Please help me with text to DIL

[StrangeTimes]

My son has previously bitten my head off when I mention the rights of women and the rights of trans women. I’ve only spoken gently about it, but he’s soooo woke it’s a definite conversation stopper.

I’ve never mentioned it to my DIL specifically but she is a crazy Harry Potter fan and self proclaimed feminist. Last night I thought “Fuck it” and text her how proud I was of JK Rowling and she was my favourite person in the world right now.

She has replied “Why?”

I don’t want to mess this up, if I can make her understand then maybe she can get through to my son.

Any tips?

Well thats a relief strange

It was your hidden agenda that was the issue.

Have a conversation with your DIL but be direct. Don’t passively aggressively use your DIL’s interest in HP to argue with your Ds.

You need to let your son have his own opinions.

Why do people have such conversations via text message?
Or any conversations for that matter?

Oh fantastic! What a great outcome!

@Smellbellina really... you think that randomly texting forcing your opinions to on your family is the what any good feminist should do ???

Bloody hell, I wouldn't touch that with a barge pole!

For those who have questioned my point of view. I think that the sex you are born does not define your gender and so yes a woman can be born with a penis.
I am aware that this is not a popular view on this board so I am not trying to change anyone mind simply stating what I believe.

The point I was making is that being a fan of someone doesnt necessarily mean that you agree with everything they do or say.

I also think an adult child doesn't necessarily have to agree with their parents point of view. My mother is an anti vaxer and I'm a biomedical scientist. To say we disagree would be an understatement and we have had screaming matches about it. We just dont discuss the topic as we are both fully aware of the others point of view and rehashing an argument untill the other agrees would gain nothing and place a strain on our relationship. In this case if my mother text my partner about this in a sideways attempt to change my point of view I would call her out and it would result in an argument.

I'm glad that didnt happen here and this didnt put any strain on your relationship with your son.

I would love it if my MIL texted me about controversial topics, even if we fundamentally disagreed. I love a good debate, and under the circumstances it's hardly like we can go to the pub to chat about it.

So my DIL answered. “I know, I love her”

I love a happy ending! Glad you had the courage to discuss this with her.

I had a similar experience with a friend. I was terrified to let her know my GC views. It turns out she has stronger views than I and the willingness to put her job on the line for them!

I'm a bio-medical scientist and a woman can be born with a penis.. ok what's your biomedical description of a 'woman'?

Anyone can identify as a "biomedical scientist". Words are meaningless and fluid

I'm a bio-medical scientist and a woman can be born with a penis.. ok what's your biomedical description of a 'woman'?

Harriett has pointed out that she isn't trying to change anyone's opinion on this thread. Do you think she's allowed to have an opinion without endless debate? I'm assuming she's read the same literature as you and come to her own conclusions. ok what's your biomedical description of a 'woman'? isn't some clever gotcha that will make her change her whole way of thinking.

I disagree with her entirely but as long as she isn't shouting Die Terf Witch she can crack on with it. The FWR section is about feminism not just trans issues, is it fair to put posters off of engaging entirely with the section because they disagree with you on a view she wasn't even trying to impose?

fish why is the question a 'gotcha'?

Fish if you care to answer, what is feminism?

fish why is the question a 'gotcha'?

Because Harriet already answered that question in different words. She basically said a woman is anyone who identifies as such. People on the GC side tend to try and argue semantics with people who believe TWAW. It's not useful or helpful. You define a woman as a person with vagina, vulva and XX chromosomes. She defines it differently. She will not change her mind because you're trying to get her to define woman in a non-circular way or however people tend to do it. It just doesn't work. Feminism could be solved with crosswords if that were the case. Number 7 across: Define Woman

Fish if you care to answer, what is feminism?

Feminism is the movement for improving women's lot in life. If a woman has a problem with her employer and is being discriminated because she is pregnant, you and I both see that as a natural result of male supremacy against female people. Now if that particular poster chooses to not enter FWR to ask for help because they were not respected after politely stating that they disagreed with something but would not try and change your mind. I'd say feminism has failed on this occasion. The OP wanted to know how to handle an awkward text/ dil situation which Harriet answered.

And while I'm on my soap box most women on FWR asked 10 years ago would have also said TWAW. Maybe they thought that the penis should eventually be removed but they were happy with the idea that a woman could initially be born with a penis and then as a transsexual would modify their body to then be a woman (whatever that means). They may have even at the time called themselves feminists. My views have been altered on sex work and porn have been changed over the years by feminism but allowing me to have changing opinions is partly because of that.

Making women feel unwelcome in a section that is for them is counterproductive. If Harriet is going to change her mind it will be because she read some of the brilliant posts explaining why they don't support the mantra that TWAW not because people asked her to define women.

Making women feel unwelcome in a section that is for them is counterproductive. If Harriet is going to change her mind it will be because she read some of the brilliant posts explaining why they don't support the mantra that TWAW not because people asked her to define women.

Many people new to the discussion have found this thread useful:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3145470-Break-it-down-for-me

Fish I reserve the right to question any person here who asserts that men are women. If they feel so offended by my question that they choose not to avail themselves of the wisdom and experience of the brilliant women here, that is not my responsibility.

I have been challenged here by better minds than mine. I have engaged and learned, not flounced because I felt "unwelcome."

People on the GC side tend to try and argue semantics with people who believe TWAW. It's not useful or helpful.

It isnt a semantic argument to recognise the importance of recognising the need for a word to describe the class of human beings who are female.

@strangetimes so is your son going to endure some air-punching when you next see them both?

Can I point out that Harriet didn't deny biological sex. She said the sex you are born with doesn't define your gender. Do any of you disagree with that?

She hasn't denied physical sex or that there is a class of people who are female.

If you were going to argue with her a better point to make would be that many TRAs consider that to be a transphobic point of view in itself.

She said the sex you are born with doesn't define your gender. Do any of you disagree with that?

Of course I disagree with that! I don't have a gender identity!

fish I can't see anyone arguing with Harriet- a question was asked, that's it.