Laurel Hubbard to go to Tokyo

[Biscuitsanddoombar]

Not a surprise and hopefully it’ll open some eyes about the utter ridiculousness of allowing someone who is male to compete against women in weightlifting

www.theguardian.com/sport/2021/may/05/trans-weightlifter-laurel-hubbard-set-to-make-history-at-tokyo-olympics

Since this topic first reached my attention, the obvious solution has always seemed to me to make the Male category Open (which in fact it often is), and trans people could therefore compete as their gender in that open category.

It's ludicrous that, in effect, it's the Female category that's become Open .

@CuriousaboutSamphire

Yes!

Stop searching for the logic in it. There is none.

The limit is simply to allow men to compete in women's sports so as not to discriminate against transwomen.

There is no similar legislation for transmen. They just get told "If it's too hard or too dangerous - tough!"

The only reason this legislation exists is to placate the loud and angry voices of some male bodied people who wish to compete at the most elite levels and choose to do so in womens sports - for whatever reasons they may have!

Exactly. There is no logic to the concept. It's just a takeover based on misogyny and male entitlement.

The very fact of hubbard competing is the only thing that is necessary for every country in the world to think, hang on, let's just field men in women's sport.

There is nothing to stop them. All of them. All sports.

Just popping this website here; this particular page shows how closely boys who are 11 come to women's world record times and achievements in the 2016 Olympics.

boysvswomen.com/#/world-record

Obviously not weights but still makes the point.

Screen shot of 11 yo time, suspicions that the woman used drugs too:

Ok, so this is going to be like the shark suits that hit the scene a few Olympics back. They were amazing technology and shaved times right now. But they were a massive disadvantage to the rest of the pool and subsequently banned. And that was just a bloody swimsuit!

And if I was an Olympian (which I am not) and therefore pretty competitive would I not say, I am female but I feel a bit non-binary so I’m going to take testosterone so that I’m somewhere between male and female (per my brain) so that’s why I am taking testosterone - nothing to do with the advantage it gives me in sport????

It sounds flippant but I honestly think most of the problems in thr world arise from people not actually talking things through.

Just thinking out loud, but the horrible, cynical part of me wonders if Hubbard will bring home the silver, not the gold.

Olympian, but still obviously in the correct category... right?

There is nothing to stop them. All of them. All sports

At a recent event about women and sports, the point was made that women had been campaigning for a women's competition in a particular cycling event. Tokyo is the first Olympics where there will be a women's class and the US squad of 3 has already opted for an inclusive approach.

Apologies, I don't recall who it was, but it's in WHRC 24 April about women's sport if anyone else recalls it.

@Unsuremover

Ok, so this is going to be like the shark suits that hit the scene a few Olympics back. They were amazing technology and shaved times right now. But they were a massive disadvantage to the rest of the pool and subsequently banned. And that was just a bloody swimsuit!

And if I was an Olympian (which I am not) and therefore pretty competitive would I not say, I am female but I feel a bit non-binary so I’m going to take testosterone so that I’m somewhere between male and female (per my brain) so that’s why I am taking testosterone - nothing to do with the advantage it gives me in sport????

It sounds flippant but I honestly think most of the problems in thr world arise from people not actually talking things through.

And the super bouncy trainers that were around not too long ago, I forget who the manufacturer was.

They conferred too much of an advantage so we’re banned.

Males in female sport though? Totally fine 🙄

Were, bloody autocorrect.

I wonder how commentators are going to come at this? Are they really going to seamlessly pretend there's nothing to see here? I'm sure something would register in my voice at least. They'll be pulled into this debate against their will surely, by either going with or it being replaced.

@Sexnotgender yes exactly. Various technologies pop up and last for 1 games before everyone works out it’s an unfair advantage.

I’m guessing lots of people (who haven’t done the aforementioned thinking) will see this as similar to Oscar pistourious competing in the “regular” Olympics as a beacon of what can be achieved. Presumably the only thing all Olympian have in common is being extremely competitive so if there is a opportunity for improvement will take it.

