Mermaids response to JK Rowling

[SapphosRock]

Interesting to read the other side:

mermaidsuk.org.uk/news/dear-jk-rowling/

I am so far beyond pissed off by all this at this point that I honestly don't know how to explain it to you any better.

I genuinely think things are changing, Michelle.

There is an air of what the fuck about an awful lot of it suddenly.

J. K. Rowling lifted the lid on the misogyny that underpins it. It's undeniable, and it's escaped from Twitter.

michelle

I KNOW you are making this up.

Indeed. Get the L out, the LGB alliance, even data lounge. Not to mention the tons of L and B women on here.

My MIL's bestie is a gay man and he's far more scathing about transwomen than anyone on here would get away with being. If you don't believe me check out Datalounge.

The closest transwomen get to passing is probably Blair White. Even then the illusion only works if there are no actual women in the frame for comparison. Also, rhapsodizing about one's beauty is something women tend to be socialized out of at a fairly young age.

On Mermaids - as usual their statement is a bunch of manipulative nonsense.

IIRC, using a legal fund for LGBT people to do so.

Taking a gay transsexual to court for trumped up accusations of transphobia that the judge threw straight out.

@Michelleoftheresistance that was profound ❤

J. K. Rowling lifted the lid on the misogyny that underpins it. It's undeniable, and it's escaped from Twitter.

And for that we all owe her a huge debt. It's hard to figure out what to give the richest woman in the world as a gift, but I'm sure she'd appreciate supportive letters.

(Send them via Bloomsbury so her publishers know which way the public mood is tilting.)

I'd quite like this thread, which was specifically about the Mermaids statement, to remain, and to carry on discussing the Mermaids statement, if that's ok?
Why are we always so happy to hand the discussion space over to the person that wants to derail from the OP?

(That's rhetorical, please don't answer, please do continue to point out the dreadful holes and untruths in the Mermaids statement and note any further changes they make to it)

@bishopgiggles

I'd quite like this thread, which was specifically about the Mermaids statement, to remain, and to carry on discussing the Mermaids statement, if that's ok? Why are we always so happy to hand the discussion space over to the person that wants to derail from the OP?

(That's rhetorical, please don't answer, please do continue to point out the dreadful holes and untruths in the Mermaids statement and note any further changes they make to it)

Yes quite.

Someone posted this from the Bayswater Support Group just as the thread was being me-railed.

It's an alternative view to Mermaids reponse.

www.bayswatersupport.org.uk/j-k-rowling

The opening paragraph

"Being male is preferable to being female and vulnerable.”

Thoughts on J.K. Rowling's essay and its responses

13 June 2020

(contributed by a parent in our group)

We wanted to express our gratitude to J.K. Rowling for shining a light, in her essay, on the gender distress that is causing increasing numbers of young women to propose radical changes to their bodies, even in their teens.[1] The words in our title were spoken by a young trans man called Noah, whom we describe below. But responding to Rowling, Mermaids could "see no evidence that any of the young trans men we support are transitioning because they wish to escape womanhood for an easier male existence... we see it as a breath of fresh air." [2] For us, things don't look that simple, as we try to explain below.

It strikes me that there are a lot of mums here who could probably benefit from getting in touch with Bayswater Support. Maybe needs its own thread?

Well. That turned into a charming demonstration of "how to be a dick", didn't it?

(Please note I use this term equally for men and women, and am not in any sense commenting on whether our new friend does or does not have a dick.)

Detransitioners exist and are quite a growing group. They may still have gender dysphoria but are finding other ways to deal with it.

And don't forget the never-transitioned! Not everyone with gender dysphoria comes to the conclusion that they're supposed to be the opposite sex. Actual feminist critical analysis of gender is a pretty useful prophylactic against that particular delusion.

That Bayswater piece is ... well... illuminating isn't the word. Definitely read it if you've got questions about what kind of kids want to transition, about how we came to use puberty blockers, re GIDS and Mermaids.

www.bayswatersupport.org.uk/j-k-rowling

And yes it raises a good point: Mermaids say "but surely it’s a good thing to allow young people to explore their identities?" yet they push children into irreversible treatment which would stop any others 'being explored'.

