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Original poster

Simulated pregnancy and induced lactation

352 replies

GingerAndTheBiscuits · 30/09/2020 13:32

Should possibly come with all sorts of trigger/content warnings.

DH just sent me this:

twitter.com/godblesstoto/status/1311050509072113664?s=20

TW simulating pregnancy and birth (in a house where their STBEx-wife and children live), already “planning” that the baby will be stillborn, and then wondering aloud if someone will lend them a baby to breastfeed.

All in a group for mothers taking medication so they can produce milk for their babies. Given how poor breastfeeding support is for many mothers in all parts of the world I can’t work out whether I’m more offended, disgusted, or terrified that this person has centred themselves and has people cheering them on.

DH questioned why women were commenting in support - I said it was part of the socialisation to “be nice”. His response was that it’s not being nice, it’s dangerous. And he’s right, but why can so many women not see it? Does it go beyond socialisation? According to other posts in the thread women were removed from the group for saying the person’s post was offensive/triggering to those who had experienced the loss of a child.

I don’t even know why I’m posting it really, other than I was so agog and this is one of the few places open to comment on things since I abandoned twitter

OP posts:
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Kantastic · 01/10/2020 00:55

oh god. this thread. Flowers to all of you.

I saw elsewhere that women were suggesting that this person should BORROW A BABY so they can "breastfeed" it with whatever substance the nipples are leaking - and some were even saying they'd lend their own children if they weren't unfortunately too far away. So I was brimming over with that too-familiar sense of baffled, outraged, frustration before I opened this thread.

But now I've read it... How DARE [they]. Why are women letting [them]? Why are twisted, fetishistic [people] being enabled to act out like this, making a pantomime mockery out of women's pain? I hate this so much, I wish we could stop it. And even if all this bullshit were magically stopped in its tracks tomorrow nothing can ever erase the knowledge that this was allowed to happen, that the world thinks so little of women that it allowed this to happen.

I'm so sorry to all of you who've had your trauma reactivated by this horror show of a person.

thinkingaboutLangCleg · 01/10/2020 01:06

TW simulating pregnancy and birth (in a house where their STBEx-wife and children live), already “planning” that the baby will be stillborn, and then wondering aloud if someone will lend them a baby to breastfeed.

Sick beyond belief. I don’t understand anyone who colludes with this.

All my sympathy to women who have suffered a stillbirth.

AngeloMysterioso · 01/10/2020 01:13

Not least his own wife... someone asked him if she was being supportive, he replied “My future ex-wife has had a lot of trouble watching me going through this experience. She had two very difficult pregnancies, so it is triggering for her. Also, there are deep and dividing feelings about me in general, which just makes everything that much more emotional and difficult”

He also repeatedly refers to himself as his children’s Mom. I feel so, so sorry for his wife.

AngeloMysterioso · 01/10/2020 01:18

Imagine being legally bound to this person...

“Please use 'assigned male at birth' instead of 'male born body.' I am female, which isn't bound by biological terms.”

BlackWaveComing · 01/10/2020 01:22

His poor wife and kids...

iguanadonna · 01/10/2020 06:42

If his 'uncooperative' wife should happen to find her way here, then she might like to know there's a TransWidows thread where she'll find support. If anyone knows her, they might want to point her to it.

Angelo FGS tell them why you're leaving if you go!

Frazzled13 · 01/10/2020 06:59

@AngeloMysterioso

Oh and let’s not forget a couple of weeks back when he had the gall to ask this question

“For anyone that has gone through a stillbirth or miscarriage and is willing to share their experience with me, what did you do to help you get through that very emotional loss? Your stories and advice may help me get through my own grief that I am almost sure to experience in the very near future.”

I mean he’s quite the method actor, gotta give him that. The man works like de Niro.

That is insane.

Talking about the grief to come like it’s inevitable, like there’s no option to just, I don’t know, maybe not pretend your baby died! And to ask for experiences, from people who would have done anything to not go through it, (and certainly would never fucking simulate it) is disgusting.

testing987654321 · 01/10/2020 07:16

I know this case is particularly shocking. It's hard to understand why he has got this far.

But then I remember that as a society we have put rapists in women's prisons and have forgotten what a woman is. This is simply the logical conclusion of going along with untruths.

sqirrelfriends · 01/10/2020 07:21

@AngeloMysterioso

Imagine being legally bound to this person...

“Please use 'assigned male at birth' instead of 'male born body.' I am female, which isn't bound by biological terms.”

