Breastfeeding is now chestfeeding, Brighton’s trans-friendly midwives are told

[Mulletsaremisunderstood]

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/breastfeeding-is-now-chestfeeding-brightons-trans-friendly-midwives-are-told-pwlvmcnc7

Hope this link works as I am a subscriber to the times and logged in.

More nonsense being peddled as 'progressive' . When will the madness end!!?

Trans men can mestruate.

Because their sex is female.

'Trans man' refers to a concept of gender, which other people are free to reject, in the same way that they are free to reject the concept of God.

It's not possible to reject the reality of sex, regardless of whether that means periods or severe discomfort to the extent that you take cross sex hormones.

Typically, men haven't thought much about the impact of sex, because the world revolves around men.

I will caveat that by saying that somebody with a GRC should in most, but not all instances be treated as their acquired legal gender. However, that is not the same as sex.

These are the new words in the renamed perinatal services. I don’t even know what perinatal means and why should I.

To be fair, other things do use perinatal, it’s pregnancy and (I think) the first year after birth. Perinatal mental health services for example, that would deal with mental health problems during pregnancy and things like PND after pregnancy.

I used to half read some of the posts on here about women being undermined and forgotten about through these kind of initiatives and wokeness (mostly because I didn’t have the time or energy to read up about it) but this latest development has made me snap. I will now make much more of an effort to keep up to date with what is happening because I really feel like women are the ones being thrown under the bus.

Uuuugh!! I’m so sick of this snowflake crap. Ladies boobs are there to feed any children they have. That’s what they are for. Breasts feed babies. Breasts. We produce milk. Women. Girls. Ladies. Females. Pretend females can breast feed no matter how hard they try. It’s called breast feeding for a reason. Not because we had a drunken meeting and that’s what we came up with. Get a grip world!!!

I read this when it was highlighted by my local media, apparently it means midwives will tailor their language if someone requests it.

But the issue I have with this - if as a transman you are so incredibly triggered by 'breastfeeding' and 'mother' why do the ultimate female thing of getting pregnant and birthing a child! It annoys me because language is indeed being tailored and changed to suit a minority at ridiculous lengths.

"Women aren't the only ones who give birth. Women aren't the only ones who have abortions."

Yes. Yes, we are. Yet a tiny minority kick and scream about this because it doesn't suit how THEY identify.

@Ireallywantsomechips

This is a sincere question which is probably hugely offensive to some but I genuinely don’t understand.

If you do not identify as a woman but are using the biologically female parts of you to reproduce is that not somewhat hypocritical?

Of course it is. It’s cherry picking the bits you want. It makes my blood boil.

Brighton and Sussex University Hospitals NHS Trust endorses both disassociation from your unmentionable female body

I have brought this up on the other thread. There is a group of women for whom giving birth and/or breast feeding trauma causes a type of disassociation. It really isn't talked about until women start comparing notes, I'd be interested in any studies. However, I am one and I know there are others, probably significant numbers who either temporarily or, in my case, permanently feel disassociated from my breasts.

Sure, use it for individuals when they come in. It is when it is rolled out organisation wide as the terms to use that it becomes an issue. And there are too many organisations taking that particular approach.

The very last thing I would have needed at the time I was trying to establish breastfeeding, would have been to be part of a group that called it chestfeeding or reading information that called it chestfeeding. I was already trying to recover from a traumatic birth, and emergency c, I really think seeing 'chestfeeding' would have the impact of further disassociating me from my breasts.

Maybe, my experience is that unique? I don't think so, I just think it is still not talked about but I could be wrong.

Yet, I doubt that anyone writing that literature or naming that support group to be inclusive would think that it would have just the opposite effect on people like me.

Can someone please explain chest-feeding to me. Is it trying to be inclusive of transmen who wish to breastfeed but don't like the idea of having breasts (despite having presumably grown a baby in their uterus and birthed it from their vagina)? Or is it trying to be inclusive of transwomen who have procured a baby through surrogacy and either wish the child to suck on their dry nipple to help with parental bonding or have fashioned some sort of device like the one in Meet the Fockers? I genuinely don't get it.

Meredithgrey1 I'd have thought perinatal also includes antenatal as "peri-" means around?

