TW: Laila Mickelwait: [children pay] a devastating price for an unchecked Big Porn sex crime industry.

[EmbarrassingAdmissions]

TikTok took down this young woman's first video in which she shared screenshots of her father's searches.

Teen discovered her father googling “real” “homemade” “teen” “rape” videos & “father daughter” incest abuse videos on the world’s largest porn tube sites.

The kids of this generation are paying a devastating price for an unchecked Big Porn sex crime industry.

twitter.com/LailaMickelwait/status/1389217984753946627

In various ways, this has been cropping up, recently. Some of us must be in relationships with, work with/alongside/for/supervise people who search for this material and actively exploit trafficked people.

What is it like for children to discover that a parent or other close relative does this? How do we expect children to engage with a society in which such people live among us? How do we expect VAWG to be addressed as the public health problem it is when social media is set up to facilitate this industry?

@NiceGerbil

Well no the law is 16 to make it easier to prosecute those who are coercive etc (even though there are laws about that in their own right).

It also is s clear message in society that 16 is the cut off. (Some say that is too low, it's out of step with who etc).

Changing this to 14 would in practice make that the age in society. Sex offences are rarely prosecuted

"Changing this to 14 would in practice make that the age in society." - you clearly know much more than me. In that case leave it at 16. I still think that more could and should be done to make "older man meets 17 year old girl" socially and legally unacceptable,

I am very confused by a recent trend I've seen on threads to equate novels (ie fiction only existing in the author/readers imagination) to porn (at best acting the "story" at worst being an actual depiction).
It makes me think that either people are stupid for believing imagination is equivalent to watching something. Or they think we are stupid and will fall for this patent drivel

Anyway. I recommend ignoring porn connoisseurs. They tend to not have much worth saying ime and take up a lot of time.

@QuentinBunbury

I am very confused by a recent trend I've seen on threads to equate novels (ie fiction only existing in the author/readers imagination) to porn (at best acting the "story" at worst being an actual depiction). It makes me think that either people are stupid for believing imagination is equivalent to watching something. Or they think we are stupid and will fall for this patent drivel

Maybe my comparison to a novel was clumsy and unhelpful. I do stand by the basic point though.

I believe that if it is between consenting adults it is fine. I believe that if they consent another adult to watch then that's also fine. If they want to attach a story to the pictures then that is also fine. When I see "incest porn" as a category on a porn site I assume it is a fiction, not videos of real incest. When Johnny Cash sings ""I shot a man in Reno, just to watch him die" I don't assume that he is a literal killer. When an author writes a novel featuring incest I don't presume that she is condoning or promoting incest.

Reading these arguments is fucking mind boggling. Has anyone else picked up on the outrageous homophobia demonstrated here. If yes, apologies. But what the fucking fuck. You view gay sex as on the same level of disgustingness as incest??? Wtf..I'm absolutely gobsmacked by that. I genuinely think that's one of the worst things I've ever read on here.

I think that if an act is illegal in real life it should be illegal in filmed porn.

This would not exclude the depiction of incest or rape in a film or book where it is essential to the plot or the telling of a true story and there is a valid artistic, cultural or biographical reason for including it.

If the only motivation, as in porn is sexual titillation then pretend incest etc . should be illegal.

When Johnny Cash sings ""I shot a man in Reno, just to watch him die" I don't assume that he is a literal killer. When an author writes a novel featuring incest I don't presume that she is condoning or promoting incest

You're comparing apples with things that aren't even fruit. Porn has no purpose other sexual titillation. It bears no comparison.

I know re homophobia I mean who says that fgs

The post I made pointing out that you never know what you're security watching and the fact that rape has been hosted by these sites (as they can say how are they to know either. The famous one only reacted when threatened financially). Etc etc

It's all fun and games between consenting adults though apparently.

@CuntAmongstThePigeons

Reading these arguments is fucking mind boggling. Has anyone else picked up on the outrageous homophobia demonstrated here. If yes, apologies. But what the fucking fuck. You view gay sex as on the same level of disgustingness as incest??? Wtf..I'm absolutely gobsmacked by that. I genuinely think that's one of the worst things I've ever read on here.

Agree. disgusting posts in this thread @mnhq

Jedi, assuming you come from a well meaning place, can I suggest you pause and think really hard about why so many people disagree with you so strongly? Obviously, we could all be wrong, we could all be uptight, judgemental, shoot first ask later types.

We could all be jumping on you for fun.

Alternatively maybe we are seeing something you haven't noticed yet. Maybe there's a problem with the way you are looking at this- that the 'consenting adults having fun' idea doesn't work when the depiction is of abuse.

Quick recap- abuse for titillation is not simply distasteful, it's an issue that needs serious attention.

