Anyone else sick of still seeing Pride logos everywhere?

[Divoc2020]

I don't have a problem with Pride, and its role in raising awareness etc in the way that many campaigns have awareness days/ weeks etc. I can remember when it used to be a week, then it became a month (June). All fine.

But I've just seen John Lewis still has its Pride logo on its Facebook page, as does one of our local council pages and the Twitter feed of a group affiliated to the local police.

Surely the point of a month-long campaign is that it is, er, a month and then you revert back to your usual branding, or else the impact is lost?

I have to confess, some of this is a design and marketing issue for me, as the Pride versions of high street logos are usually appalling - the John Lewis one being a case in point!

Plus the trans flag too. It’s becoming everything to everyone. But why add BAME to the mix?

If the trans flag is added now too, I'm assuming to show inclusion of BAME trans men and women, not just white ones? To be including of everyone?

Sounds like a more inclusive flag to me, can't see a problem if that's the case

Why need to include the BAME ‘flag’ as this is covered by the pride one anyway.

Thanks to those who came out here to try to add meaning breaking down this catch all inclusive flag waving alphabet soup of sexual variations I never knew existed in the real world outside of online media.

It has been a fascinating journey but I doubt I will be able to keep up with all the evolving tastes and private lifestyles between consenting adults.

Not sure what children make of all this as it is already baffling to me as a mother from dare I say a conventional upbringing (if that is not inadvertently politically incorrect to mention).

I really feel that so many have lost the power of critical thought and independent thinking by diluting what was once a straightforward easy to understand equality issue (with justifiable recent new laws). Now to me as a regular uninitiated layperson I find this all really confusing as to what these businesses are supporting or jointly promoting.

I will just educate the little ones as it’s all part of diversity and inclusiveness as we are all very different but fit into certain categories if and when those questions need to be answered. Perhaps going forward for future generations the adults of tomorrow will be more able to find and follow their own path in life without any justification as evidently there is fast becoming an infinitely of different life choices and each with equal respect and recognition.

This message is obviously not concerning anything to do with minors as that is so wrong on too many levels to even think about and surely much hated by the gay community as well as society in general.

Whatever favour you are we are just people so enjoy it your way and no need to justify it to others who are like me open minded and will not be prejudiced against anything that appears different as we all evidently all different in so many ways.

@SerenityNowwwww

The new flag - who came up with this and how did it get so much traction so fast? I saw it on the mencap twitter feed. Where will it end?

I find the inclusion of the black/brown flag really odd. Not because I don't think racial discrimination is a problem, but it seems like a sort of different problem. Like, do we just make one flag for all the trendy causes, no matter if they seem really related?

Why need to include the BAME ‘flag’ as this is covered by the pride one anyway.

Especially when activists have used people of colour in terrible ways. But insinuating that because we "let" black women into single sex spaces we should allow male bodied people as well. They are nothing more than a human shield to activists so to pretend they suddenly care about them on the flag is hypocritical IMO

I'm not part of the alphabet soup. Looking at it from the outside, as it were, the whole leaping on the bandwagon stuff seems very precarious. Yes, all these companies are plastering their woke credentials all over the place just now, but how many of them are actually following through with meaningful action? Lip service doesn't actually do anything, and those PR budgets will be tighter than ever soon, so some of it might just ebb away. Which will be a damn shame.

Lip service doesn't actually do anything, and those PR budgets will be tighter than ever soon, so some of it might just ebb away. Which will be a damn shame

Thing is it costs thousands of pounds and months ilif an employers time to put the work in fir their champion status and ehen then it becomes basically unachievable when the emphasis on trans inclusion gets added into the mix when the suggestions etc are given. Probably we Nottinghamshire police dropped it all...

Yep, that bandwagon is starting to look pretty overloaded... there are almost more people in it than off it. I wonder when the wheels will start to come off.

Yes, all these companies are plastering their woke credentials all over the place just now, but how many of them are actually following through with meaningful action?

If they do follow through, it seems to be far more about supporting the T (pronouns in email signatures, gender-neutral toilets) than about supporting the LGB.

It’s cheap - some marketing swag and an induction meeting by some group or other to get their ‘credentials’. So much cheaper and prettier than handrails, wheelchair ramps, childcare vouchers, Braille signs, BSL interpreters for events, wider doors, disabled loos, lower baby changing facilities, easy to turn on/off taps, alarm bells........ (actual inclusion).

@SerenityNowwwww

It’s cheap - some marketing swag and an induction meeting by some group or other to get their ‘credentials’. So much cheaper and prettier than handrails, wheelchair ramps, childcare vouchers, Braille signs, BSL interpreters for events, wider doors, disabled loos, lower baby changing facilities, easy to turn on/off taps, alarm bells........ (actual inclusion).