Side note, what a great example of how totally unclear this new wording is! Let's hope that clarity of language isn't a concern in a medical setting

@SmellsLikeTeenBedroom

Can someone please explain chest-feeding to me. Is it trying to be inclusive of transmen who wish to breastfeed but don't like the idea of having breasts (despite having presumably grown a baby in their uterus and birthed it from their vagina)? Or is it trying to be inclusive of transwomen who have procured a baby through surrogacy and either wish the child to suck on their dry nipple to help with parental bonding or have fashioned some sort of device like the one in Meet the Fockers? I genuinely don't get it.

It is to be inclusive to transmen. It does seem to ignore that men have breasts too.

There is a push to allow transwomen into breastfeeding support groups as well. That is a subject that has been discussed recently too.

What do transmen call their wombs? They'd need to find quite a lot of new words, I'd think.

I just saw this in the news! I'm astonished!

@ArabellaScott

What do transmen call their wombs? They'd need to find quite a lot of new words, I'd think.

gestation chambers?

if we are following the 'chest' example, maybe 'abdominal gestation chambers'? or 'bottom incubation spaces'.

What happened to woman centered midwifery?

“Trans Men” can menstruate because they are WOMEN! ONLY women can menstruate, although as I said, not all women do, regardless of how they identify. Sex is binary. It is observed at birth and can be observed in utero from ~15 weeks. It cannot be changed either by medicalisation or surgery. Anyone who thinks otherwise has either been badly educated or is suffering from a psychological disorder and needs therapy, not affirmation. Would you starve an anorexic? Suggest liposuction? Of course not.

@Thelnebriati

What happened to woman centered midwifery?

It got updated to person centred birth workery after it was discovered to be disempowering and distressing to people.

It has been realised that the word woman and all associated words are highly offensive and demeaning to people. Just as in the past woman and girl were used as insults and female body parts so disgusting that they are only fit for expletives of the most taboo nature.

This is the backlash, we women got “too big for our boots” and “people” are striving to put us back in our place and restore the “natural order”.

There was a large picture of chest feeding that used to be on the wall at school. It was something like the attached. The story behind it is religious and something along the lines of the mother pelican pecking its chest and feeding her own body to her starving chicks. Used to freak me out. Chest feeding.

Article on the BBC front page.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-56007728#comments

@LordOfTheOnionRings

It's for trans men, not trans women. It's not replacing any language, it's in addition to, all you would have to say is 'i am a woman and please say breastfeeding' and they'll do it. It's breast/chest feeding.

Bollocks is it.

Sorry. It annoys me seeing all this 'mensturators is to please transmen' and such. At the same time as NO changes for men happening. Are we really to believe, that on this one topic, suddenly transmen are listened to, while transwomen have absolutely no issue at all being called...men? Like hell.

I could believe the changes were about 'trans acceptance' too IF, it was equal..and men alsow ere under constant attack for their language. But thats not the case. So ask, why only female centred stuff? Transmen are the excuse (and a handy way of 'omg, you are not supporting female people!' ing those who object too..). But they are not the reason for it.

I'm assuming they're not changing terminology for terms referring to men's anatomy.

The bbc article has now been updated to include an analysis by Ben Hunte.

I could believe the changes were about 'trans acceptance' too IF, it was equal..and men alsow ere under constant attack for their language. But thats not the case. So ask, why only female centred stuff? Transmen are the excuse (and a handy way of 'omg, you are not supporting female people!' ing those who object too..). But they are not the reason for it.

This ^^

Female people do not have the power to get things changed, regardless of how they identify.

@SweetMeadow

I used to half read some of the posts on here about women being undermined and forgotten about through these kind of initiatives and wokeness (mostly because I didn’t have the time or energy to read up about it) but this latest development has made me snap. I will now make much more of an effort to keep up to date with what is happening because I really feel like women are the ones being thrown under the bus.

You’re absolutely right. I remember a little drip feed of stories that I was vaguely aware of. Then I read an article about self id and thought about the likely impact of that and I couldn’t look away.

I first noticed the global campaign for the decoupling of the word woman from women’s health and biological functions in Canada where the main Canadian midwifery website had started using birthing parent etc and had removed the word mother (I didn’t realise at that time how bad things were in Canada).

Why would anyone in their right mind support a campaign to make important health information HARDER for women (and only women) to access?