What Would You Do If Your Child/Grand-Child/Beloved Nephew or Niece Told You They Were Sure They Were Trans?

[BilindaB]

They want to see a doctor and explore their options. How would you react? Let's say they are a teenager, but if you have personal experience of a child of any age telling you this, please share.

@BilindaB

I've asked a perfectly reasonable question and won't be answering any more posters making me defend posting it.

You could acknowledge that some people thought it was a genuine issue you were struggling with and took time and energy to respond in good faith. The fact that it subsequently turned out to be an exercise with unclear motives has understandably annoyed a few people and the fact that you then did not acknowledge the upset made things escalate. It would be no big deal to acknowledge others and apologise.

@BilindaB

You didn’t want a discussion which is fair enough, but have you got the answers you wanted/expected

Its a perfectly valid question for you to to ask...im only asking if you are happy with the answers?

I've found them very interesting and some have made me think.

Thank you

I agree they have been interesting

I expect that people on both sides of this debate would have at least one thing in common: we would all want the best possible outcome for the child. Someone who genuinely believes that gender identity is innate and unchanging, and that the only way for the child to be happy is to transition, would be guided by that. While those of us who believe that transition is likely to harm a child would be influenced by that.

As to why I personally think desisting would be the best outcome, that's based on things like:

• the NICE review (www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4207281-NICE-Evidence-Review-for-Use-of-Puberty-Blockers-for-GD-Now-Released)
• the change in policy in Sweden (segm.org/Sweden_ends_use_of_Dutch_protocol)
• Arguments set out as to why desistance is preferable by Dr Stephen B Levine (this is available online in pdf, just search for "stephen b levine expert submission")
• this interview with Dr Susan Bradley ()
• testimonials of detransitioners and of trans people who have had complications with surgery or medication
• the fact that the Bränström & Pachankis study showed no evidence of benefit from transition (segm.org/ajp_correction_2020)

So then there's the question of how that would influence me. That would depend on the age of the child among other things.

Dr Stephen B Levine has talked about the importance of adults giving children a reality check - eg. explaining to them that a boy is not a girl simply because he likes the kind of things stereotypically associated with girls. Children learn how to understand the world with the help of adults and so I think that affirming or passively accepting a young child's claim to be trans is not in that child's best interests. If I felt it was my place to do so, I would explain to a young child that they do not need to act or dress in any particular way, nor do they have to feel any particular way, simply because they are a girl or a boy.

With an older child or teenager I would be sympathetic but explore their reasons for believing they were trans, and their understanding of what that meant. I don't think I could ever actively, directly support transition (by which I mean I'd never fund their transition or directly help them access things like binders) and I would give them all the reasons that have led me to that conclusion. That said, we can't make decisions for others and if the child was in their late teens, for example, I would accept their decision. I would make it clear that no matter what, I loved and valued them and would be there for them whenever they needed me.

In terms of trying to make someone cisgender.

Isn't that pretty much the whole of society all the time from when you're born?!

The language used confuses the matter though... there's no such thing as 'making someone cisgender'. As that implies you 'are' trans. It requires this belief in a gender identity which is an unchangeable part of your soul, so at some point you discover your 'authentic self'.
What I see are huge numbers of teens who need help, not 'are trans' and need to be affirmed.

There are just so many variables it is difficult to say, so much depends on the individual child.

A child who has shown trans tendencies from a very early age would need supporting in a different way than one who has just hit puberty and now feels that they are trans.

In these times I think we have to adopt the watch and wait approach.

I would want to explore their motivation, try and find out how long they have felt this way.
I would support them with things like pro nouns, a new name, hair style and clothes within the family setting.
And as I said watch and wait to see how they handle these changes.
Do they feel happier, more settled etc or has the novelty begun to wear off.

Societal pressure isn't trying to make us 'cisgender', most of society has never heard of 'cisgender'. It's trying to make people gender conforming, something everyone here fights against I'm sure.

Well exactly.

This whole thing applies labels that hardly anyone knows about to things that are totally standard.

Stacks of people have trouble to a greater or lesser extent with assuming the role pressed on then by society.

If you follow stonewall definitions then the whole of society needs to be prosecuted for conversion therapy.

If you follow stonewall definitions then the whole of society needs to be prosecuted for conversion therapy

...while simultaneously being defined as transgender.

@NiceGerbil

Well exactly.

This whole thing applies labels that hardly anyone knows about to things that are totally standard.

Stacks of people have trouble to a greater or lesser extent with assuming the role pressed on then by society.

If you follow stonewall definitions then the whole of society needs to be prosecuted for conversion therapy.

The sooner Stonewall is taken out of the equation the better.
They have caused so much angst its ridiculous

Honestly, I think youd get a minute and a half in and find you'd lost your audience. Young people dont make this kind of announcement because they want you to lecture them on how wrong they are. Maybe do your last paragraph first?

If that's the attitude/maturity of someone contemplating a pathway filled with life-altering hormones and surgery, it kind of sounds like they're too young to contemplate starting on a pathway filled with life-altering hormones and surgery then, eh.

It's not a "lecture on how wrong they are". It's an explanation of what SRS is.

Or do you think little children should just be able to choose surgeries at a whim. If so I reckon my 5 year old would fancy some bat wings sewn onto his back.

ImASoulMan

Not just stonewall.

The thing that made my jaw drop. Well one of many but it was the first.

Was seeing documents from properly years ago. 15/ 20 or something. When the govt was saying no more mixed sex wards.

Where the govt said in reality we want to do single gender not single sex.

And the response from the NHS was. Are you sure? And the public are expecting single sex.

And the govt said. Definitely single gender. But on the stuff for the press we're going to say single sex so as not to confuse the public.

??!!

The met and maybe other forces have been recording crime on self id for.. yonks. Like. More than 10yrs or something.

That wasn't stonewall.

A request for info to a load of forces a couple of years back. The ones that replied said. Self declared gender. None had any record of when the change was made or why.

Now I'm no conspiracy theorist.

And I don't need to be because there's been stuff written by Steven whittle et Al. Going back ages. Saying. Get in the room with the decision makers. Keep it quiet. Get things changed behind closed doors.

And well fuck me it's worked hasn't it.

@FightingtheFoo of course not, that's why it has to be handled sensitively. And you dont start by "telling" or showing slides of disfiguring surgery.

DD is still very young but if it ever comes up I reckon I could talk her around. Making sure we have a close relationship to have an open discussion will be key (why does she feel that way, what part of woman isn't for you, do you understand it is impossible to change sex). I would make sure she knows she is loved no matter what though, it's important to stress. Anyone else and I don't think I would feel it was my place to have the discussion. A family member on my partners side has recently 'come out' as a TIM. I have questions but I don't feel like he owes me answers. I expect when I see them I will just pay no attention to the changes (I will use preferred pronouns/name). Similar to a poster up thread they act just like a teenage boy so it doesn't take much sense to me (they aren't quite a teenager anymore).

The experience I have with young people in these upsetting circumstances seems to be because they have come from a very distressing abusive background. We are trying to be as supportive as we can whilst exploring the unpleasant, frightening backgrounds that they are coming from. We are ensuring that all channels are open for discussion whilst making sure (from my own experience), these broken young women are able to understand not only their abuse but that their femininity and they can feel validated and safe. I don’t know any young trans women so I’m not able to say we can help them. I just seem to have an awful lot of trans men/boys who are so distressingly frightened of their own bodies.