Precisely. Those are all measureable, provable changes that bring real world benefits to those who need them. Adding a rainbow flag to their websites does stuff all. Except perhaps gets the businesses a share of the rainbow pound.

It was suggested that I pride-ify our website.

I asked exactly what they (as a business) hoped to gain (and sales people need £££ figures) and said that if I did it for Pride I would also - as a matter of principle - also do it for IWD, Earth Day, etc etc etc and I had too much to do as it is, however the agency could do it for £££.

I suggested if they really wanted to celebrate Pride they gave a donation to a relevant charity. However I am always happy to get in bsl interpreters for round tables and training (and boy, does that cost).

So they didn't go ahead with pridefying it Serenity ?

That kind of proves they were just leaping onto the unicorn in order to grab a share of the profits, rather than truly believing it, in that case. The problem is that virtue signalling like this is that it doesn't improve things for the group who it's supposed to help, whilst simultaneously managing to have a detrimental effect on a different group (women and girls). The unintended consequences are pretty fucking scary.

(this was 2019)... No I didnt - not without a business case (I've been doing this for almost 30 years - they can't slip a hobby horse past me) - and there just wasn't one. It was purely for show (considering that we are a pretty diverse business anyway when it comes to sex, sexuality, race and ethnicity).

There was absolutely no benefit to to the business nor any relevance either. I promote some industry things - 'up and coming' professionals, 'women in...' groups (a pretty male industry), mental healthcare charities for the industry, and charities that we sponsor (foodbanks, kids and mental health).

A couple of the guys(those who suggested it actually) were running a half marathon and I suggested they should raise awareness/ money that way. They didn't. Nor did they wear Aids ribbons (I asked them where their ribbons were - hardly saw a single one last year).

But insinuating that because we "let" black women into single sex spaces we should allow male bodied people as well. They are nothing more than a human shield to activists so to pretend they suddenly care about them on the flag is hypocritical IMO

The way that TRAs have lumped in black women with males as a 'subset of women' is just so blatantly racist, and they don't actually care about black women, they just see them as a handy tool for making certain arguments. Its one of the most unpleasant aspects (and there are many of those!) to the whole thing to be honest.

The Trans flag itself is a load of sexist crap anyway - pink for girls and blue for boys? Nope, no regressive stereotypes to be seen here!

The whole ‘letting’ black people etc. We didn’t ever have segregation laws here did we - that’s a US thing (and scarily recent).

It’s still a bloody woman! She’s not a different species!

I think people are waking up to the homphobia within the movement now. Especially as we now have the lgb alliance . They desperately need to tie it to someone else's rights as it doesn't stand up to scrutiny on its own.

Makes no sense really to link it to race though. Given the ideology puts BAME women at the bottom of the pile its a really weird mix tbh.

I have every sympathy with many minority positions, but there's a fundamentalism to the woke fringe which seems to now require bending the knee.

One tiny recent example - a "request" that everyone at work add their pronouns to their email signatures to "show support for diversity and inclusion".

Fuck. Off.

It shows nothing for goodness sake! If you work somewhere or have a supplier/contact who chooses to use pronouns that are different from their sex/or none - you know all about it.

To try to make everyone play this game is just being silly. What next - add race, religion, star sign or mention if you have/don't have a disability or 'condition'? Or maybe if someone has been the victim of a crime, or gone to boarding school?

The thing that confuses me the most now is the lumping-in of BAME people with the LGBT alphabet soup. This assumption that non-white people are a homogeneous lump of rainbow-warrior oppressedness. A group of people that large and diverse is always going to have a huge range of views on any given subject and the woke powers-that-be have conveniently forgotten that some BAME people hold conservative and/or religious viewpoints on quite a lot of things.

They desperately need to tie it to someone else's rights as it doesn't stand up to scrutiny on its own.

Only ever the bits of rights that are convenient to their male members though; there's no genuine care about those groups and their rights, it's total hypocrisy based on trying to push other people's buttons in their favour. Black women, sometimes shouting about some bits of their rights proves useful to manipulate people. BAME women of cultures and faiths who will be excluded from any provisions at all including many forms of health care under their ideology?

Not an issue at all. That's fine.

To simplify: female people's rights only matter when they are of advantage male people. Female rights that only benefit female people? No.

Whatever favour you are we are just people so enjoy it your way and no need to justify it to others who are like me open minded and will not be prejudiced against anything that appears different as we all evidently all different in so many ways

I like this, and agree