Mermaids say "but surely it’s a good thing to allow young people to explore their identities?"

Indeed - I was a teenager in the 70s, it was mostly all we did and it never involved irrevocably changing your body and rendering it infertile and incapable of orgasm.

Teenagers in the 80s had Boy George, Marilyn and Annie Lennox, for example, to make it very clear that you could look however you liked. Nobody suggested it might be a good thing to try and change your body permanently to be a facsimile of the opposite sex.

Being gay has never been easy, but in the 80s we began to understand that sexuality wasn't a thing you 'opted into' and gradually, more and more lesbians and gay men were able to come out to family, friends and the workplace. Clubs and pubs where lesbians and gay men could relax became more common.

Now? Lesbians in particular are being driven back 'underground' and their spaces are either being colonised by males claiming they're lesbians or closed completely because they're not allowed' to keep males out.

Mermaids have no clue how this movement they've embedded themselves into is doing the opposite of letting children and young people "explore" identities - it's forcing them to pick one.

The great thing about the identity exploration we did back in the day was that hair can be re-dyed, piercings can be taken out, hair grows back if you decide you don't like the style you got, clothes that no longer suit can be discarded. The effects of artificial hormones are not so easy to discard, and there's no replacing body parts that have been surgically removed.

The Bayswater article is really interesting, I’d be interested to know why Noah was sent for puberty suppression when it seems that there were other factors that were clearly influencing her desire not to be female. Surely it would make much more sense for those issues to be explored in counselling, even changing schools possibly, before going down a transitioning pathway. If that were my daughter I’d be very unhappy with the way it was handled.

I can't see it, but sorry if this has already been posted. Someone's documented the changes between mermaids first published version and the next one.

twitter.com/zeno001/status/1271793620300058625?s=21

the social ice age that was the bridled, hypocritical and corseted Victorian age

So Susie and Mermaids think this is happening in the 2010s? There knowledge of historical feminism is piss poor. Victoria died 120 years ago and women's fashion in the flapper 1920s was distinctly corset less. The reality is that the corset has made a massive comeback this century with hideous bodycon dresses, music industry females trussed up like chickens in weird bondage like kit and the repulsive Kardashians advertising waist training corsets. Ramming this porn wear down girls throats had to have an impact didn't it? And don't get me started on the cared for children being recruited by the transing organisations supported by public money in every town. Grim.

None of the papers referenced are this year, all at least two years old. What a relief the government has woken up to this.

Every time Green tries to claim the moral upper hand I have to bite back the urge to say "remember how you transitioned your child for wanting to play with 'girl' toys?"

@FloralBunting

Ava, you really believe that the smiles and warmth you felt were 'sisterly' kinship? It never occurred to you that you were clocked, every single time, by women who learned from birth to appease and humour the male person, some of those women via discovering how bad it can be if they don't?

Those claims always remind me of the d00dbros who get angry at women who reject them because being polite to them = "leading them on".

Sorry if that's not clear from the quote but the half wits at mermaids say in that piece that the explosion of gender dysphoria is due to the ending of the Victorian Era. Fucking unbelievable. Well it's not really, based on the evidence of Green's own words.

Do you really think transgender people stick out like a sore thumb? Do you not think that maybe a lot, not all nor does it matter but a lot just blend in?

Yanno that thing women sometimes do where they spin on their heel and walk out of the loo they just entered. They didn't suddenly remember something they had forgotten. They noticed something.

@NiceLegsShameAboutTheFace

Whoever said that is a cunt and I don't care if I get banned for saying that, AN ABSOLUTE CUNT.

Oh, we're a right set of c*nts, without doubt First truthful word you've spoken!

I think they mus be a USian like me. It still jars me when I read it here, even after all these years. The c word is a fighting word here.

It's not exactly a fluff and kittens word here either, Bewilderness!

I have mixed feelings about it, but if individual women want to reclaim the word that's fine by me. I don't half take umbrage when men use it as an insult though.