MOJ Prison Policy JR TODAY

[ChazsBrilliantAttitude]

Just seen on Twitter.

Will post links

j1968

ChazsBrilliantAttitude
jj
Do you think intact males with a history of sex offending should be housed in the female prison estate?
That is what this thread is about.
I don't think it's unreasonable to point out that a podcast someone is advertising on this site is hosted on a far right website.

You haven’t answered.
Do you think it is acceptable that female prisoners are incarcerated with intact males some of whom are sex offenders?

I am Jewish

Can we not allow this important thread to be derailed with irrelevant smears?

Could you look a female prisoner in the eye, JJ, and say, "I'm sorry you were raped and in fear of rape every hour of every day, but your rapist feels like a girl so it was the right thing to put that rapist in your cell." ?

I will be on the Raw Report livestream tonight at about 7.30 talking about prisons and the judicial review:

Thank you for all you are doing to publicise this KPSS

Do you think it is acceptable that female prisoners are incarcerated with intact males some of whom are sex offenders?

I've answered this before, no I don't think sex offenders should be held in the women's estate unless they are segregated in some way.

Ereshkigalangcleg

You are right.

This thread is about how the MOJ failed to consider the rights of female prisoners when deciding where to place TW in the prison estate even when those TW still possessed male genitalia and in some cases had a history of sex offending.

@jj1968

Do you think it is acceptable that female prisoners are incarcerated with intact males some of whom are sex offenders?

I've answered this before, no I don't think sex offenders should be held in the women's estate unless they are segregated in some way.

What level of segregation would you see as appropriate?

What if the female inmates want to have zero contact (never been in the same space as) a biological male? As per their right to a single SEX incarceration?

Do you think female prisoners have the right to say no?

Do you think a male desire to be around women trumps a female desire to be away from males?

Why?

@SirSamuelVimes

Could you look a female prisoner in the eye, JJ, and say, "I'm sorry you were raped and in fear of rape every hour of every day, but your rapist feels like a girl so it was the right thing to put that rapist in your cell." ?

In England and Wales at least trans prisoners don't share cells or showers when placed in the female estate, I think that's reasonable. There was a rumour it may have happened in Scotland but I don't think it's ever been substantiated.

Can I just point out that it wasn’t just “failure to consider” females, it was an orchestrated and malicious policy to “actively endanger” females.

What if the female inmates want to have zero contact (never been in the same space as) a biological male? As per their right to a single SEX incarceration?

Well I support prison abolition in the vast amount of cases so that's a bit moot really. However women's prisons are full of men, whether working as screws, healthcare & education workers, maintenance workers, admin staff etc so it's not likely that would be a demand that was taken seriously by the prison service.

Oh dear. I'm really cringing on your behalf @jj1968

I'm pretty sure lots of prisoners don't want to share spaces with murderers and people with a history of serious violence either, but you know, it's prison. One reason why we should be looking at altenatives imo.

In England and Wales at least trans prisoners don't share cells or showers when placed in the female estate, I think that's reasonable. There was a rumour it may have happened in Scotland but I don't think it's ever been substantiated

You can’t know that because if the GRC was obtained before the person was incarcerated then they are legally female and could potentially go straight into the general female population. S22 GRA means no one can ask and no official can share information about person’s gender reassignment if they do find it out. The MOJ couldn’t produce data to the court. Nobody has an accurate, holistic picture.

In Canada 60% of male prisoners applying for transfer to the female estate are sex offenders. If this pattern repeats itself here , the whole pattern of offenders within female prisons will totally change.

@jj1968

What if the female inmates want to have zero contact (never been in the same space as) a biological male? As per their right to a single SEX incarceration?

Well I support prison abolition in the vast amount of cases so that's a bit moot really. However women's prisons are full of men, whether working as screws, healthcare & education workers, maintenance workers, admin staff etc so it's not likely that would be a demand that was taken seriously by the prison service.

Ok, zero contact with a male offender? As all those males you just listed working in prisons are not offenders, it isn't relevant.

One of the people responsible for drawing up the Scottish Prison policy( no consultation with female prisoners or prison staff of course) on transgender prisoners was Gordon Pike.

www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/local-news/prison-officer-facing-jail-after-9576200

Good luck with your livestream, Keepprisonssinglesex

There was a rumour it may have happened in Scotland but I don't think it's ever been substantiated.

From the Daily Record, among other outlets:

The women inmates have had to accept that Stewart is being allowed to live as a woman, despite not having had surgery.

“That means she is in the showers at the same time as other inmates, which some have found quite awkard.

www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/transgender-murderer-crowned-prisons-miss-12022026

I would bet that jj would not refer to it as a “rumour” if the same outlets were reporting, say, harassment of a trans person in prison.

@Clymene

Oh dear. I'm really cringing on your behalf *@jj1968*

Yes, me too. Again.

Ok, zero contact with a male offender? As all those males you just listed working in prisons are not offenders, it isn't relevant.

I think the post directly below yours shows that is actually is very relevent.

There have been many serious abuses of both women and children by male prison officers.

There have been many serious abuses of both women and children by male prison officers.

Oh well that's alright then. Let 'em all in. They're gonna be abused anyway....

“That means she is in the showers at the same time as other inmates, which some have found quite awkard.

The casual dismissiveness about the humiliation and sexual harassment of those women utterly boils my blood, Talking.

Keepprisonssinglesex

Thank you for everything you are doing. And yes, that test is an excellent one.

The desperation of people appropriating everything under the sun to stop women publicising these issues, is a testament to the women who refuse to be intimidated.

JJ, irrsepective of how they present/identify, no male bodied people should ever be housed in women's prisons.