Posie Parker Zoom

[AdHominemNonSequitur]

Posie Parker has been warned by Zoom that her account may be suspended for promoting hate. Now she can sometimes go a bit far, but as far as I am aware all she does is deny TWAW, which is still supported by UK and probably US law. Are they going to ban the UK government when it debates trans rights too. This is absolutely terrifying over reach. Can anyone still be in denial about the deeply illiberal nature of this shit show. What have we let happen under our noses. What are we still letting happen? What is wrong with people? Why can't they see?

“ Facade of FWR... ok. Is that speak for 'women behave and be nice'?”

No.

Facade means “a deceptive outward appearance”

FWR is this board and it’s regular posters

*Facade of FWR... ok. Is that speak for 'women behave and be nice'?

No.
Not at all.
Is that all you get from what was said?*

Yes. Some women have defended her, a lot of people say they didn't agree but get where she is coming from. You won't let it go and then start insinuating we all agree with her completely, which most on the thread have said they don't. Strange attitude.

Sorry, bold fail. First two paragraphs are quotes

We see again and again XY men getting away with deeply troubling behaviour whereas XX women are repeatedly held to a much higher standard.

I don't think that applies at all in this example. Tweeting that a marginalised group should be sterilsed would quite likely be career destroying for anyone involved in any other kind of political campaigning outside of the far right - no matter how much wriggling was done after the tweet. As would hyping up armed right wing men against a minority group just days after a violent attempted right wing coup left four people dead. I find it astonishing that there are still those who see themselves as liberal or lefty people (or even moderate Tories) who still defend her.

You won't let it go
It's a discussion about what she has and hasn't said, and being banned from platforms or not.

and then start insinuating we all agree with her completely
Where do you get that from when what I actually posted is that there's a range of views on here from moderate views to the extreme ones?
I haven't said that everyone thinks the same and agrees with her completely.

Sorry jj, but that sounds like you think PP has some Trump like power.... I get she makes you make uncomfortable and you would like her to dissapear, but thankfully most companies still recognize a slippery slope when they see it.

And there is the facade, in the very flesh.

“centre and promote the rights of women and children”

Just FYI, it is totally possible to do that without being a transphobe.

I’ve got no idea what beef Zoom have with Posie, or why, or even whether, they are actually preventing her from using their platform.

What I do know is that the FWR mythology that she has never said or done anything transphobic is deception through and through.

Open your eyes.

Actually, it is not possible to center womens and childrens rights and not get tarred as a transphobe. Just simply saying woman is adult human female is transphobic according to transactivists. So in that line of thinking, PP is indeed transphobic.

In feminists line of thinking she is a woman with feminist and non feminist ideas who indeed sometimes goes too far. But I resent being told we are all nasty when we don't fully condemn her or think it is ok to ban her from Zoom.

I posted on this thread because there are posters and lurkers who weren’t aware of Posie’s back story, and who deserve to hear about it.

I am such a one. I think the screenshot from MN clarifies it. The thought was badly worded, but it means "If a woman thinks she is a man, she should [meaning the logical outcome of that belief] be sterilised [meaning choose to be sterilised in order to avoid the female experience of pregancy and birth]."

Not "Transmen should be [forcibly and against their will] sterilised."

I think that's clear in context.

just days after a violent attempted right wing coup left four people dead.

It wasn't an "attempted coup". Or if a few crazy people did have that intention they didn't get anywhere and didn't have even 1% of the force needed to properly try it. So no, not a "coup attempt". Maybe insurrection if some people intended to murder politicians.

And as far as I know, the people that died were all Trump supporters. You don't want anyone killed in riots obviously because it shouldn't be happening; but it's still significant context.

It’s literally like no one has ever heard of hyperbole.

I get she makes you make uncomfortable and you would like her to dissapear,

On the contray I have said before I am ambivalent about Posie. On the one hand I worry that she might end up inciting violence against trans people, particularly given who her followers are. But from a purely Machiavellian trans rights perspective she is a godsend. Picking fights with Black Lives Matters and gender critical feminists alike, saying things that horrify potentially sympathetic moderates and completely alienating the younger feminists she constantly insults as woke idiots does more to push the Gender Critical movement into the fringes than anything 'TRA's could achieve. Now I'm not a Machiavellian, and so oppose her on the grounds I've stated but if there really is an all powerful secret trans cabal bent on world domination at all costs then it wouldn't surprise me to find out they were paying her a salary.

jj

I don't think that applies at all in this example. Tweeting that a marginalised group should be sterilsed would quite likely be career destroying for anyone involved in any other kind of political campaigning outside of the far right - no matter how much wriggling was done after the tweet.