@CuntAmongstThePigeons

Reading these arguments is fucking mind boggling. Has anyone else picked up on the outrageous homophobia demonstrated here. If yes, apologies. But what the fucking fuck. You view gay sex as on the same level of disgustingness as incest??? Wtf..I'm absolutely gobsmacked by that. I genuinely think that's one of the worst things I've ever read on here.

That is literally not even vaguely what I (clumsily said). In many ways I was saying the absolute opposite.

I find the thought of incest fantasy role play sex disgusting. The fact that I find something disgusting doesn't mean it should be illegal or seen as wrong. If my criteria of disgustingness were the arbiter then gay sex would be illegal AND OBVIOUSLY GAY SEX SHOULD NOT BE ILLEGAL - GAY MEN SHOULD BE ABLE TO DO WHATEVER THEY WANT WITHIN THE BOUNDARIES OF CONSENT.

@MissBarbary

I think that if an act is illegal in real life it should be illegal in filmed porn.

This would not exclude the depiction of incest or rape in a film or book where it is essential to the plot or the telling of a true story and there is a valid artistic, cultural or biographical reason for including it.

If the only motivation, as in porn is sexual titillation then pretend incest etc . should be illegal.

I think that the writing of the law would be difficult and policing it would be harder, but I do have some sympathy with your view.

I tend to think, however, that by your logic we would also need government department to oversea quality in the arts. Tracy Emin decides to make an art film depicting incest - fine. Jim Davidson decides to do a low budget exploitation movie featuring incest - not up to the required standard, not allowed (I have no problem with making Jim Davidson illegal, just to be clear). What About Tarantino? Would his incest film come under proper art or low budget exploitation?

Incest is illegal.
Fantasy role play glamourising and eroticising incest should not be commercially available.

But incest and rape aren't illegal because a random woman somewhere found them disgusting

But why even bring up what you personally find disgusting? It’s not relevant.

You’re assuming the other posters on the thread are making disgust-based arguments. They are not. Consider that they have thought about harm and consequences more carefully than you have.

Jedi do you often struggle to see the difference between a film with sex of whatever type in it that is acted

And a film where the sex is real and the reason the film was made was solely for masturbation?

This thread.
Behold the fucking penis.

You keep switching your arguments at high speed and not really responding to posts except to say well how to would you police that.

You want to reduce the age of consent to 14 but say you don't really know how the consent laws work in the UK.

Did you read the link to the sex offences act I provided? It's very easy to read, not complicated language. And worth it if you're doing stuff like advocating for changes to those laws.

@NiceGerbil

The post I made pointing out that you never know what you're security watching and the fact that rape has been hosted by these sites (as they can say how are they to know either. The famous one only reacted when threatened financially). Etc etc

It's all fun and games between consenting adults though apparently.

Porn between consenting adults is legal. Mainstream porn sites should host legal content - I don't think it's that unreasonable of someone to click on the no. 1 link on google and assume that the content is legal.

Now, we all know some isn't, and that's a big problem. Does this make all porn viewers disgusting? IMO no, but there is an argument that no-one should consume porn in the real world as it is today other than by signing up for specialist paid sites with the porn made by women directors. Or maybe porn is so problematic no-one should watch it at all. Another legitimate argument, but again not one I agree with.

Or perhaps people are morally OK if they watch porn but stick to the "female friendly vanilla sex" and avoid the rape and incest fantasy stuff which is both more likely to be harmful to viewers, and more likely to feature non-consensual sex or trafficked performers.

They are not easy questions, and I get that some people will have much more "puritanical" views than me (and that those views may be 100% about protecting women and girls and zero to do with enforcing some sort of morality).

TLDR - Are you saying that consuming porn is always wrong because one can't be 100% certain that everything is 100% consensual and everyone is being treated 100% fairly? If so that is a very high moral standard, and is, IMHO, unrealistic.

If you're saying that relatively moral people will be careful to source porn from reputable sources and avoid the sort of porn that is more likely to be problematic to performers and young viewers then I agree.

@TheQueef

This thread. Behold the fucking penis.

This reply. Behold the well argued criticism of my position.

Mods - maybe you should delete every post of mine on this thread.

I don't think there would be any difficulty in distinguishing between a film, play etc. where there is a justifiable reason for depicting rape etc. and one which consisted only of depictions of rape etc. for no purpose other than to give literal and metaphorical wankers a hard on.

@NiceGerbil

Jedi do you often struggle to see the difference between a film with sex of whatever type in it that is acted

And a film where the sex is real and the reason the film was made was solely for masturbation?

Exactly - thank you.

'Does this make all porn viewers disgusting? '

Jedi your agenda is showing...

' I get that some people will have much more "puritanical" views than me '

And again...

Is this your first time at this, Jedi?