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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Allison Bailey to sue Stonewall

999 replies

OhHolyJesus · 27/06/2020 08:20

There is a crowdfunder so I won't share the link but here a part of the text. It's long but brilliant and this isn't the half of it. Off to find my wallet...


The new trans activism: all scrutiny and critical voices labelled ‘transphobic’  
In early 2018, when I first heard that plans were underway to make the lives of trans people easier, my reaction was that this was a good thing and I did not give it a second thought.  I kept coming across the term ‘TERF’ but ignored it.  I thought that bigots were simply being called out.  
Then one day I clicked on a link: terfisaslur.com where someone had collated the online abuse that was being directed at women who I realised had entirely valid concerns and questions about the wisdom of replacing sex with gender. 
I learnt that the new trans activism wants to smash the distinctions between men and women; replacing sex with notions of gender identity; making sexual difference a matter of self identification; and demands that any and every man that wishes to identify as a woman must be allowed to do so.
I learnt that the new trans activism is focusing, inexplicably, on young children and declaring them ‘trans’; treating puberty as a disease to be blocked with powerful drugs; delivering our young people into the arms of a multi-million pound industry of big pharmaceutical companies and plastic surgeons. 
I saw that the same males who would have society regard them as women, were quick to brandish knives, axes, baseball bats and nooses, as they threatened with rape women who questioned the wisdom of replacing sex with gender —TERFs.
I realised that the new trans activism operated a crude but effective system of punishment and reward: agree with every demand of the trans lobby and be safe; object and face vilification, abuse, boycott, character assassination and cancellation.
I was horrified (and terrified).
I wanted to look away, to pretend that I had not seen it; that it did not reveal the worst woman-hating, lesbian hating, misogyny that I have ever come across in my lifetime. 
I did not look away and I urge others not to either.  Thanks to brave women who have come before me, such as the late, great, Magdalen Berns, whose courage and no nonsense approach to calling out the new trans activism as the men’s rights movement it so clearly is, gave me courage.
I realised that I did not have to accept that any man can claim to be legally a woman, without having to undergo any hormone or surgical intervention, psychological evaluation or risk assessment. 
I realised that it was okay and necessary to say that it is reckless and naive to think that men will only identify as women if they are stunning and brave and harmless: that the wicked, abusive, predatory, unwell and downright cantankerous will, by some miracle, refuse to take advantage of free and easy access to women, to their politics, safe spaces, sports, legal protections and identities.
I was shocked to discover that significant numbers of male sex offenders are permitted to identify as women and nothing is being done to stop them.  In England and Wales, some 40 per cent or more of trans identified males in the prison population are men with convictions for sex offences, including rape and possession of the most serious indecent images of children.  I read a steady stream of news reports from around the world of males who identify as women committing serious sex offences.
It is repugnant to me and wholly unacceptable, and frankly unbelievable, that the new trans activism demands that sex crimes committed by males who identify as women are recorded as having been committed by women; and that these males can demand to be referred to by female pronouns.
I discovered that women incarcerated in prison are left vulnerable to serious sexual assault and mental anguish, as males, including sex offenders, are locked up with them. The new trans activism demands that a man’s desire to identify as a woman is more important than the right of imprisoned women to safety and dignity.  These women have no way to escape, no choice, they are locked up. I do not see how this is anything other than state facilitated abuse and mental torture.
Where there should have been discussion, investigation and inquiry, there has been the silencing of concerned and critical voices; not voices from the far right, but from women like me, who are of and from the progressive left.
Mantras have been chanted because the new trans activism is a movement that cannot bear scrutiny: TRANS WOMEN ARE WOMEN; TRANS RIGHTS ARE HUMAN RIGHTS; TRANS PEOPLE ARE WHO THEY SAY THEY ARE; PROTECT OUR TRANS SIBLINGS, and so on, do nothing to engage with and address the serious concerns that exist about replacing sex with gender.
The new trans activists are joined by politicians, journalists, lawyers, writers, entire organisations, and assorted celebrities, in the chanting of these mantras to shut down debate, while others who are appalled at what they see happening are too afraid to speak out. It is cult like behaviour, it is Orwellian, and it has disgraced and shamed a generation.
Labelling all critical voices ‘transphobic’ is a cynical political ploy of the new trans activism. It must be resisted.  
Surviving child sexual abuse: understanding that women and girls are oppressed because of their sex and not their gender identity
The man who sexually abused me as a 9 year old little girl; the man who targeted my single-parent mother; the man who told me that I could trust him whilst he slipped drugs into my orange squash to render me helpless as he sexually assaulted me, was tried and convicted of multiple sexual assaults against me in 2015, and sentenced to 10 years imprisonment. He was released from prison last month (May 2020) to serve out the rest of his sentence on licence.  
I make this disclosure now because I feel compelled to stand in solidarity with other women with similar experiences of male physical and sexual violence. It is not weaponising trauma to say so, any more than recounting racist abuse is.  
We must not allow men or women to bury, minimise and ignore the visceral reality of male violence.  We must not allow the new trans activism to force survivors back into the closet; this would be an abuser’s charter.  
It should be a cause of great alarm that the new trans activism takes such a regressive and shaming attitude to disclosures of abuse. This culture of denial and belittling has been the bedrock and the hallmark of every abuse scandal. It is a red flag that signals a safeguarding catastrophe in the making.
It is women like me whose lives have been torn apart and seriously blighted by wanton acts of male violence that know that men are often not who they say they are or claim to be. 
I know that conflating sex with notions of gender identity will leave women with no legally enforceable boundaries against any man.  
I know that if the new trans activism is not brought to heel, women will disappear as a political class.

