Can feminism be right wing?

[DisgustedofManchester]

This popped up on twitter today ( its an image I cannot share that basically says that 90% of the news that fairplayforwomen interacts with leans right ) and its an interesting question especially with regard to gender critical feminism because the ideology with regards to trans rights and trans people does match the views of traditionally conservative groups like men's rights activists, the christian right, conservative politics and the generally socially conservative.

The conundrum is that I see many GC accounts also being for example anti-brexit which is not a right wing position or is it a case of my enemy's enemy is my friend? Even if they are anti-feminists as well. Or is right wing feminism where women now feel more represented?

What's there in Manchester to be disgusted with?

It is interesting that the right have produced 2 female prime ministers but the left haven’t.

It’s almost as if socialist + feminist is a step too far.

@NotBadConsidering

There’s a DisgustedofManchester that frequently comments on articles in The Times. Is that you? Does that mean your “interactions lean right”? Or does it not count in the same way as FPFW because you’re only “leaning right” with your interactions to tell women to stop protecting women’s rights?

I was wondering if it’s the same Times-subscribing DisgustedOfManchester too.

Yes, it's baffling how women can claim to be socialists while centring women.

Can transactivism be right wing?

The Heritage Foundation

www.heritage.org/nuclear-energy/commentary/liberty-justice-all-conversation-sam-brinton-deep-isolation-and-the

Liberty & Justice for All: A Conversation with Sam Brinton of Deep Isolation and The Trevor Project

@EdgeOfACoin

Is it left wing to be feminist?

When I read the Communist Manifesto I seem to remember it advocated keeping women together in a collective so that they could have babies for the state.

I don't see women's rights as being inherently left wing.

This is a misreading or misremembering.

Marx and Engels wrote about communism (small 'c'; they were both long dead before soviet communism arrived) being freedom and equality for all, whichever sex.

In fact, women's oppression was linked directly to capitalism or private property and ownership.

Engels' ' the rise of the family, private property and the state' (possibly slightly misremembered title) explicitly links the rise of private property, and specifically in men wanting to pass on property to their own children, to the end of mother right and the start of men wanting to control women's sexuality.

Whether historically accurate or not or it is a compelling argument 'the overthrow of the mother right was the world historical defeat of the female sex!

So Women's rights is a left wing issue as left wing equals looking after others / class consciousness and right wing is individualism and I'm alright jack and strongest wins

(Not in any way claiming that all left wing men are feminist)

@Lessthanaballpark

It is interesting that the right have produced 2 female prime ministers but the left haven’t.

It’s almost as if socialist + feminist is a step too far.

Tbf i think Theresa May got the job because it was a poison chalice and nobody wanted to be in charge of Brexit - boris pulled out at that point, he hung back until he could see which way the wind was blowing, as he always does. TM was a placeholder, and i hate the tories but i did feel sorry for her tbh. It was the classic oops bit of a mess here no one wants to touch, better get a woman to clear it up manoeuvre rather than a feminist moment. Well that’s how it struck me anyway.

I see you can't bring yourself to say she was the best person for the job at the time then Lisa?

Well when AL withdrew it was more a case of being the only person for the job but regardless, that’s not a very high bar to clear is it? Anyway, if they always pick the best person for the job, how come we’re stuck with clownshoes now instead of Rory Stewart? God, imagine how he’d have handled covid.

@Lessthanaballpark

It is interesting that the right have produced 2 female prime ministers but the left haven’t.

It’s almost as if socialist + feminist is a step too far.

The "glass cliff''; women are moved into leadership positions when times are tough or the organization is in crisis. The term was first coined in 2005 by Michelle Ryan and S. Alexander Haslam in an article for the British Journal of Management.

How many Labour PMs can you name? What about Tory?

Brexit is a red herring, there are plenty of leftist arguments for it.

It's always helpful to remember that neither the left nor the right are always into large state level actions, nor are either always into more localised actions. You get both on both sides.

Then, what's left and right? Usually the right is seen as believing hierarchies of some kind are inevitable/natural, and so working within that in some way. Whereas the left is seen as wanting to be more flat, and at it's most extreme remove all social and political hierarchies. In reality though all liberal democracies have some significant attempts to democratise - be flat - while no political system is without explicit hierarchy and no society is either.

Since feminism talks about women as a class, being inherently different than men in some ways, they are maintaining a distinction. I think it would be fair to say that most left version of feminism would tend to minimise that distinction - to say that in a perfect society it would have truly minimal effects on one's experience as a human being. Some of these people might be inclined to actively try and remove barriers to this, as in that article about artificial wombs, or discouraging breastfeeding.

I think it's true that since the 60's feminism has tended to lean left, to varying degrees. But I am less convinced that it has to - there are other approaches that could equally be directed toward justice and equality for women but which might start from a different perspective with regard to how to get there. It's not really like those things haven't been talked about by women, but often not in feminist settings. Mary Harrington would be the main exception I can think of, and I know some don't like to give her that title.

HTH

The left are just as misogynist as the right and despite Marx and Engels very fine fords there is a definite theme that women should be common property. That's why left wing men spend so much time cheerleading for porn, prostitution and surrogacy, despite these being extremely harmful forms of capitalism.

Feminism grew out of the left when women got completely sick of lefty bloke misogyny.

I think a woman can never be truly free until she is financially independent, and I don’t think that squares particularly well with a more statist/benefit driven approach espoused by the Left.

And science is intensely political and fashion driven. The Human Genome Project was in direct competition to Craig Vetner’s commercial effort - and was no means guaranteed to be first over the line,

Do elaborate, Skyliner. Please. Just this once.

@orderingcalmingtea

Do elaborate, Skyliner. Please. Just this once.

Who needs elaboration when you can throw a few emojis into the mix?

Whenever I see people bandy around the words right wing and fascist, I immediately think of the Young Ones.

The reality in the UK is not quite so clear cut, I’m afraid.

@orderingcalmingtea

Do elaborate, Skyliner. Please. Just this once.

This is an echo chamber 😊

Left wing / right wing is a British colonial concept based on patriarchal hierarchies.

My politics are non-binary.

The word Skyliner is using is a slur. If you Google it you will find it's most often accompanied by threats of rape and death in very bio essentialist terms.