Would you vote Conservative at the next election?

[cheeseismydownfall]

Obviously this question isn't really relevant if you vote Conservative anyway!

Over my 25-odd year voting history I have voted Lib Dem, Labour and Green. I consider myself left wing and would never have considered a Tory vote. But if the principle parties maintain their current positions on women's rights then for the first time ever I will consider a Conservative vote at the next election - not simply because this one issue trumps everything else (although I personally feel very strongly about it, education, health and the environment are still hugely important to me) but because I simply don't trust the critical thinking skills of any party who have allowed themselves to be so thoroughly hijacked by the trans rights agenda and attempt to silence dissenting voices.

Anyone else feel this way?

Nobody is saying the govt should have"shut down in February"! They are saying that they could have taken more stringent measures in mid-March, at the same time that Germany, Ireland, and Greece saw the writing on the wall and acted to reduce casualties in their populations. With an exponential growth in cases, even a day or two makes a big difference; a week would have saved thousands of lives. FFS, even the Football Association saw what was happening and stopped matches before this govt did.

So uh, my answer is no!

@KaptainKaveman

If you vote for the tories you're voting for people who endorse racism, sexism and the class divide.

What tedious, partisan BS

Sappho labour don’t even know what a woman is.

As for being the only party to acknowledge the need for single sex spaces - did you miss the fuss about Liz Truss saying she would enforce this?

Sapphos
If Keir Starmer gets off the fence and produces a clear commitment to women's rights and single sex spaces AND to toll back on the institutional capture then I will consider them.

But they have a LOT of work to do to gain trust again, with the shit show that was Corbyn, Madigan, etc.

I am putting myself at the front of the queue from now on. It's quite clear that I need to look out for my own interests and the interests of other women. This shitshow has been the biggest political shock of my life. Even as a victim of abuse and assault, I had never understood how little value or respect women have in society, it's deeply shocking.

Btw, you make your arguments ridiculous by going down the Hitler route

Yes, they are the main party making positive noises about women and I think the money they have given via the furlough scheme is good. I don't trust the SGP/Greens or lib dems, dislike much about Labour at the moment although they have improved under Kier and the SNP have some rebels but still have a pro trans line via Nicola and I hate the mess they've made of education and the way Nicola wants to do things her own way on releasing lockdown just for the sake of it.

@Aesopfable

Sappho labour don’t even know what a woman is.

As for being the only party to acknowledge the need for single sex spaces - did you miss the fuss about Liz Truss saying she would enforce this?

Yep. The pink news stated that thousands of trans women were preparing to flee the country

Also apparently 8000 ‘cis’ women have signed a petition and sent it to her saying we don’t need protection from trans women - which makes me feel sick tbh.

Even Hitler was kind to animals apparently

.The Conservative party and the Third Reich! This is the kind of laughable bankrupt analogy deployed by the kind of partisan extremist who is politically and historically illiterate.

I would be extremely unlikely to vote Conservative, simply because, while much attention has been given to the promotion of gender woo woo and the Carl Beech fiasco by the Labour party and the left the tories have been also been involved to a significant extent in the promotion of dubious persons and irrational narratives.

I am writing up on this at the moment.

I think we need to be aware of the perils of the pendulum swing in which "my enemy's enemy is my friend"

Also I am deeply concerned about the compromising of MPs and politicians of all parties right now.

There is a huge gulf between what can be seen easily and what is hidden. A person may appear to be an inspiring ally one minute and show themselves to be a completely different person the next. This is true of politicians more than any other group.

The "no education" is because the Labour influenced teaching unions aren't wanting to go back to work, that isn't the Conservative Party's fault. Good schools have been doing online education and been open for essential workers. If Sostenueto's kids' school has been doing "no education" she needs to complain to them.

@Clearyweary

Yep, I’ll vote for them. Dread to think how Corbyn would have handled this if he’d got in. Just thinking of his brothers protests over lockdown made me shiver.

yes that was v funny, although in a way I think the left's position SHOULD be anti lockdown or anti a long lockdown. Freedom from state oppression etc. It was weird the way Labour have done the exact opposite and gone all full on hard core lock down - should have been done earlier, should go on for longer etc .

Seemingly, not giving two hoots about people jobs (errr, you are the labour party?!) or children's education (errr, what happened to Education, education education??)

It is so strange to me - i think it is because "pro strict long as possible lockdown, everyone stay at home for ever" somehow became the woke position to take and even now they can't veer from it - although that is changing as the public wake up to the economy.
No doubt in time, Labour will be claiming lock down was a huge mistake if that is the way the wind blows!

Look at the fuss from labour when the message changed from "stay at home" to "stay alert" - a simple to understand change in direction but even that became political.

This morning I was reading about countries like Yemen and Syria and the absolute hell holes that were created in the wake of the Arab Spring, where people were protesting for basic human rights and a democracy, just like ours.

Then I come on here and see people holding our government responsible for killing 60k people. Some of you don’t know what heaven you have been born into. Why not channel your anger properly to where it’s deserved?

yes that was v funny, although in a way I think the left's position SHOULD be anti lockdown or anti a long lockdown. Freedom from state oppression etc.

Isn’t it the other way round? It is the Conservatives who are small, states and individual freedoms (which is why I think BJ was too slow to lock down). Labour are pro the state.