OP posts:
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AnyOldPrion · 12/02/2021 11:19

”White for SW says feels like Alice in Wonderland. Makes joke about cake and bottle. Case keeps getting smaller”

Hope the judge finds this “joke” as funny as I do.

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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:20

Safe Schools Alliance
@SafeSchools_UK
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#AllisonBailey

Judge Stout: How can there be a range of service providers? If you’ve discriminated, you’ve discriminated.
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Safe Schools Alliance
@SafeSchools_UK
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#AllisonBailey

RMW: I rely on the fact that we’ve given discovery. The claimant has been unhappy with discovery at every stage.

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testingmitb · 12/02/2021 11:20

They really are a bunch of fuckers, aren't they? How has Stonewall come to this?

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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:22

White wishes to dismiss words like 'influence'. Well they would wouldn't they.

LGB Alliance
@ALLIANCELGB
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2m
Judge queries this. White wants to dismiss “portmanteau words like influence” (!). Section 111.1 is hopeless. No instruction. Claimant has been unhappy with discovery at each stage.

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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:23

Judge doesn't seem to be completely buying it

LGB Alliance
@ALLIANCELGB
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59s
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@ALLIANCELGB
(W) no involvement of SW in the disciplinary action. SW must be struck out. Or deposit order point. 111.1 can’t apply. Judge refers to claimant’s GC views and SW urging action. Surely this is enough to show inducement to discriminate.

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Datun · 12/02/2021 11:23

@AnyOldPrion

”White for SW says feels like Alice in Wonderland. Makes joke about cake and bottle. Case keeps getting smaller”

Hope the judge finds this “joke” as funny as I do.

RMW has never once persuaded me on a single point they have tried to make. Apart from anything else, they don't like questions.

I wonder if the judge is getting the same impression.
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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:24

Safe Schools Alliance
@SafeSchools_UK
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2m
#AllisonBailey

Judge Stout: the essence of Stonewall complaint is the claimants tweets including allegations of Stonewall’s appalling levels of intimidation. Is that not inducement to a detriment?
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Safe Schools Alliance
@SafeSchools_UK
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#AllisonBailey

RMW: stonewall have no instruction over internal processes
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Safe Schools Alliance
@SafeSchools_UK
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40s
#AllisonBailey

RMW: talking about hypotheticals again

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Mollyollydolly · 12/02/2021 11:26

I just hope to God it makes the Judge as angry as it makes me. Disingenuous tossers.

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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:27

RMW has never once persuaded me on a single point they have tried to make. Apart from anything else, they don't like questions.

They do apparently really like hypotheticals though.

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nauticant · 12/02/2021 11:31

Maybe adherence to an inconsistent ideology makes one not so well suited to being a barrister, especially if you're going to advocate in favour of issues based on the ideology.

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KittyValentine · 12/02/2021 11:31

They really are a bunch of fuckers, aren't they? How has Stonewall come to this?

I agree. How on earth Stonewall ever thought that #nodebate and #acceptancewithoutexception would work is beyond me.

They are, effectively, telling people to shut up and do as you’re told.

No-one - no man, no woman, no teenager, no child - likes to be told that. It just gets people’s backs up!

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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:31

LOL. Stonewall accusing others of holding controversial beliefs that are not founded in solid evidence. The irony is off the scale.



LGB Alliance
@ALLIANCELGB
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@ALLIANCELGB
(W) section 111.3 about “induce” needs discriminatory intention. Derives from Union law. SW had serious concerns that controversial beliefs were expressed in a way not founded in solid evidence.

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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:33

'For whatever reason' That would be SW and GCC withholding information then.

LGB Alliance
@ALLIANCELGB
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@ALLIANCELGB
(W) evidence required. Time for discovery has passed. For whatever reason claimant has failed to give discovery. As far as indirect discrimination is concerned W says it’s impossible to discuss the claim without disclosure.

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BuntingEllacott · 12/02/2021 11:34

brass. neck.

amazing.

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SpringtimeBluebells · 12/02/2021 11:35

WOW

I saw that the same males who would have society regard them as women, were quick to brandish knives, axes, baseball bats and nooses, as they threatened with rape women who questioned the wisdom of replacing sex with gender

Just WOW

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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:36

Only a few posts left in this thread. Link to new one

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/a4163253-Allison-Bailey-to-sue-Stonewall-thread-2

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nauticant · 12/02/2021 11:37

For victimisation claim Claimant has to prove that SW knew of the alleged protected act

Which is why there is a reason to use the "philosphical belief" relied on by Maya Forstater. It's a tricky argument but it means the discrimination was clearly conscious.

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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:37

LGB Alliance
@ALLIANCELGB
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2m
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@ALLIANCELGB
(W) A text from Ms Brewer - Ms White does not like the use of the word 'influence' in relation to SW. Text read out to ask is there any influence from SW on internal difficult circumstance.

LGB Alliance
@ALLIANCELGB
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Judge disagrees - names my be the other way round as so hard to read redacted docs

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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:40

Safe Schools Alliance
A bystander that threatened reputational consequences

@SafeSchools_UK
#AllisonBailey

RMW: stonewall regards itself as a bystander in this matter and recognises the difficulties in being a diversity forward organisation

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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:41

Sorry copy and paste error the below sentence is mine not SSA

A bystander that threatened reputational consequences

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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:45

We should move to the new thread as posters are now following there
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4163253-Allison-Bailey-to-sue-Stonewall-thread-2

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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:45
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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:45
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OvaHere · 12/02/2021 11:45
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