Jess Phillips throws GC women under the bus

[watermelonpeas]

www.pinknews.co.uk/2020/01/17/jess-phillips-labour-leadership-transgender-rights-juno-dawson-pinknews-interview/

Aw great, she was my favourite but Lisa has taken over for me.
Great Northern women, what not to like.
Not sure who I'm voting for yet, depends what she has to say.
Really looking forward to this.

JP -In the debate about trans rights – there shouldn’t be any debate

Just like Harry the Owl mentioned #nodebate

Nope - the debate is about protecting legally enshrined women’s rights.

Shame on JP.

JD *She (JP) retweeted a notoriously anti-trans organisation who seek to bar women like me from single-sex spaces and revoke the hard earned rights of transgender people.

• It’s an organisation who exist solely to limit my movements in public and try remove the few rights that I do have*

So Juno has hard worn rights and few rights - both mentioned in the article. Which one is it?

What rights (and limitations on movement in public) does Juno not currently have that is afforded to the rest of the population - apart from demanding the right to invade spaces designed for the safety, dignity and privacy of women and girls??

What was the tweet / and which is the ‘notoriously anti-trans organisation’ who originally sent it?

Jess Philips is a shallow, loud, talentless liar who would sell out all women for the labour leadership

The really disappointing thing is that Jess Phillips obviously does get it. She is (like most intelligent critical thinkers) instinctively GC and pro-women. That she has changed tack doesn't show that she's 'learned more' or whatever flannel she gave JD, but that she's realised that standing up for women, even with caveats and qualification and and soothing of ruffled rainbow feathers, doesn't play out well on social media. It's total capitulation, or vilification.

She's sold her core beliefs and principles for woke cookies. I think she'll come to see that as a grave error of judgement in the long term.

I genuinely couldn't give a shit which one of them wins the leadership contest. None of them can lead the party to a GE win and none of them will be any good for women. It's painful to me to say this.

I asked Jess about post liberalism, the leftist section of which is pretty much the politics of the lost Red Wall voters (soon to be followed by the Midland Muslims if you ask me, so Jess had better watch out due to her seat) and who are decidedly Unwoke.

I think you're right Absinthe.
If she is GC and pro women, this stunt shows her to be lacking in courage and/or moral spine. Either way, she is not leadership material.

I'm glad someone got in "Can you define woman?" before MN stepped in and said no more gender questions.

They deleted my comment. I think it's disgraceful. Jess is stuck in the Twitter echo chamber. She refuses to see the GC POV. It would do her some good to see the anger of women over being ignored, abused and harassed.

The emperor has new clothes indeed.

Two perfectly reasonable comments deleted now.

She'd have been my second choice. No more.

She's way better than R L-B, however, who has just pitched women's rights versus disability rights and definitely come out on the side of limiting women's rights.

She seems more solid on the sex work stuff - that's not the officially acceptable anti-'sw**f' line, is it? But all over the place wanting to say the right things about the GRA.

questions are fine, concerns are prejudiced

This makes me so angry. It's basically "believe what we tell you - if you're not sure what to believe, ask and we'll tell you what to think, but don't you dare introduce any of your own thinking".

What I always want to ask TRA supporters is this. Have they spent time thinking in detail about the background to their opinions? Have they themselves examined all the premises and arguments and history behind the opinions they're repeating, checking for unintended consequences?

If they haven't, then why should we just accept their word that what they're saying is right? How can they even know for sure themselves, if all they're doing is trusting some other third party to have done it for them?

If they have thought it all through in detail, questioning and examining everything before committing to their opinion, then that's great. But why can't I do that too? Why does it have to stop with them? And why not answer people's questions and concerns, if you have already found convincing arguments against them?

Given R L-B is quite possibly going to be the next Leader of the Opposition, I honestly think her abortion position is more worthy of scrutiny than poor old JP being hauled over the coals again. ☹️

poor old JP What

She just gets way more flak than any of the other Leadership candidates.

I'm quite sure R L-B is no friend to GC women but where's the scrutiny/threads on MN?

And given that R L-B is way more likely to actually become the Leader of Labour, I just find it bizarre that there is a thread about JP, not R L-B.

I think JP is much more vocal about being a feminist and standing up for women than RLB, that's why she gets more scrutiny on this issue.

I've asked a safeguarding question.

I think we should all post our questions regardless of if they get deleted. Mass deletions say something very loudly. They show how women are being shutdown.

RLB is Catholic. Much as I don’t agree with her position on abortion - and I find it dangerous in relation to what is going on in the US. However, I presume she knows what a woman is, no?

Where do we post questions btw?

I had some faith in JP.
Never had any in RLB.

That's the difference in focus for me. Disappointment.

@BabyItsAWildWorld

I think we should all post our questions regardless of if they get deleted. Mass deletions say something very loudly. They show how women are being shutdown.

It's fine to discuss the webchat in a separate thread, but we'll take a dim view of deliberate disruption on the webchat itself.

We moderate webchats a little differently to the rest of the Talk boards. We posted these guidelines in the OP:

"As always, please remember our webchat guidelines - one question per user, follow-ups only if there’s time and most questions have been answered, and please keep it civil. Also if one topic is dominating a thread, mods might request that people don't continue to post what's effectively the same question or point. (And we’ll suspend the accounts of anyone who continues after we've posted to ask people to stop, so please take note.) Rest assured we will ALWAYS let the guest know that it's an area of concern to multiple users and will encourage them to engage with those questions."

I'm glad to see that Tinsel's question about spousal "veto" and JP's support for its removal was allowed.
EmpressLesbian's question about WPUK and the events in Brighton is another important one and relevant to a leadership candidate who takes an interest in women's rights.

I've stopped bothering with webchats.

We're not allowed to talk about this, or ask seriously damn pressing questions for women about it. since it gets in the way of asking about favourite biscuits

The questions are shared before hand, cherry picked and pre answered by the politician's advisors to be nothing more than a lot of political nothing dodging all points anyway, rendering impossible any meaningful contact between the unwashed and the political elite, or any actual conversation. I could answer those questions right now with the exact same party political broadcast hogwash that will appear regardless of what the question actually is.

Anyone doing anything but smile, clap and ask about biscuits will be deleted, again negating any meaningful actual contact or sharing of views.

Why bother? It's not talking to anyone, or having the faintest influence on them, or getting anywhere near their ivory tower. It's just dumping a party political broadcast on a thread. I can just go and read the bloody Guardian.

I forecast much mention of 'proud feminist' (in the sense of self identified, male focused, absolutely definitely not focused on females) and much other gibberish. Life's too short for this crap.

And even if we formed a policy as PP suggested above, of having a thread where FWR as the hidden sin bin for females who won't shut up produce, through negotiation, discussion, careful crafting and references, the one solitary question permitted on this subject...

it would still on result in a preprepared party political broadcast waffle going nowhere near the issues. I have no time for any politician with neither time nor guts nor personal grip on the information to actually discuss with real people and answer difficult questions, and wants this protected and shielded talking down to act. If they can't be buggered to engage with me why the hell should I bother to listen to a word they want to down load at me for my betterment?

TL:DR: Fuck off Jess. I've got enough to do trying to prevent the trashing of female people's human rights and children's safeguarding. Help or get out of the bloody way.