I can't, and sadly society isn't even on her side anymore. She's the bad guy for not putting up with it, for being "uncooperative" Hmm

I honestly thought "female" was the one word women could keep seeing as its 100% tied up in biology? Do we really have to share that too?

highame · 01/10/2020 07:22

I am just so relieved that the page has been removed. Perhaps the group will reflect

testing987654321 · 01/10/2020 07:31

I honestly thought "female" was the one word women could keep seeing as its 100% tied up in biology? Do we really have to share that too?

Where have you been the last few years? There is no word which applies to women that some men don't want. Daughter, mum, aunt, girl, she, her etc

It's why the pushback starts with woman. Woman does not mean a male person. If we get that right the rest falls into place as well.

GCNewbie · 01/10/2020 07:43

I knew several weeks before birth that my baby was almost certainly going to be stillborn. I can guarantee that the birth isn't something that you gleefully look forward to.

After my baby was stillborn, I physically ached for her. When I told the midwife, she explained that it's caused by the birth hormones - the same that gives you the immediate bond with your newborn.

My husband suffered - we both desperately wanted our baby to have survived. But he did not have the birth to recover from or the "new baby" hormones to cope with. No one can experience that unless they have lived the experience.

It is hard to get the support you need after your baby is stillborn. Often you don't know what support you need until you find the right thing for you. Someone finding the support that works for them and then having that taken away is horrendous.

HecatesHat · 01/10/2020 07:46

I'm so sorry GC Thanks

AppleJane · 01/10/2020 07:47

If people are going to encourage this sort of behaviour from mentally ill people then I hope they are all held accountable if one day it results in someone committing fetal abduction.

Unbelievable.

nepeta · 01/10/2020 07:51

So very sorry GCNewbie
Flowers

Kit19 · 01/10/2020 07:53

This is a whole nother level of messed up. I would love to know what the women cheerleading them on are getting from it. I cannot get my head around the fact they supported this person over an actual woman who’d had a still birth

nepeta · 01/10/2020 07:59

sqirrelfriends:
"I honestly thought "female" was the one word women could keep seeing as its 100% tied up in biology? Do we really have to share that too?"

Yes. I researched this last spring. The reason forcalling female people 'uterus-havers' or 'menstruators' and worse is that some (all?) trans activists will not allow 'female' to be used in the biological sense.

Only specific body parts may be used when a reference to female biology is absolutely needed in order to maintain a definition of 'woman' which does not exclude trans women, and that is why we are menstruators and so on.

GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman · 01/10/2020 08:00

GCNewbie Flowers

I had a miscarriage and that was bad enough. I cannot image the pain of a stillbirth.

This person's antics make me feel physically nauseated. Attention seeking at the least, cruel to STBX, utterly selfish and self-centred.

TheAdventuresoftheWishingChair · 01/10/2020 08:37

This person has a seven year old child. Imagine a seven year old being exposed to weeks of this.

This individual is going to spend the rest of his life saying he's had a stillbirth, isn't he? He's going to be in support groups with women who've genuinely had them and be asking for support with his grief. He's going to get it, too, from people who are highly vulnerable and who have genuinely been bereaved.

I am dismayed by the fact that so many women are playing along with this and not telling him to get to fuck. It says so much about this whole debate, doesn't it?

iguanadonna · 01/10/2020 08:43

This is a very useful analysis of a similar case where a non-female insisted on actually giving drug-induced 'milk' to a newborn and was reported as a medical success.

https://lascapigliata8.wordpress.com/2018/03/26/analysis-of-study-of-induced-lactation-in-trans-identified-man/amp/?twitterr_impression=true

sqirrelfriends · 01/10/2020 09:20

@iguanadonna thanks, that was a very interesting read.

It's worrying how little concern there was for the infant, what they were drinking and how it measured up to breastmilk (especially considering the patients testosterone levels were near-normal for an adult male) It's all about making the new "mother" feel good.

iguanadonna · 01/10/2020 09:25

Yes, and how scientific method gets thrown to the wind when it's about affirming this nonsense.

Haworthia · 01/10/2020 09:26

This story is horrifying to the core.

I can’t believe the women in that Facebook group pandering to this delusion.

Antibles · 01/10/2020 10:25

Trolling, gaslighting, obscenely offensive.

For that group to support this at all, let alone at the expense of a woman who has actually suffered a stillbirth...

What some men's minds are capable of beggars belief.

It seems there are no depths they will not plumb.

DreadPirateLuna · 01/10/2020 11:02

I can't imagine an adult human female getting away with this. I mean, I can imagine a mentally ill woman, perhaps further traumatized by fertility struggles, deciding she was "pregnant" and even simulating it in some way. But I can't imagine anyone would indulge her rather than direct her to the psychiatric help she so obviously needed.