Surrogacy again, why is the BBC selling this?

[WeRoarSometimes]

I am in despair again, at the so-called beliefs of some men and women, that they have a right to having a baby. And convincing a woman with vulnerability to do it.
I'm linking the Daily Mail story as this is the first search result when looking under Google.

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-9351973/Single-mother-23-says-gay-couples-surrogate-gave-life-new-meaning.html

This lady is 23 and a single parent already.

If we had to guess, she is likely to be much more vulnerable than two men, in terms of the power dynamic between the parties, in terms of access to money (power), in terms of her own responsibility to care and raise the child she already has.

It sounds as though she was vulnerable, feeling low, possibly low self-esteem after her relationship ended and she became a single mother.
This is predatory.

All her self-worth is tied up in them thinking that she is helping them out, by giving them her egg and carrying the baby during pregnancy.
She has clearly been groomed into thinking she is giving the child back to the original parents.

It's also very convenient to have a home birth in these circumstances.
No hospital team to question what is going on.

The first skin on skin contact is also with one of the chaps. They couldn't even let her hold the baby as soon as it was born.
Honestly, this makes me cross. No empathy or knowledge about what it can do to a child to remove them from their mother at birth.

These new surrogacy laws the law commission is working on will only go to erode protections for so many women who will be vulnerable through their economic status or family circumstances.

The surrogacy agencies undertake DBS checks.

But.....no checks with local authority or NSPCC, to see if any concerns have been raised against intended parents.

If someone were living with a partner who had offences against them the DBS check wouldn't flag this up, but a local authority check which checks the individual and the address, would. Local authority checks can flag up domestic violence, allegations by children, a former partner's children for example.

Surrogacy agencies openly state that any checks regarding future welfare of unborn children are 'light touch assessments.'

That phrase is from the website of a surrgoacy services provider based in London.

I attended 2 public consultation sessions with the Law Commission and "light touch" was the expression they used too.

@IloveJKRowling

I'm not sure I want to know the answer to this - but what is to prevent paedophiles from buying a baby? Are there any checks at all?

I didn’t want to say it and I’m hope I’m wrong but that’s what came straight into my head with the single guy there I’ve said it.

You're probably not the only one thinking it Sweet.

Though we will hear the 'not all men' plea there are examples to support concerns (though from what I've seen it's same sex male couples and men in heterosexual marriages, not single men in particular) and I don't know how many children need to be used as an example of the safeguarding failures surrogacy can allow. Just one is enough for me (Peter Truong and Mark J Newton and their son Adam) and that's why I'd like to see tighter regulation, closer to adoption procedures, if surrogacy can't be fully outlawed in the U.K.

Here's an another example of a single man, he had 6 surrogate mothers in 8 years.

www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/became-single-dad-surrogacy-friends-050033936.html

This single dad in the Yahoo article refers to his 2 year old daughter as his travelling partner, buddy.
Almost as if it is a relationship akin to friends or an intimate partner relationship.
She is an infant. He is the adult. He is in charge.
What about her needs as a child?
Perhaps those are secondary to what the adult wants. Again.

FFS.

This site is pathetic.

Wow that article...

So self centred and acting as if no other human beings were involved in this at all. Women suffered the trauma and health risks of stillbirths and miscarriages just so he could have what he wanted.

And yes, the wording around his relationship with his daughter is a bit worrying too.

He didn't seem to think it was that reasonable he had to jump through the adoption hoops too - not exactly child-centred.

Mind you his friends were correct - the title of the article is 'When I Became A Single Dad By Surrogacy, My Friends Called Me Selfish'

Yep, your friends were right. Wonder if they're still his friends, or is he relying on his 'traveling partner and restaurant buddy' for all human validation these days. Poor kid. FFS.

I do wonder how it works out with adults who have children through surrogacy where is doesn't meet their expectations, either with parenthood or that the child's personality, taking after their genetic parents or it just not being quite as idyllic companionship and actually quite hard.

When viewed through a consumerist lens when you can't get a refund/send the baby back it must be so bloody awful for the child, esp as the adults have been prioritised and their needs come last from the beginning so how do you manage that when it all goes wrong?

There are children born through surrogacy who are put up for adoption because the relationship of the commissioning parents has broken down, and it's fair to say that happens soon after birth, but the children who grow up to be a staggering disappointment to those who bought them must have a really tough life.

I watched the first episode of this last night. My overriding feeling at the end of it was how sad all of it was. I really felt for the young mum (Emma?) and hope the two parents of her child offer her an ongoing relationship with her daughter.

