''Inmates say guards have warned them that “men are coming” and to expect sexual violence.''

[yourhairiswinterfire]

California prisons begin moving hundreds of transgender women requesting transfer under new law

www.latimes.com/california/story/2021-04-05/california-prisons-consider-gender-identity-housing-requests

Archived version archive.md/9T3zo#selection-1983.9-1983.104

I know we've talked a lot already about prisons, but this just makes me sick. Those poor women :(

From the article:

But more than two hours away, at the Central California Women’s Facility in Chowchilla, there’s fear. Inmates say guards have warned them that “men are coming” and to expect sexual violence.

“That if we think it’s bad now, be prepared for the worst. That it’s going to be off the hook, it’s going to be jumping,” Tomiekia Johnson, 41, said staffers have told her. “They say we’re going to need a facility that’s going to be like a maternity ward. They say we’re going to have an inmate program where inmates become nannies.”

Any women showing concern are 'transphobic' and need to be ''educated''.

Although advocates and inmates say the transfers have been received well, several claim that misinformation spread by prison staffers is stirring up transphobia and that more must be done to educate inmates.

Transwomen need and deserve to be kept safe too, that should go without saying, but putting one vulnerable group in danger to keep another safe is not the answer. Predators absolutely will exploit this.

I hope a class action lawsuit is on the horizon, but how many women will have to be harmed before it comes to that?

Prisoners are entitled to request that a female searches them, the female guards don't get a say, they won't be allowed to say no.

In such circumstances, in a thought experiment, it would be helpful if some of the guards were to declare themselves as women or men for very specific contexts (such as intimate body searches) when they clock in for the day.

"This is compelling and using non consenting, captive women to validate a political view with their bodies."

This is exactly it. If there are hundreds of trans prisoners wanting out of the men's prison estate then there is a clear rationale for a third estate for them. Solves the supposed issue without endangering women. But as MichelleoftheResistance says, that's not what these trans prisoners actually want.

If transwomen are women then it's 100% fine and proper that they are housed with other women in prison. It's unfortunate that the womb-bearers may be unhappy about this prospect, or end up raped and/or pregnant, but - well, we must learn to be kind, and those womb-havers will be re-educated out of their transphobia - a great opportunity for them to broaden their minds.

I feel it's a bit unfair having one criminal gets to decide who is 'true' trans, though:

'A transgender woman at a men’s prison, who asked not to be identified for fear of retaliation, said that she knows at least five inmates who have applied to transfer under false pretenses and that staffers have asked her to help identify such inmates.

“They wanted me in a confidential setting to tell them who is transgender and who is not, so they can block some of these guys from going to the women’s prison,”

“War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery and Ignorance is Strength.”

Does it also apply in that any male prison guards working in women's prisons who identify as having a 'female' gender identity would intimately search female prisoners?

I have a horrible feeling it does.

Biological male accused of rape in a women's prison and the governor rules out transferring them back to the male prison.
I think the World has gone mad.

nationalfile.com/transgender-inmate-accused-of-rape-in-womens-prison-facility/

Should also be pointed out that there are just over 8600 female prisoners in California . Hundreds of males being transferred will have a considerable impact on facilities let alone other prisoners.

This is exactly it. If there are hundreds of trans prisoners wanting out of the men's prison estate then there is a clear rationale for a third estate for them. Solves the supposed issue without endangering women. But as MichelleoftheResistance says, that's not what these trans prisoners actually want.

I would imagine the percentage of male prisoners who would like out of the men's prison estate to be very near to 100%.
I don't think that is clear rationale for creating additional estates. There is a great deal to be done to improve the prison environment for those of either sex in custody.

How many hundreds of TM are lined to be moved to the male estate incidentally?

Are the men in the male estate being 'educated' about that?

There is a tipping point at which all of this goes south in a handbasket anyway, but it's not as if anyone ever does a bit of basic foresight, is it?

In the UK, there are so few category A female prisoners that there is no category A female prison.

TW prisoners who are cat A therefore automatically shift to a cat B provision when moved to the female estate.

It would take very few transfers to the female estate before TW outnumber women in cat A women's prisons. Since TM cannot be placed in the male estate because safety of someone born female (which apparently matters in this situation although not others) cannot be managed in a group that is predominantly male, how small a minority do women have to become of a women's provision before women can no longer be placed there?

Are female prisons in California as overcrowded as the male prisons?

Utter madness -
And this is not exclusive to USA.
In UK many "trans women" are being transferred to female only prisons.
over 33% of such are sex offenders,
Society needs to wake up, what society places biological men in female prisons, and to make it worse many are sex offenders,

this is tip of iceberg, these biological men know reality, and are playing the game, trying to get sympathy and easier time in Prison, and access to vulnerable women.