I do wonder. Oh sorry. I was thinking of the prescription of puberty blockers to distressed teenage girls with autism, without further investigation of whether there might be other, better solutions to their distress.

Sometimes it feels like it's not that you disagree with MNers, it's that you haven't listened for long enough at a time to realise what we're saying.

It's very worrying to hear that Zoom has banned Posie for ideological reasons. Another example of Big Tech overreach. It is sinister and has very concerning implications for freedom of speech.

The unaccountability, power and anti-democratic, censoring tendencies of Big Tech all need to be addressed.

I do wonder. Oh sorry. I was thinking of the prescription of puberty blockers to distressed teenage girls with autism, without further investigation of whether there might be other, better solutions to their distress

That's not what your post said though that JJ was referring to - why add that on?
Posie P's tweet wasn't referring to sterilization in the example you now are, which you know.
It's right in that talking about sterilizing any other marginalised groups of people away from far right discussions and this issue would be met with more disbelief and condemnation.

Picking fights with Black Lives Matters

I think you'll find it was the other way round.

"...does more to push the Gender Critical movement into the fringes than anything 'TRA's could achieve."

Even if GC feminism is "fringe", or being pushed to the fringe, some of the basic ideasthere is a difference between the sexes and the difference matters to things like sportare clearly common sense truth, and on such solid ground that they will always appeal to moderates that haven't had their minds distorted by ideology.

@Zinco

just days after a violent attempted right wing coup left four people dead.

It wasn't an "attempted coup". Or if a few crazy people did have that intention they didn't get anywhere and didn't have even 1% of the force needed to properly try it. So no, not a "coup attempt". Maybe insurrection if some people intended to murder politicians.

And as far as I know, the people that died were all Trump supporters. You don't want anyone killed in riots obviously because it shouldn't be happening; but it's still significant context.

If you're going to talk about the attack on the US Capital, get your facts correct.

1. 5 people died in the Capital attack including a police officer
2. 138 officers were injured
3. 2 officers died of suicide immediately afterward

4.238 officers and National Guard were exposed to COVID either during and immediately following the attack and subsequently tested positive 5 at least 140 people have been charged with federal charges that include (but not limited to) conspiracy to obstruct Congress, civil disorder, assault of federal officers

1. FBI is continuing to arrest and have asked the public in help to identify rioters.
2. As coup suggests a military takeover, that is not a correct term. As continued indictments and charges of violence and conspiracy come, insurrection has been used in more instances by reputable news sources like NPR and the NYTimes

I'm pretty sure lots of other women had opinions three years ago that people aren't still banging on about.

LOL. Julie Bindel, Suzanne Moore, Sheila Jeffreys, Janice Raymond, Germaine Greer, Helen Lewis, Janice Turner, Caroline Criado Perez, Rebecca Riley Cooper, JK Rowling

And many others!

Mockolate

I'm afraid I don't understand you. jj was replying to someone else.

I am pointing out that I think 'sterilisation of a marginalised group' has been a major concern for many people on this side of the argument for a while, and I include myself in that group.

I am extremely angry that no-one outside the feminist movement expresses disbelief or condemnation, actually, because they've been told that trans rights is left-wing, y'know?

Off topic but I wonder why two officers would commit suicide immediately after the Capital attack?

Oh and I reserve the right to express bemusement that after all these months in FWR, jj can make such a comment and not realise it is literally a red rag to a bull.

@JayAlfredPrufrock

Off topic but I wonder why two officers would commit suicide immediately after the Capital attack?

State of policing in the US. It's complicated but often Black officers feel a great deal of pressure just doing their job. They can be seen as sellouts, they experience racism (police departments are very racist), and its simply very dangerous. Americans have a lot of deadly weapons. Other police officers experience abuse as well and some feel conflicted as their roles. Some are raging bastards too! Americans have very strong and divisive views on cops and it's not an easy role for the good hearted.

This Capital attack was driven by white suprematist ideology and I'm sure that would weigh heavily on me if I were a Black police officer- as if we still can't get better as a society.

The two police officers who took their own lives were white.