Amnesty - “no such thing as a biologically male/female body”

[NellieEllie]

A week ago I saw that Amnesty had responded to a complaint about the open letter signed in Ireland and in that response had said the above.
I wrote to Amnesty as a long time supporter and queried whether this was their official stance, and have today received a reply.
This is an extract - see esp para 3.

“We stand over the letter, which we signed to stand in solidarity with the trans community and against those spreading hate.

There are attempts to decontextualise certain phrases used in the letter in a way that misleads and confuses people, which is a common tactic used against many of our human rights campaigns. For example, the letter asks for media and politicians to not give legitimacy to those spreading vitriol or misinformation. This is being framed as a call to take away their political representation, which anyone reading the letter will clearly see is not what it means.

Another example is the letter’s referring to those ‘defending biology’. Allowing self-determination of our bodies is a basic principle of feminism and human rights. There is no such thing as a ‘biologically female/male body’ - a person’s genitalia doesn’t determine their gender. Those that seek to exclude and disenfranchise groups of people, or force people into one gender or their other on that basis, are working against basic human rights principles.

We feel much of the current media reporting and conversations on social media with regards to self-identification is misguided. Restricting the rights of transgender people, and omitting the use of inclusive language will not advance or protect women’s rights.“

I was hoping that it was a case of an earnest woke teen manning the social media account, but clearly not.
How can they promote such doublespeak? Their last magazine was full of references to women in developing countries - do they REALLY think that there is no such class? “A person’s genitalia does not determine gender” is a separate statement - but they are conflating the two and specifically denying biology.

I am so wearied by this nonsense.

@StrippedFridge

All of transgenderism appears to be based on deep-seated sexist beliefs. Lady brains and all that.

I worked for Amnesty a very long time ago. We researched horrifying abuse of peoples. I still have nightmares about it. Those things have not been eradicated. Far far from it. How the fuck did they lose their way so badly? Are the Irish researchers avoidant of information about torture and murder because it is so disturbing and so they play with "nice" abuse like mis-gendering? I cannot imagine how a person could spend their days immersed in the type of data I was immersed in and then think hey yeah I need to focus on educating the world that gender expression is more important than sex, that's where I will spend my social capital.

FFS people across the world are being tortured and enslaved. Sort yourselves out Amnesty. You are implying that torture, slavery, rape and murder are no longer a bother.

I absolutely agree with this, especially your final paragraph.

I remember the reason I became an Amnesty supporter two decades ago. I received a pack detailing how household items could become instruments of torture. It was necessarily graphic and I was shocked into action.

Now they're fighting for the rights of men to have sex with unwilling women, and for people to have their self-image propped up. Pffft.

It’s almost as if they have been taken over isn’t it?

There is no inevitability to freedom and "progress" persisting in any country. I don't think people in the secular rich West properly grasp that

This is so, so true. Amnesty used to know this.

@merrymouse

Completely agree that this is a "luxury belief" held by people who aren't aware or are happy to ignore that even in countries like the UK women's equality is built on a scaffolding of legislation - access to birth control, maternity rights, legislation on rape, property and employment etc. - that has only existed for a short time and can be taken away.

You need a huge amount of privilege to believe that if your civil liberties are threatened, anyone will care about your sense of self.

Excellent post

And having read that passionate post by StrippedFridge, (someone who knows in detail the nature of Amnesty's once important work) I note that it's been deleted

@persistentwoman

And having read that passionate post by StrippedFridge, (someone who knows in detail the nature of Amnesty's once important work) I note that it's been deleted

What?!

Wtf is happening this afternoon, is it a full moon or something?

I don't see what was wrong with that post?

First two lines disapproved of maybe?

"Appears to be"

Handily, enough of you quoted it that it's still readable. Can't really see what was wrong with it... The fragility of society and the horror of what happens in the world are very scary.

I think what made certain scenes in the Handmaid's Tale so horrifying was the juxtaposition of where it was happening. Surely the liberal, rich, west would never abuse people so blatantly, that just happens elsewhere. Except it doesn't, it happens everywhere and ignoring it to navel gaze is unhelpful.

That’s the only thing I could see that could be on the no-no list. She didn’t ask for a deletion either so it must’ve been a complaint?

How is it not based on that?

The idea of being transgender necessarily requires fixed ideas about men and women, and the idea of feeling yourself to be inhabiting a sexed body out of kilter with your personal self identity.

blimey to a mod deleting StrippedFridge 's excellent post, and even more blimey to anyone reporting it. have a word with your self

of course transgenderism is sexist. the core tenet is that there are personality traits intrinsic to men and women. that's sexism 101

They have lost their minds. This is delusional. It's like an extreme parody of Orwell.

Maybe they need an intervention or rescuing? Shall we set up a campaign? Save Amnasty (from itself). Liberty is a long lost cause...

Amnesty for Amnesty

I quit Amnesty some time ago over its prostitution policy.

Could it be one of those amnesties like where in the interests of making the world a better place, everyone has x amount of days to hand in their misogynistic, homophobic, sexist, anti-scientific, anti-safeguarding, authoritarian views at the nearest safe place, with no questions asked?

Perfect

Excellent post StrippedFridge. Can we try to reword it?
The horrors of what amnesty knows about vs hurt feelings because you can’t change with the 13 year old girls.

So many important posts on this thread and I am sorry to see the Eyes have been busy today on what looks to have been some excellent posts.

MoltenLasagne and persistentwoman your posts really resonated with me. I really don’t understand where the conspiracy theories fit in to all this (did we always have conspiracy theories but now social media makes them more visible and more shareable, or is this new?) but this is so fundamental:

Society and justice depend on truths and facts.

It’s the lying that gets to me. Individual lying is bad enough but organisational-level lying with bad consequences for non-believers in the lie... it’s just terrifying. I hadn’t thought of it this way before but all the lying and gaslighting IS absolutely unpicking the glue that keeps us all together.
The trust, shared language, democratic principles, this dogma is chipping massive cracks in all of that.

@ChattyLion, funnily enough I was listening to a programme about conspiracy theories on the World Service earlier. I think it's fair to say that the internet has helped spread conspiracy theories but they've probably always been there. Back in the early twentieth century we had "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion" faked papers purported to be written by high up Jews about how they would take over the world and there have been many more since.

I think the internet helps the likes of those who faked that text back then spread their hatred. I definitely think that the conspiracy theories that are doing the rounds now are as hateful and dangerous as the protocols of the elders of Zion and far more widespread. Late 20th century theories, that I was aware of, were more along the lines of who was behind the assassination of JFK and was princess Diana knocked off. (Former, some very shady shit there. The latter, yeah, no). Since 9/11 we're overflowing with them.

Most people will believe at least one conspiracy theory and that's fair enough because conspiracies exist, but there are people who believe multiple theories, antivax, Obama's birth certificate, paedophile pizza restaurants, the queen is a lizard, etc, and people like Steve Bannon can target them with algorithms for ads on Facebook. Education helps, but when we are so clearly being gaslit by governments and this sort of shit from the likes of Amnesty it's harder and harder to hold on to what is real.

I was using Smile on Amazon to donate to amnesty international but I got an email from th the Vagina Museum asking people to swap to them. Frankly, I'm amazed that the vagina museum hasn't been targeted by TRAs but so far, so good. Unless they go full "people who were born with a vagina" , they'll have my support.

The vagina museum has gone full 'people with vaginas'. The word woman appears on their website a handful of times and only in relation to being trans inclusive.