Chauvin trial re George Floyd - Sky News

[chilling19]

Is anyone watching this? With the really upsetting and unarguable against video footage I can't see how the defence can build a case. Also the baiting by the defence lawyer of the female EMT witness was horrendous, as was the judge telling her off. She held her ground though, as did the previous child (female) witnesses.

I am so surprised by the demeanour of the judge, especially to the fire fighter - first responder.

Genevieve Hansen, Darnella and Darnell's cousin are sheros.

Donald Williams 'I did call the police on the police' and him calling out the defense on making him out like angry, black man.

The dichotomy of the witnesses on the street, who were powerless but did speak and call the police about the treatment of George Floyd is such a divide.

If a conviction does not happen, and perhaps even if it does, there will be protests regardless.

I completely agree @Dissimilitude.

To clarify I mean the divide of the humanity shown by those on the footpath and the callous disregard of George Floyd by Chauvin and his fellow officers is what this is all about. RIP George Floyd.

The trainer has said they don't train to use a knee in restraint. Interested to see what they say about defensive tactics and medical training.

Concerning that the Defense mentioned a prior case that established 'the reasonableness of a particular use of force must be judged from the perspective of the reasonable officer at the scene, rather than the benefit of 20.20 hindsight' and the 'calculus of reasonablenss must allow for split second decisions, in situations that can be tense, uncertain, rapidly evolving.'

9 minutes isn't a split second decision and I would hope the fact that other officers pointed out he had no pulse would be a factor.

The obvious come back to that is that everyone else on the scene was able to see that he was not posing a threat but dying. It did not require hindsight it was evident to everyone else at the time.

It just seems to me that whether George Floyd was on drugs, whether he had a heart condition, whether he was a criminal or not, it's all completely irrelevant. It's all a deflection away from Chauvin. Racist PPs defending him should be ashamed of themselves.

Most people have some sort of pre-existing condition, or take medication or drugs. Any one of us – actually, even the biggest healthiest bloke – would have died under that knee-on-neck treatment. It's murder, plain as.

If GF was a criminal then he should have been taken to trial. Chauvin should not have acted as his executioner, but like a proper policeman took him in to prison.

If he doesn't get locked up for this for a very long time I hope the riots will be huge.

There is just no defense for this. None.

adrianmolesmole

Most people have some sort of pre-existing condition, or take medication or drugs. Any one of us – actually, even the biggest healthiest bloke – would have died under that knee-on-neck treatment. It's murder, plain as

I agree. Moreover, there is already a legal doctrine that covers this. If by some chance your victim is more vulnerable than average and dies as a result of your crime, where another would not have done, it is tough luck on you. You take your victim as you find them and you are responsible for what you did. No whining about how it was their fault they died.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eggshell_skull

@adrianmolesmole

It just seems to me that whether George Floyd was on drugs, whether he had a heart condition, whether he was a criminal or not, it's all completely irrelevant. It's all a deflection away from Chauvin. Racist PPs defending him should be ashamed of themselves.

Most people have some sort of pre-existing condition, or take medication or drugs. Any one of us – actually, even the biggest healthiest bloke – would have died under that knee-on-neck treatment. It's murder, plain as.

If GF was a criminal then he should have been taken to trial. Chauvin should not have acted as his executioner, but like a proper policeman took him in to prison.

If he doesn't get locked up for this for a very long time I hope the riots will be huge.

I agree completely. I suspect that it's going to come down to potential cause of death however, just enough to suggest that he was more susceptible to die and not that the cunt actually killed him. Enough to give doubt.

If the prosecution can't prove beyond reasonable doubt that the knee on the neck was the cause of death, Chauvin walks.

If there isn't a conviction justice is broken.

The knee on the neck doesn't need to be proved the sole or main cause of death for a murder conviction to ensue, as I understand it. The fact that GF was thought to be 'on something' as the defendant claimed in a conversation caught on his body camera after the ambulance had left just means DC knew GF was extra vulnerable and should have been handled carefully. There will often be multiple factors contributing to a death, especially a violent death, and it only needs one factor to be intentional for a conviction.