I believe there are at least 11 such ""trans women" in female only prisons in England & Wales, - latest FOI I have seen.

And yet people are shocked when these people sexually assault women?

Shame on Prison service which has allowed this.

Why are prisoners in the male estate not being 'educated' on how to behave more humanely towards transwomen? Is that not progressive enough?

@Floisme

Why are prisoners in the male estate not being 'educated' on how to behave more humanely towards transwomen? Is that not progressive enough?

Because nobody dares to question male entitlement.

Sickening. I feel so sorry for those women.

In other parts of the USA, state governments are passing laws to protect women and children:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4212862-arkansas-bans-puberty-blockers-hormone-treatments-and-surgery-for-under-18s

And of course the Guardian will tell us California is good and Arkansas is bad.

And this is not exclusive to USA.
In UK many "trans women" are being transferred to female only prisons.
over 33% of such are sex offenders,
Society needs to wake up, what society places biological men in female prisons, and to make it worse many are sex offenders,

Hardly surprising given that according to another thread since the beginnings of 2020 of the 14 transwomen convicted in the UK 9 are sex offenders.

I know the answer really but why tf are the wishes of a relatively small group of men always prioritised over the wishes and safety of a larger group of women

@StillAFemale

I know the answer really but why tf are the wishes of a relatively small group of men always prioritised over the wishes and safety of a larger group of women

It's almost as if democracies still cling to the days when they decided the relative worth of people compared to the index white man. Whether your worth/testimony counted for a quarter or a half. Or, was to all intents and purposes, so negligible as to be unworthy of consideration except as an administrative inconvenience.

These "most vulnerable of all women" do seem to have the upper hand in this situation don't they.

This is profoundly inhumane. I feel deeply sorry for all the women who will be collateral damage, this isn't fucking Orange is the New Black where's there's one very nice and kind TW who poses no threat. This is an unbearable reality.

I've said this before, but surely once it becomes common knowledge among male prisoners that they can claim they are trans and go to the women's prison, aren't they all going to do it ?
Why wouldn't they ?

I've been thinking about these poor women all day, the vast majority of whom will have been subjected to violence and sexual abuse by males. So the answer is to abuse and traumatise them further so that male feelings aren't hurt?

Heather Mason has done a brilliant interview about the situation in Canada. 260 males are now in women’s prisons.....there are only less than 1000 women prisoners so suddenly a large % are male bodied. Mens Max security prisons are not equivalent to womens prisons. For women, they live in open houses & a guard will walk through once every 2 hours, they are not watched all the time. The security is not as tight....this a disaster waiting to happen. Some of these men are proven sex offenders. It is grossly unfair to put women in such a dangerous situation.

As you said, “ I know the answer really but why tf are the wishes of a relatively small group of men always prioritised over the wishes and safety of a larger group of women 😡”
A recent survey found that the number of inmates in England and Wales who self-identify as transgender has surged to ten times previous estimates, such that one in 50 prisoners now claims to be transgender. The numbers of men “transitioning to women” has increased so rapidly that officials express uncertainty as to how to manage the situation.
In 2016, when data on the number of transgender inmates was first collected, 70 prisoners said they identified as transgender. By 2018, the number of inmates who identified as transgender had nearly doubled to 100. Currently, 1,500 of the 90,000 inmates incarcerated in England and Wales say they are transgender, an increase of ten times the previous figure.
Statistics from the Government Equalities Office show that an estimate of 200,000 people living in England and Wales identify as transgender. The percentage of inmates who identify as transgender exceeds by four times the percentage of self-identified transgender people in the general population.
Strange, that...

I don't know what the prison system is in California but, iirc, transwomen prisoners in England are entitled to more commissary (make-up, clothing) and privileges as a given rather than something that is contingent or that they have to earn as if they were standard population in the female estate. I think there are some FWR threads that incorporate this topic.

It's the anticipated behaviour of rational economic agents to act in line with self-interest. This might be a modern take on, "There are no feminist allies in a self-interest incarceration foxhole".

I've been thinking about these poor women all day, the vast majority of whom will have been subjected to violence and sexual abuse by males

One of the female inmates that was interviewed:

Johnson, the inmate who said staffers had told her to expect violence with the transfers, said that she has survived domestic violence from a man and that it would be triggering to live with transgender people who haven’t had gender-affirming surgery.

“I do think they should be safe, but it infringes on my right to be safe as well,” she said.

Her needs obviously matter a lot less than others...

It makes me furious that the people supporting this rather than other options will have us believe they're proper human rights champions. Anyone disregarding women in this way should keep 'human rights' out of their mouths.