into a layby to accommodate menstrual cycles. And didn't women of the past have to fight for the right to do these jobs, against men who used our periods as one of the reasons why we couldn't do things? Are we really suggesting that women cannot be relied on to perform any role which requires us to be away from a toilet for longer than 50 minutes? Bloody hell, I hope this isn't what 5th wave feminism is going to look like!

I think drs are now also getting or were pre covid getting slammed for notes for schools with regards to non prescribed treatments kids may need or toilet passes after seeing increased rates of utis where girls aren't drinking all day to try and avoid needing the toilet etc

Mess all round

I used to think like that, but having hit perimonopause with fibroids, I definitely could not do a job that required me being away from a toilet for more than fifty minutes. As a school teacher with 50 minute lessons, I cope by bringing a change of clothes with me.

@sharksarecool

To those who support all girls being allowed to leave lessons all the time because it's impossible to manage periods any other way: do you think some careers should be closed off to women gor rhis reason? Because I'm pretty sure jobs like surgeons or bus drivers won't be able ti facilitate sudden downing of tools or pulling over into a layby to accommodate menstrual cycles. And didn't women of the past have to fight for the right to do these jobs, against men who used our periods as one of the reasons why we couldn't do things? Are we really suggesting that women cannot be relied on to perform any role which requires us to be away from a toilet for longer than 50 minutes? Bloody hell, I hope this isn't what 5th wave feminism is going to look like!

No not at all, but its hardly the same thing is it. A 12/ 13 year old in legally obliged school all day whilst getting to grips with menstruation and probably wants to be at home with a hot water bottle, vs a well paid, satisfying career that youve trained for voluntarily and have much better control of your life. Dont kid yourself this is training for anything much more for the arbitrary soul crushing rules of the amazon packing line for a lot of them

I dont support kids being able to just leave lessons when they want unless they specifically need to be able to leave to regulate, but its not easy to get.
Teachers rules and school rules often conflict with childrens actual needs and its hard for them. You cant deny that

Having access to the toilet is a basic human need and right. There is never any justification to reprimanded someone for using the toilet. My child's school locks toilets during the lesson times so no one can use them.