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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Meeting today

30 replies

MBforever · 02/02/2021 09:01

Name changed for this. I work for an organisation that is in the Stonewall top 100. I'm in management and part of my remit is equalities. Unfortunately, I'm a gender critical feminist and genuinely can't speak out at work.
I'm going to be in a meeting next week to discuss LGBT history month and how to celebrate it remotely. I'll keep my mouth shut if the subject gets onto the Stonewall riots! I wonder if there are any people I could put forward who are out of the norm but who are unimpeachable?

OP posts:
thinkingaboutLangCleg · 02/02/2021 09:15

Good luck, MBForever. I can’t think of anyone instantly, but will try to during the day.

Quadzilla · 02/02/2021 09:17

Anne Lister - a genuine lesbian groundbreaker. She must have caused a right stink at the time, refusing to comply to stereotypes of her sex and being openly into women.

ErrolTheDragon · 02/02/2021 09:25

@Quadzilla

Anne Lister - a genuine lesbian groundbreaker. She must have caused a right stink at the time, refusing to comply to stereotypes of her sex and being openly into women.
Good call - should be pretty well known because of 'Gentleman Jack', but people may not be aware that just a couple of years ago when a blue plaque was installed for her, the first attempt airbrushed out her sexuality (see wiki page en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anne_Lister) .
dumpling23 · 02/02/2021 09:26

I was just logging in to say Anne Lister too. We need some lesbians to suggest - unfortunately, I don't know the history very well! (Well, no doubt it hasn't been very thoroughly written... )

I completely hear you about being able to speak up. But if your organisation is Stonewall top 100 - you'll be interested to read this:

legalfeminist.org.uk/2021/02/01/submission-and-compliance/

Biscuitsanddoombar · 02/02/2021 09:28

I’d enthusiastically promote lesbians as much as possible

Ann lister
Ladies of llangollen
Martina Navratilova
Mary benson
Lady una troubridge

teawamutu · 02/02/2021 09:33

Storm Delaverie, who actually sparked the Stonewall riots? If you get in there first with the suggestion and limit Stonewall to that?

weebarra · 02/02/2021 09:38

Dumpling, that's very very interesting! Thank you! And yes, I was very keen to put lesbians front and centre!

ErrolTheDragon · 02/02/2021 10:10

Focussing on lesbians is a good idea but it might be wise to have some names from the other categories up your sleeve if they're required. Gay men - Turing would be an obvious choice. Trans - Jan Morris, died last year so now 'historical', a pioneer 'old school transsexual', and an interesting person apart from being trans.

Shedbuilder · 02/02/2021 10:18

[quote dumpling23]I was just logging in to say Anne Lister too. We need some lesbians to suggest - unfortunately, I don't know the history very well! (Well, no doubt it hasn't been very thoroughly written... )

I completely hear you about being able to speak up. But if your organisation is Stonewall top 100 - you'll be interested to read this:

legalfeminist.org.uk/2021/02/01/submission-and-compliance/[/quote]
Dumpling, I've just read the Legal Feminist article and I think it's very, very important in the way it demonstrates how organisations have to submit to everything Stonewall insists on (even when Stonewall are wrong about the law) and shows extreme bias in the direction of transgender people. The fact that this is all based on Edinburgh University's submission is important.

Looks as if their training might actually be sexist — and that needs to be challenged.

It seems to me to be so important that I'd like it to have a thread of its own. Would you start one or shall I?

JaimeLeeCurtains · 02/02/2021 10:20

I'd go with Sappho and her circle - the island of Lesbos, etymology of 'lesbian' etc. Beautiful poetry and important ancient history.

gardenbird48 · 02/02/2021 10:33

@teawamutu

Storm Delaverie, who actually sparked the Stonewall riots? If you get in there first with the suggestion and limit Stonewall to that?
And Fred Sargeant, founder member of the Stonewall charity and able to give a personal and accurate account of who was present at the riots (and more importantly who wasn’t). In any case it might be worth be armed with the facts in case it gets brought up.

He was on Twitter until recently but something seems to have happened to him.

gardenbird48 · 02/02/2021 10:35

There is a thread on this started last night btw

Shedbuilder · 02/02/2021 10:56

Thanks, I just spotted it. I've forwarded the article of the LGB Alliance.

NotAnotherFeckingMuftiDay · 02/02/2021 18:21

Maureen Colquhoun - the first openly lesbian (or gay) MP.

twitter.com/helenlewis/status/1356621390577819650?s=20

StillWeRise · 02/02/2021 18:31

Lily Parr
footballer

StillWeRise · 02/02/2021 18:33

I was sent a list for this , 3 men (who I didn't bother to look at as our service is for women) Lily Parr was one of the women (great) but the other was Maya Angelou, great poet but as far as I know straight- at least she had a few husbands? confusing

MujeresLibres · 02/02/2021 18:54

Was just going to say Margaret Colquhoun, she'd be a good one especially as it was kind of forgotten that there'd already been an openly lesbian MP.

Cismyfatarse · 02/02/2021 19:01

Maureen Colquhoon (who has just died. First 'out' lesbian in Parliament).

Soontobe60 · 02/02/2021 19:16

[quote dumpling23]I was just logging in to say Anne Lister too. We need some lesbians to suggest - unfortunately, I don't know the history very well! (Well, no doubt it hasn't been very thoroughly written... )

I completely hear you about being able to speak up. But if your organisation is Stonewall top 100 - you'll be interested to read this:

legalfeminist.org.uk/2021/02/01/submission-and-compliance/[/quote]
I read this today with interest. It’s enlightening to say the least.

thinkingaboutLangCleg · 02/02/2021 19:28

I came back to offer three lesbian poets: African-American activist Audre Lord, our own recent poet laureate Carol Ann Duffy, and the Makar (poet laureate of Scotland) Jackie Kay.

And I discovered Lily Parr! I’d never heard of this footballing legend. Always something interesting to learn on Mumsnet.

SqueakyCarrots · 02/02/2021 19:33

This isn’t exactly ‘history’ but Jacquelin Wilson.

I think a children’s author with her standing, (awards, well known tv series) and who centres girl characters often and writes about kids in care, and other side lined issues kids have to deal with in reality, is pretty incredible.

weebarra · 02/02/2021 21:11

I like these! Might go with the Scottish ones as we are a Scottish org!

SqueakyCarrots · 02/02/2021 21:19

Tracey Heard is a great Scottish lesbian poet. Dead redhead is an incredible collection.

Isn’t Jackie Kay problematic? It’s along time since I read it but we did (I think) trumpet at uni, gender and language course, and i seem to recall the obvious interpretation taught was its basically a transman who gas lit a woman into a marriage of what constitutes sexual assault or stealth rape. A lot like boys don’t cry- as in the character was presenting as a man, having sex with a woman as a man, without the woman knowing or consenting to sex with a woman. Not too sure that’s the best option.