What does CIS mean?

[Babysharkdoodoodood]

I mean really?
I was discussing (ranting) about this with DH today. Trying to explain why I'm a woman and not a cis female.

Then he come out with this beauty (not being nasty): Doesn't it just mean Cunt In Situ?

I was absolutely howling mainly because it's true

A cis woman is a woman who was, to use the gender critical terms, observed to be female at birth.
So a transman is cis?

A cis man is a man who was observed to be male at birth.
So a transwoman is cis?

Come on, at least try to be logically consistent within your own universe of belief.

This is why I don't use the prefix "cis". Some people have defined it as "having a gender identity which is feminine if you are female and masculine if you are male".

Some have defined it as "anyone who does not identify as trans". And then in that definition "trans" doesn't only mean "transgender" but also "gender variant", agender, and any one of many things under the trans umbrella.

I also have been unable, despite asking for years, to ascertain how I find out what my gender identity is.

So until these concepts are unambiguously defined, I can't be sure whether I'm "cis", trans or neither. Anyone else telling me which I am is making some big assumptions here.

Come on, at least try to be logically consistent within your own universe of belief.

Come on, now. Logic is a social construct, you know.

@30PercentRecycled

It facilitates the claim that cis people are privileged over trans.

We are.

The women here are so so privileged to have been beaten into 2nd, 3rd and 4th places.

The woman in silver medal position is Feagaiga Stowers in a weightlifting event at the Pacific Games.

Feagaiga Stowers, who pulled herself up out of poverty and abuse to sporting greatness was expected to take gold. Instead a middle aged mediocre millionaire weightlifter had made the brave decision to transitioned away from losing in the men's competition to winning in the women's.

It is offensive to say those women are privileged compared to him.

Look at the woman who lost the bronze because of it. Look at her standing behind the podium.

Who in that picture is dripping with privilege?

This should never be allowed. I'm sorry trans people should be in the category they were born into. That's disgraceful.

A trans table is a table assigned to be a wardrobe at creation. A cis table is a table assigned to be a table at creation. All types of tables are tables. No debate.

There are people who aren't trans who aren't cis (a portion of non-binary people, as well as other genders in other cultures, such as the Tahitian/Native Hawaiian māhū, who do not neccessarily perscribe to Western culture).

Oh really? This is interesting:

The mahu might be a practising homosexual or remain chaste, like a girl making a vow of chastity. What defines them is not how or with whom they make love, but that, having been born with the sexual organs of a man, they have opted for femininity, usually from childhood, and that, helped by their family and community, they have become women, in their way of dressing, walking, talking, singing, working and often, but clearly not necessarily, of making love.

www.tate.org.uk/tate-etc/issue-20-autumn-2010/men-women-pacific

The whole concepts of cis or trans depend on someone being able to take two things and compare them to see if they match, according to a list of paired sets which no-one has yet laid out: sex, and gender.

Start with "sex". Most people use this word to mean whether you have a male or female body (at birth, and at several other times in your life). This physical aspect most people agree is unchangeable. However, someone yesterday was adamant that what they call "sex" is changeable, but wouldn't say what "sex" is. So, I cannot answer unambiguously what my sex is until it is defined.

Now, gender. How do I identify my gender? If my child said 'I've been learning about gender identity at school, what's mine?' what would I tell them?

Next, we need to see the list of "matching" gender identities for each sex. I have assumed that a feminine gender identity matches a female sex, but this seems very regressive and suggests that femininity and being physically female have some sort of overlap, which does not sit right with me, so am looking forward to being corrected, with clearly defined terms.

@30PercentRecycled

Channeling Inner Stepford

Perfect

There are people who aren't trans who aren't cis (a portion of non-binary people, as well as other genders in other cultures, such as the Tahitian/Native Hawaiian māhū, who do not neccessarily perscribe to Western culture).

evarish I'm trying to follow this - thanks for this info. What do you mean by "perscribe" here?

And all that stuff CardinalLolzy just said is exactly what all the enbies and other genderologists do all day - trying to reconcile their "sex" with their "gender" in a world of fuzzy definitions.

The assumption seems to be that the believers have this really deep inner world where they can think about this stuff, and the nonbelievers are just too stupid or something.

No, we've taken a look at your astrology, thought about it, seen that the model has no predictive value, is not consistent with our own deep inner world, and rejected it, thoughtfully. Possibly even more thoughtfully than your acceptance.

