Munroe Bergdorf

[ripples101]

I am trans.

I was a follower of Munroe Bergdorf’s Instagram.

Munroe wrote a post about JK Rowling, calling her a dangerous woman to the trans community. Munroe stayed something along the lines of

“JKR is a dangerous cisgendered, white woman who is causing harm”

I replied to this post, asking why Munroe felt it necessary to mention JK Rowing’s racial identity.

I wasn’t Abusive. I just felt that it wasn’t necessary, in regards to what Munroe was being critical of, to mention JK Rowling’s ethnicity.

Within minutes my post was deleted and I was blocked.

I am trans, and Munroe has silenced me.

So it seems nothing can be questioned. Any intent to ask a question, or to strike up debate, will be met with being silenced.

This is fast turning into propaganda. This is fast turning into thought crime. This is fast turning into silencing. This is fast turning into something it should never have been.

When a trans person isn’t even able to question another trans person, what chance do “people who belong to sex that menstruate”* have?

• Christ, I don’t even feel like I can use the word women here without being controversial.

I am so sorry for people to whom I thought I identified alongside (trans people) who are doing this to you. I feel sick and ashamed of what I am, because of people who are representing me.

I feel like I literally have no space left. And I can’t help but feel that a lot of biological woman are feeling the same way. And you have so much more to lose than I ever will, so I simply can’t imagine how this is making you all feel.

JKRs experiences as a woman, and remember she hasn’t always been wealthy, are what make her a suitable spokesperson on women’s rights.

Indeed.

Ironic how MB wants to shut down JK because she is a white, powerful woman. But also shuts down an unknown, not powerful transwoman.

It's almost as though silencing is conditional upon whether you agree with MB or not.

how many black billionaire authors are there?

What a stupid argument. How many billionaire authors of any race are there? I think there's been exactly one in history (and she's not a billionaire any more because she gave so much to charity.)

Sure JKR has benefited from white privilege. MB has benefited from male privilege. And MB, who has a history of openly threatening violence during their various petulant tantrums, doesn't get to tell a woman who's been subjected to male violence to shut up.

And no, they don't get to leverage race to silence her when the dynamic of trans politics in the UK is about a group of powerful white males lobbying to remove the rights of women and children of all races.

@BaronessBrighterThanYou

To summarise MB's position:

I will talk about being a woman because I feel like one.

You may not talk about women because you're a white one.

What a wanker, eh?

Very succinct.

And if any of you go on a woman's march, you can't talk about anything I disapprove of.

Just catching up.

'And someone came here for a good ol' girly cry about it cos they were blocked for trolling her about it?'

A good ol' girly cry?

That's a very sexist thing to say.

Super sexist.

The dynamic of using that phrase to a transwoman feels disconcerting to me as well. Can't put my finger on why.

The wanker comment is bang on.

Nasty wasn't it, Shiny

Fuck me, as a white woman with clear and undisputed privilege please do tell me exactly which women's issues I'm permitted to have an opinion on and discuss.

Does MB have any disabilities?

As a person with a disability I'd like MB to STFU.

That's how this game works I think?

(I don't actually want to know, it's s general point).

The person with the most oppression points gets to say what everyone else can and can't talk about.

Problem is the people with the most oppression points are actually the least likely to be heard at all.

@MadBadDaddy

TheSingingKettle49 a white person saying 'what has race got to do with it?' to a person-of-colour is like a man saying 'what has gender got to do with it?' to a woman. Both are silencing, and speaking from their privilege If, as is the case here, this was in relation to a far broader point, should this hypothetical woman take the time & energy to attempt to educate such a man, or should she block him and move on? Wouldn't you support her choice, either way?

Surely it depends on the subject being discussed?

MB is disagreeing with JKR and disputing her suitability to appoint herself as spokesperson for anyone. Her enormous privileges are a factor.

disputing her suitability as a spokesperson for anyone? And is this what you believe too? Do you support MB in this belief?

A good thing that I, and a great swathe of the female population, do feel that her voice is a welcome addition to the debate that is now happening after the entire fiasco of 'no debate'. Because her experience and struggle has NOT been negated by her wealth and the privileges gained since. What her new privileges have done has allowed her to keep talking without losing her job and her livelihood. Because she cannot be 'cancelled'.