If we see a return to socialism ‘n’ sanity under Starmer, I promise never to vote Tory (safe Labour seat) again

Their inept response has caused tens of thousands of deaths. They have treated student nurses appallingly. They defended DomCum instead of sacking him. They followed a failed strategy of herd immunity when everyone from British scientists to the WHO were telling them it wasn't possible. They have closed DFID which will massively impact women across the globe.
Do I appreciate the fact that they not only know what a woman is but are prepared to admit that in public? Yy but they use that knowledge to implement policies that disadvantage women most, whether those women are carers, or student nurses, or campaigning against FGM, or setting up small businesses in Zambia.
They closed DFID and announced they were painting the union jack on a plane - that's how much contempt they have for people's lives. I wouldn't vote for them if they were the only option available.
And I have voted Conservative once in the past but this shower of incompetent charlatans? No.

Painting the Union Jack on a plane seemed a reasonable idea to me though surely British Airways has some with Union Jacks on already? It is about marketing Britain as a brand which when you are trying to develop trade deals is important. Think of how much the EU have spent advertising their flag. Whether you agree or disagree with the fact we are no longer part of the EU, the fact is we are not.

I don't want socialism btw, just decent government will be fine thanks.

And because the Tories have been incompetent in Covid, Brexit etc, that's a good reason to compel me to bare my tits to any man who identifies as a women and is allowed access to the women's changing room? For me to forego my ability to define myself as a female in a way that has any actual meaning? The fucking answer is no, and I'm not acceptable casualty in the anti Tory war. I will put myself and other women first.

If they prove that they follow through with the protection of women's spaces then yes I would (always previously voted Lab or Green)

@Aesopfable

yes that was v funny, although in a way I think the left's position SHOULD be anti lockdown or anti a long lockdown. Freedom from state oppression etc.

Isn’t it the other way round? It is the Conservatives who are small, states and individual freedoms (which is why I think BJ was too slow to lock down). Labour are pro the state.

but I think labour should be pro- the ordinary people and locking down every one in their homes is very anti "pro-the ordinary people" as lockdown will have the biggest negative impact on ordinary working people and their kids. rich people are the least affected by lockdown (kids in private schools with good on-line learning, they can work from home etc)

I agree with the lockdown and think it was right but it should not go on forever.

I agree Boris was loathe to bring in the lockdown and it was maybe a week to late for london in particular as he is ultimately a liberal.

My husband and I had this conversation this week.

Lifelong Labour supporters. Would never have voted Tory - the mere idea would have been abhorrent. Now? We will vote for whichever party commits to supporting women's rights as a sex class. Nobody should be harmed for the way they choose to live their lives, or simply who they are. That should go without saying - but it doesn't mean women should be forced to accept male bodies in women's spaces, or competitions, or provision, solely because that male person asserts a state of mind! They remain male. Sex matters, and it exists, and the narcissism and mass delusion of believing that Tinkerbell is somehow real if everyone just believes it hard enough is frightening. What the hell has happened, that grown adults are losing touch with literal reality? It's insane that we even have to argue it.

Women's oppression is based on biological sex. We have no choice over it. And the separate spaces we need are because we're vulnerable to assault, and the separate provision because we can't compete equally in sport and we aren't taken as seriously in a professional context. Males co-opting that by choice is not okay.

No woman should be expected to vote for a party that has complete contempt for her sex. I won't vote Tory unless they commit to protecting the legal definition of 'woman', and to strengthening and clarifying the single sex exemptions in the Equality Act. But yes, I will vote for them if they do, and so will my husband. This is a fundamental human rights issue.

@Dances

I don't want socialism btw, just decent government will be fine thanks.

And because the Tories have been incompetent in Covid, Brexit etc, that's a good reason to compel me to bare my tits to any man who identifies as a women and is allowed access to the women's changing room? For me to forego my ability to define myself as a female in a way that has any actual meaning? The fucking answer is no, and I'm not acceptable casualty in the anti Tory war. I will put myself and other women first.

Exactly how I feel!

It's a good question and I don't know the answer. I've voted for all the parties over the years, because I'm a slightly left of centre voter whose overriding criterion is competence. On that basis, I can't vote conservative at the next election unless they assemble a competent cabinet and get rid of their lying leader. However, on social issues I am for the first time finding myself more on the blue than the red side of the centre, primarily because I can't vote for a party that has an MP stating that biological sex isn't real. Who knows, it's a long time until the next election.

I was a life long Labour voter, although have voted Green once, and Lib Dem once - but am now a ballot spoiler.

I live in Liverpool, where you could put a Labour rose on a donkey and it would win ( except in local elections where for many years there was a Lib-Dem council - as a result of the fiasco created by the Militant Tendency). My local MP Louise Ellman was bullied out by a mixture of Momentum activists and long standing hard leftists, and replaced with an 'appropriate' Momentum friendly candidate.

I will not ever be voting for her, but if a good local Conservative candidate was ever announced, who I liked, and had belief in, yes, I'd vote for them. in the more distant past Liverpool used to elect Conservatives, and tbh, the city needs to break out of its self imposed Tory embargo in order to move forward. Being perpetually at odds has done the city no good. and Labour has never really done anything for the city, either.

Labour pledged to strengthen and uphold the Exceptions in the Equality Act.

But Labour politicians believe "transwomen are women". They would, therefore, argue that transwomen have every right to be in women's spaces - and I think you know this.

No way !

@SapphosRock nope.

Labour pledged to uphold and strengthen the exemptions that mean women and men can have single sex spaces, without that breaching equality law.

But they also stated that trans women are literally women, the second a male person states that they are. Which means, if enshrined in law as they promised to do, that a single sex space must include them if they want it to. And the pledge (which only Starmer failed to sign - I can't imagine how he won) said any women who argue that should be expelled.

So Labour actually committed to creating mixed sex spaces from single sex.