I hope biological women who have to climb on the podium a step or two below a biological male literally lording it over them in their own category feel able and supported to protest somehow, Black Power salute style. Perhaps bowed head, one arm straight down, the other forearm crossing it horizontally to represent the distaff sign.

As an aside, what are the professional boxing sporting bodies' rules about TW? I know they can't compete in the Olympics if professional, but was just musing that if Katie Taylor got beaten by a biological male, I reckon quite a few of Ireland's population would sit up and get annoyed.

I wonder how commentators are going to come at this? Are they really going to seamlessly pretend there's nothing to see here?
Yes I think they will, as will most reporters. Mainstream media is not a secure working environment and I imagine people will keep their heads down and that it will be up to social media to keep flagging up what's going on.

The only positive I can see in this situation is at least it's not a sport where a woman could be physically harmed in the competition by LH.

That doesn't count the harm done to women who lose out down the tables obviously, just the physical harm.

If records get set that women are unable to match, women are likely to get hurt trying to beat it and put under pressure to dope in order to remain competitive.

Look at Elena Muchina - a world class Olympic gymnast who was pressured by her coach to perform a Salto tumble from men's gymnastics and ended up a quadriplegic.

So a reasonable proportion of men can just compete as women without having to take any drugs at all??????

This is sooooo exciting!

My dh was a junior international at a sport but wasn’t good enough to make it as a senior. However, even now - in his 40s, middle aged spread, doesn’t train very much - I think that he might be able to get training and get himself into the national top 5 for women by next year. All ready for the commonwealths!

It is not impossible that his testosterone is lower than average - he is not at all aggressive. I think we need to get him tested.

What else does he have to do? We could add an “a” onto his name to make it female. And Dd has loads of pink bobbles and clips over from her Peppa Pig phase - he could wear one of them! Sorted!

Shall I go and break the news?????

Very few of the TRA crowd on Twitter are not shouting about this and screaming TERF - they know that publicising it and repeating TWAW is not going to aid their cause with this story.

Sorry rogue ‘not’

Should say very few are shouting about this.

Our hero Trans sportswomen. Not. Ruining sport for women

I've not RTFT but want to know if Team GB has signed up Zuby for the women's squad yet?

My dh was a junior international at a sport but wasn’t good enough to make it as a senior. However, even now - in his 40s, middle aged spread, doesn’t train very much - I think that he might be able to get training and get himself into the national top 5 for women by next year. All ready for the commonwealths!

See - I would support that if I were confident that your DH were going to turn round on the podium and say: "This is a travesty. Was anybody in much doubt that I'd place? I've done this to highlight what is happening to women's sports and how the sporting bodies are convincing us all that we have to gag the boy in the crowd rather than permit discussion about the emperor's new clothes."

@EmbarrassingAdmissions

My dh was a junior international at a sport but wasn’t good enough to make it as a senior. However, even now - in his 40s, middle aged spread, doesn’t train very much - I think that he might be able to get training and get himself into the national top 5 for women by next year. All ready for the commonwealths!

See - I would support that if I were confident that your DH were going to turn round on the podium and say: "This is a travesty. Was anybody in much doubt that I'd place? I've done this to highlight what is happening to women's sports and how the sporting bodies are convincing us all that we have to gag the boy in the crowd rather than permit discussion about the emperor's new clothes."

Unfortunately he wouldn’t be good enough to make it onto the medal podium (even as a woman). Get selected - yes - but not win.

What we really need is Andy Murray when he retires.....

Unfortunately he wouldn’t be good enough to make it onto the medal podium (even as a woman). Get selected - yes - but not win.

I'm eyeing up my DH. Even as an untrained man he has (literally) Olympian levels of VO2max and is made for some events. If* he had the discipline to train he's a stupidly reasonable chance of doing creditably in the men's Master events and obliterating the competition in the women's Master events.

*This is a doing a lot of work. This stuff is so comparatively effortless for him he doesn't begin to appreciate his genetic and physiological advantages. I've no idea as to his T levels but wondering if I should have them tested just in case this idea has legs.