She also probably has more lived experience in what it means to be a women in a male dominated industry, to survive abuse and to get ahead as a single parent than many people.

Shall we go back to discusses the events that prompted her tweets and why they are relevant to her actual tweets? She is discussing this from an angle of being a women and the impacts of rights that cause conflict to these, safeguarding children and their health and she is pointing out abuse from activists on twitter. She is in fact a far more credible ambassador for women rights and MB ever could be. And has suffered far more abuse lately than MB has probably experienced too.

By the way, as a female, she still relies on the laws these rights relate to for her protection too.

Why should JKR be silent again?

Problem is the people with the most oppression points are actually the least likely to be heard at all.

And that's the grift.

@ShinyFootball

Just catching up.

'And someone came here for a good ol' girly cry about it cos they were blocked for trolling her about it?'

A good ol' girly cry?

That's a very sexist thing to say.

Super sexist.

The dynamic of using that phrase to a transwoman feels disconcerting to me as well. Can't put my finger on why.

When I first read that I thought "that's harsh, that'll get deleted"

The monitors must be busy or something.

ShinyFootball

yes, that good ol' girly cry comment was super nasty and super sexist.

So if I give an opinion on anything, I am appointing myself as a spokesperson for loads of people?

Lol.

@SunsetBeetch exactly, if we were discussing who could compete in dressage at the Olympics it would be totally reasonable for a man to say to a woman what’s gender got to do with it?

When I first read that I thought "that's harsh, that'll get deleted"

The monitors must be busy or something.

Probably wasn't reported, dick.

I hardly ever report posts, and certainly not those types of post. Allowing people to read them does far more good.

Datun It does go a very long way to explain the motivation of the person who posts such a hurtful comment, for sure.

Kantastic Ok fair enough. To wind it back a bit, I would bet a case of that anyone here would agree that a woman often has to work harder than a man to acheive the same level of recognition and success. Why is it so hard to see how a POC has the same kind of struggle? So white privilege exists, JKR has benefited from it, and it isn't unreasonable for a POC to point it out, especially given the current climate.

It's also not unreasonable for a POC not to indulge a 1000 fragile white commenters who need spoon feeding the basics

'Disagreeing' is not the same as 'silencing'

mobile.twitter.com/VictoriaPeckham/status/1189585183604989953

This thread reminded me of Bergdorfs last year attempt at canceling Janice over "porn star" tweets. That was all nonsense too.

What?

That makes no sense at all really, having read the entire thread.

MB told JKR to STFU about women's rights.

If JKR had been talking about BLM then then the point she is white is relevant.

It is not relevant to what JKR posted. What is relevant is that she is female.

This is going round in circles.

I don't get the sense at all from the thread that there is a general belief that white people are not advantaged in society.

@FantaOra

Yeah but Bergdorf blocked because of vanity, only wants insta to be an admiration society, so all that white fragility blahblah is wasted on a shallow puddle like Bergdorf.

Yep.

Worship at the altar of Bergdorf or get smited*

*well, blocked. You know what I mean.

Tangentially, has anyone else been watching the criticism of D’Angelo’s ‘White Fragility’ book roll across the mainstream American press? Fascinating watching the fall from grace as people realise it’s a white person’s HR ‘solution’ to race inequality and she’s making huge sums of cash without improving the lives of any actual black people.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=VxDUNg5SUNc

Robin D’Angelo is using Critical Race Theory to feather her own (white) nest, yet Munroe is going after JK and not D’Angelo?

Seems awfully as if it’s less about wealth or race or being female or ‘cis’ and more about agreeing with Munroe or not.

@BaronessBrighterThanYou

To summarise MB's position:

I will talk about being a woman because I feel like one.

You may not talk about women because you're a white one.

What a wanker, eh?

Quite!

Disagreeing' is not the same as 'silencing'

‘Blocking’ is not the same as ‘disagreeing’

So white privilege exists, JKR has benefited from it

The comment you are replying to says that already. Nobody's bloody arguing with that. What is your problem with responding to the arguments people are actually making?