TW nominated for the womens prize for fiction

[Kit19]

for fucks fucking sake!

"Peters’ longlisting comes after organisers clarified in 2020 that it was open to any “cis woman, a transgender woman or anyone who is legally defined as a woman or of the female sex”. “It’s a prize for women, and trans women are women, so …” said chair of judges and author Bernardine Evaristo."

@Ereshkigalangcleg

It reminds me of Juno Dawson's recent fawned over novel where there was a teenage girl character who liked meeting random men from suburban commuter towns for sex.

That character wasn't a teenage girl.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3905777-Guardian-interview-with-Juno-Dawson

Is there a prize for trans literature?

(Sorry, storytelling).

I don't get why there can't be additional things?

I'm sure there would be sponsorship found easily and plenty of publicity.

More trans writers would get exposure and women in this one.

A win win surely.

I know I said this upthread already but the determination to take over things that exist for other groups rather than make new ones that really celebrate trans talent and experiences- it seems so short sighted.

I mean I know why isn't happening obviously. But it means everyone loses tbh.

Wait. Um. What. I've just read part of that thread.

Um. There are a bunch of people fundraising on twitter to donate JD's current/most recent book to school libraries. Um. Is that one equally reminiscent of a communist flag?

That character wasn't a teenage girl.

Ah yes ok, but we're supposed to imagine they are. Because there is nothing that differentiates a girl from a "trans girl".

They're 17, from that other thread?

Girl, boy, trans girl, trans boy. I haven't read the book. The guardian piece sounds like it's the author working through some stuff that happened to them?

You do read stuff from trans women and also gay men stuff that sounds really off. It seems there is an elevated risk of sexual exploitation. Which in a defence move familiar to many women and girls, is turned into, I wanted it I was in control.

That is a real worry tbh. I don't know if there is much going on around any issues there? And it's not my world but there seem to be a lot of TW and gay men who had very early sexual experiences with older men.

Sorry that's a tangent.

For those saying you want to see how bad the book is, but refuse to buy it, did you know if you don’t like a Kindle book you can return it within 24 hours and get a refund. Just sayin . . .

@NiceGerbil there is the Polari Prize, which is for LGBTQ writing and in practice about half the prizes go to trans writers.

On the up side, the writer will have good run at this year’s Bad Sex Awards. Mind you, competition will be fierce, what with the cancellation of last year’s award.

The award is most frequently won by a man, so be exciting if Ms Peters could take out 2021’s prize.

if Ms Peters could take out 2021’s prize

Do the public vote? I'm sure it could be arranged . . .

The award is most frequently won by a man, so be exciting if Ms Peters could take out 2021’s prize.

It really would. Refreshing.

I was wracking my brain last night trying to come up with a snappy slogan that would represent the lost woman or girl who was just behind the trans woman for a prize, a medal, a scholarship, a championship, etc...something a PP on another thread just called chilling how we overlook all the missing women/girls when we make "just this little exception."

How about The Cuckoo Prize? Referencing how one of the slots has gone to a cuckoo-in-the-nest, so we need to reward the proper-bird-bird.

I am really worried about Juno Dawson. It is the same thing - it’s about being trans, so the fact that it’s really alarmingly inappropriate and presents a pornified, misogynistic worldview as cool and dandy, can be brushed under the carpet because you can’t question anything a trans person says or does or you’re transphobic.

Now “be kind” allies are queueing up to show how wonderful they are by buying JD’s guide to being trans for kids for schools. Directly encouraging kids into this highly regressive narrow-gendered worldview and into a trans identity that in some cases will take them to where Kiera Bell and other detransitioners are now - as well as generally discouraging the idea that you could just stay male or female and do/enjoy what you like.

I feel that we will look back on books like this with horror at what the hell we were thinking.

mobile.twitter.com/hatpinwoman/status/1370679877460983809

This woman is reading Detransition Baby and tweeting about it. She's not impressed.

I am really worried about Juno Dawson. That book still haunts me.

She's probably stuck her neck out enough, but I would love to see JK Rowling start a book prize for women.

As an aside, all the glowing editorial reviews on the books Amazon page spells volumes about the state of marketing and how publishers get reviews. #cynical
I don't know how anyone can read a book containing multiple statements about how being slapped makes you feel feminine and go 'yeah, what a great book'. I mean you might get a few men for whom it would completely pass by, but that many?

NiceGerbil

It's a good tangent though. Even over my lifetime, I've seen a little shift in attitudes towards teenage girls, and an acknowledgement that 17 year old girl and a string of much older blokes is not her being "empowered". (Gawd I hate that word these days.)

You see women on MN who were that teenage girl having realisations in real time, and having conversations about the older men who exploited them. We're nowhere where I want us to be as a society, but we're moving towards it there.

But the public conversation around naming the similar experiences of 17 year old boys and much older men (also often married, to a woman) is a bit slower, because of historical and current homophobia. And now I think people are worried about being seen as homophobic if they express any concern about power imbalance in sexual relationships that aren't older man and vulnerable teenage girl.

I think people are worried about being seen as homophobic if they express any concern about power imbalance in sexual relationships that aren't older man and vulnerable teenage girl.

Yes, this

The number of women and blueticks promoting this book on twitter is shocking.

@Akela64

The number of women and blueticks promoting this book on twitter is shocking.

I can't believe JD has any credibility when their non-fiction has previously included a book all about being a boy, and then all about being gay - two identities the author has since rejected for themselves.

I don't know to what extent the new book pushes hormone and medical treatment - anyone know? (I know it does include it and JD is shouty about it.) JD's book on mental health was quite 'oh, no, not medicine!' until the postscript - quite shaming actually. Really uncomfortable to see how anti-anxiety medications are a 'last resort' but a lifelong medical and surgical pathway is a 'must-have'.

Just realised you probably meant the prize-shortlisted book! D'oh! (Definitely not going to read that one.)

From the screenshots and quotes it looks like incredibly badly written, misogynistic drivel, written by someone who has no idea what it is like to be a woman, or how to realistically present a woman's perspective. It does give some interesting insight into how some TW might view women and their place in society though.

It appears to be a very thought provoking book, although I suspect not in the same way the author intended.

Unless it ends up with a revelation about how they realised they were a massive misgynist and etc?

Doubt it somehow.

@Xanthangum

I was wracking my brain last night trying to come up with a snappy slogan that would represent the lost woman or girl who was just behind the trans woman for a prize, a medal, a scholarship, a championship, etc...something a PP on another thread just called chilling how we overlook all the missing women/girls when we make "just this little exception."

How about The Cuckoo Prize? Referencing how one of the slots has gone to a cuckoo-in-the-nest, so we need to reward the proper-bird-bird.

Well the Wooden Spoon was traditionally given to the person that came last - so the Women’s Spoon?

I think the thing we all need to do is drown out the attention on this book by reviewing, endorsing, promoting, recommending all the others as much as possible wherever we can.

I heard Alex Clark (Guardian Book editor?) being interviewed on R4 Front Row about the longlist. She sounded so awkward discussing the TP book - sounded like she’d scripted a set of words and wasn’t going to deviate from them.