The words of the single man (David?), "I don't have access to a womb" jarred hugely. I think he was being facetious but it seemed very telling. Later in the programme, when he talked about his adolescence and bullying at secondary school, I felt very sorry for him. I think he is a vulnerable person who has gone through some terrible times. I don't think this means he is entitled to a child.

The woman carrying her boss's child was a huge imbalance of power. Again, the boss had had a terrible time but even she said "you shouldn't have to rent me your womb so you feel you can talk about your children at work". When Caitlyn said this means I can be the good guy and not the bad guy, I felt her lovely nature was being taken advantage of.

I wasn't pro surrogacy before and certainly against the government making it easier/giving more protection to the commissioning parents but this programme made me even more against it. (And this is before touching on any impacts of the resulting children.)

One aspect which frightened me particularly was the talk about being a surrogate becoming addictive! That is seriously weird.

I've watched an awful documentary on YouTube about surrogacy in the Ukraine. I advise people to watch it - it's a real eye opener.

Do you have a link for this, please?

It was the focus on "This is my right" that really jarred. (Having a baby is no-one's right, gay or straight!)

Exactly!

No-one has a "right" to a child - a child has a right to a loving upbringing.

When people start to think of children as commodities, then they will start to specify - blonde, dark, tall, short etc - and children will be expected to fit the expectations and specifications of their parents.

There are already parents who find it hard to accept a child who likes things that they don't, or won't go into a career the parents want them too, or who find their child's sexuality distressing - how much worse will this become? How much more pressure on a child to fit a mould, rather than helping them to fulfil their own, unique potential?

All i know is that as soon as "his" baby emerged into the world, Michael Jackson picked it up and ran, disgusting beyond belief. What infant deserves this ???

@Linearpark

All i know is that as soon as "his" baby emerged into the world, Michael Jackson picked it up and ran, disgusting beyond belief. What infant deserves this ???

I didn't know that. Where did you get it from?

I too fine it so so sad, for the surrogates, but also I just think what of these babies?

What trauma is being caused. Babies are meant to be with their mothers.

Poor Emma so vulnerable.

And what about Emma's little boy who has bonded with the gay couple, what happens if he is ditched? I don't know I think it is all so sad!

Someone on another thread said that Emma was still friends with the gay couple, and that they were hoping for another surrogate baby.

I have a (possibly unjustified) suspicion that when they decide they have enough children, then Emma and her little boy will fall by the wayside.

What happened to surrogacy being for people who were desperate for a child? When did it become something for people who fancied having a number of children, and could afford to pay someone else to carry them for them?

It's wrong, and it's pressing on the vulnerable, and it is far too open to abuse. Regulating it won't stop it - there will always be smart-aleck who will find a way past regulations - only banning it has a chance of reducing it.

Ban it here, and make it much more difficult to bring in a baby from other countries - as difficult from adopting form other countries.

It is the welfare of the children which is important - not the whims of the would-be parents. I'm not saying that only a birth mother/father can lovingly bring up a child - of course not, that's nonsense - but there needs to be much more care over who babies are going to. I don't doubt that in 10, 20 years, we will have a lot more information on how the babies born in these circumstances cope psychologically with life - at the moment we just assume that if they are loved that's enough. Perhaps it isn't. (And what if they aren't loved?)

*preying, not pressing

I know this is a sleeping thread but just seen this in iplayer and I’m of the same mind as the op. I felt the woman birthing at home was very very vulnerable. Low self esteem and seemed to be seeking out another kind of relationship with those me to somehow be less alone. It was truly awful to watch. I was kind of always of the thought that women who did this were seeing it as a financial transaction but it seems that some are doing it because they are so desperate for male approval and connection they’re renting out their wombs. It’s horrible

@parsnipsnotsprouts

I know this is a sleeping thread but just seen this in iplayer and I’m of the same mind as the op. I felt the woman birthing at home was very very vulnerable. Low self esteem and seemed to be seeking out another kind of relationship with those me to somehow be less alone. It was truly awful to watch. I was kind of always of the thought that women who did this were seeing it as a financial transaction but it seems that some are doing it because they are so desperate for male approval and connection they’re renting out their wombs. It’s horrible

Yes, I've just watched episode one and agree with you. I found it painful to watch her laying over the armchair mostly naked immediately after giving birth, being totally ignored whilst the two blokes cuddled and fawned over the baby. When she put her hand out on to one of the guy's knees as if she was seeking comfort...it was so, so sad to watch. Why did she not have a birth partner to support her, someone who was focused on her welfare rather than just the baby? A friend or relative, she didn't have anyone she could ask to be there to support her?

@MeadowHay yes. Where was her mother? Friend? Poor girl just seemed to be selling her baby (and it was her baby) in a desperate attempt to not be so alone. I really hope she’s ok