CNN is good for discussion of the issues and they bring in experts. Other news channels are available!

@chilling19

There is just no defense for this. None.

I agree, but after seeing what happened to Rodney King I just don't know. America can be such a strange country, sometimes I don't understand it.

@NewlyGranny

The knee on the neck doesn't need to be proved the sole or main cause of death for a murder conviction to ensue, as I understand it. The fact that GF was thought to be 'on something' as the defendant claimed in a conversation caught on his body camera after the ambulance had left just means DC knew GF was extra vulnerable and should have been handled carefully. There will often be multiple factors contributing to a death, especially a violent death, and it only needs one factor to be intentional for a conviction.

CNN is good for discussion of the issues and they bring in experts. Other news channels are available!

Well, he knowingly continued so maybe he will get convicted for murder. There is no way concern for the man's life was on any of their agendas.

Difficult to watch. Today the witness grilled on defense tactics stated once you handcuff on the ground even if resisting they should be put in side recovery position or a device to restrain their legs should be used, and telling someone to relax while on them, as they plead distress, is 'not necessarily effective'. No shit.

Everyone who has any restraint training should know that prolonged prone (face down) restraint is a huge risk and should not happen. If it happens at all it should be timed and breathing monitored. Many people have died in this position (positional asphyxia) because of pressure on the chest and not being able to see when someone is slipping into unconsciousness.
It's been strictly limited in the U.K. for years. See tragic case below of Rocky Bennett in 1998

image.guardian.co.uk/sys-files/Society/documents/2004/02/12/Bennett.pdf

They need to strictly limit it in the US regardless of the outcome of this trial.

The Irish doc is really interesting talking about the physiology of breathing.

Compulsive and chilling evidence from the pulmonary specialist this afternoon: a completely healthy person subjected to what GF was subjected to would have died. The prosecution went round and systematically closed up every rathole ahead of the defence. Fentanyl - no. Heart disease - no. Pre-existing condition - no.

Tobin was eloquent in his language: not an ounce of oxygen left in his body; his last breath; trying to breathe with his fingers and knuckles. And the slowed down replay of "the moment the life went out of him". I could have wept buckets.

If this case doesn't end in a conviction for murder, nothing a police officer does ever will. Ignorance of what he was causing is not going to excuse him because the vital knowledge clearly informed all the guidance on restraint which he chose not to follow.

You would not kill even a vicious dog like that.

I think they could all go home now, actually, except the one going to prison.

@Erkrie

I do appreciate being black can be an additional factor in the states. Which is why officer Daniels put out a series of videos on Facebook how to behave if someone gets pulled over. Which is very useful advice for anyone really. Get through the moment and deal with the rights and wrongs of it afterwards. But GF, I'm not sure. Mainly because it seems to be a police restraint method, and other men have died as a result of that too. Chauvin might be a racist. Or he might not be. I don't think the outcome of this case will provide that answer. An overhaul of policing methods and restraints clearly needs reviewing regardless.

I can't believe somone actually typed this with a straight face. Re-videos. It shows lack of understanding and naivity to thr whole situation. And the more I type my reply the sadder it makes me feel.

The Irish doc is not having any of the defence. Quite rightly. And yes, the clip of George Floyd's last breath is shocking. The whole thing is shocking. I don't believe that Chauvin purposely murdered him, but i do believe that he just didn't give a shit about making sure that the 'black guy' (for anyone who thinks this wasn't about race/class, have a word with yourself) was OK, because he thought that no matter what happened he would get away with it. I would not be surprised if he has a long disciplinary record. Arrogant fuck. I am glad that the judge decided to allow filming - at least we get to see how justice is done. I hope.

Also finding today very sad and feeling angry. Defense is wheeling out the argument that in some people with fentanyl it affects the ability of the chest wall to make it less elastic.

Dr Martin Tobin is excellent. The defence are stumbling badly.

Also finding today very sad.

I wonder if Chauvin will testify, I mean there is nothing he can say but what a bastard.

Yes.