Nonbinaries are just pre-gender critical people who haven't quite figured out how exactly how flawed the model is yet and are trying to cling on to it.

Infidel simply means not Muslim. It carries no meaning beyond that. If I write about the world and comment on policy using the descriptive words Muslims and Infidels and you object then that is a sign you are Islamophobic. It is just a descriptor. Look it up in the dictionary. Lolz. Silly bigots.

It's the latest way to dehumanise women, by making us a subset of our own sex. Silly people applaud it as progressive. It also makes our oppression our own fault.

The way I’ve seen it used online, it also seems to have the meaning of “boring” 🙄😂

Infidel simply means not Muslim. It carries no meaning beyond that. If I write about the world and comment on policy using the descriptive words Muslims and Infidels and you object then that is a sign you are Islamophobic. It is just a descriptor. Look it up in the dictionary. Lolz. Silly bigots.

Ooooo, good luck with that one. Infidel and its equivalent in Arabic, Kaffir, are highly offensive terms in some countries including Indonesia, South Africa and Turkey. tribune.com.pk/story/1263943/infidel-ottoman-slur-raises-hackles-turkey for starters...

Construction Industry Scheme.

Its how subcontractors tax is paid. I don't work in the construction industry though.

There are no cis women. There are just women. Calling us cis implies there is some other kind of women. There isn’t. HTH.

Also I'm an atheist so while I can appreciate other people's beliefs I do not subscribe to them myself

@Evarish

Hibari's explanation is largely right.

A cis woman is a woman who was, to use the gender critical terms, observed to be female at birth.

A cis man is a man who was observed to be male at birth.

There are people who aren't trans who aren't cis (a portion of non-binary people, as well as other genders in other cultures, such as the Tahitian/Native Hawaiian māhū, who do not neccessarily perscribe to Western culture).

It says nothing about how someone presents, if they fit or enjoy stereotypes, what their interests are, or adhering to sex roles.

Yeah "Right On" indeed! Full of the joys of the fashionably woke!

Again, nope! Please don't use that word to describe me. I fnd it offensive

• yes, I know that your rejoinder to that is that you find my finding it offenisve to be offensive "ha ha" how we all larfed!

Observed nonsense. About time that was stopped. It only highlights the ludicrous contempt in which you hold your audience. We are women, not unthinking empty shells!

And yes sweets, we do know about cultural differences, and would celebrate them if it werent for you having constantly appropriated them! Nice of you not to use DSDs thouhg. Has that been a directive from somewhere? Did we 'not trans' entities make too much sense?

And the reverese engineering on stereotypes never did go unnoticed either. How can you present/live as something if you don't recognise ts characterostics, its social norms, which, of necessity, includes all the stereotypes?

Your entire post has no inherent logic. We all see that!

There are people who aren't trans who aren't cis
This would be me.
(a portion of non-binary people, as well as other genders in other cultures, such as the Tahitian/Native Hawaiian māhū, who do not neccessarily perscribe to Western culture)
This would not be me.

Either people are the authority of their gender identity which must include not having one, or it is acceptable to misgender people. You can’t hold both positions. Please make up your mind.

There are people who aren't trans who aren't cis (a portion of non-binary people, as well as other genders in other cultures, such as the Tahitian/Native Hawaiian māhū, who do not neccessarily perscribe to Western culture)

AND, presumably, anyone else who does not possess a gender identity.

Either people are the authority of their gender identity which must include not having one, or it is acceptable to misgender people. You can’t hold both positions. Please make up your mind

Exactly.

Hmmm. Comparisons with "straight" are interesting. Actually, I do recall the word "straight" being used as a slur in the 70s and 80s. It meant conventional, unimaginative, mainstream, uncool (ironically, the word "cool" itself was still a desperately unfashionable throwback to the 40s and 50s), boring, rigid and not part of the in-group. In other words, it was used in much the same way as "cis" is used today. I still use the term "heterosexual" to describe my sexuality, as "straight" still carries those pejorative, unflattering connotations for me. Why define myself using a term which others coined to describe what they dislike about me?

In relation to women or men, 'cis' means real.

@HermitsLife

Construction Industry Scheme.

Its how subcontractors tax is paid. I don't work in the construction industry though.

Glad it’s not just me that thinks this when I see CIS

JustSpeculation - yes, i think straight and cis are applied to other people to chuck them into the 'square' box.