Middle ground

[HDDD]

I've been trying to follow conversations online in regard to gender critical thought, pronouns, selfID, transrights, lesbian erasure etc. And all I can find is extreme views on both sides. Is there a middle ground? Is it here? Is Twitter too toxic? I want to be informed not screamed at.

TheAlternativeTentacle Thought I'd clarified this much earlier on, when I said I'd worded it wrong. Not extreme views. Extreme reactions. Extreme reactions which drown out debate. Silencing. Name calling. Trolling. I wanted/want nuanced debate.

I wanted to know more

No you don't. You want to derail the discussion. If you wanted to know more you'd go off and read the break it down for me thread like the OP did.

Here's another link to it. Off you go.
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3145470-Break-it-down-for-me

Thought I'd clarified this much earlier on, when I said I'd worded it wrong. Not extreme views. Extreme reactions. Extreme reactions which drown out debate. Silencing. Name calling. Trolling. I wanted/want nuanced debate.

You can't ask for debate if you are unwilling to have an opinion yourself.

It's not a spectator sport.

How can we have 'nuance' [subtle shaded of meaning] when the very 'meaning' of the two biological sexes is being changed to mean 'a woman can also be a man that says some words'?

What is the opinion that you have that you want to debate? You set this thread up basically accusing us of extreme views. Is it any wonder we are fucked off with this constant accusation that is without foundation?

We are not extreme.

Wanting kids to not be sterilised is not extreme.

Wanting girls not to be followed into toilets by men with mental health problems/a fetish/no issues just to assault, rape or worse, is not extreme.

Wanting women to have safe refuges away from men of any description, is not extreme.

We don't want silence, use your words, write them down and we'll debate.

What is it you want to debate exactly?

because I can see how other people's questions are answered and draw a pattern from there? I wanted to know more, I didn't have one specific question.

There are literally thousands of questions answered each day on here.

What is it you want to know more about?

I thought November had gone off to read more or did I amagine that

Blackberry gin omfg. It is the stuff dreams are made off

Fuck me TheAlternativeTentacle
What a rant! I did not set up this thread to attack anyone. I thought I'd made that clear. I've given some of my views fairly freely.
I started a thread here to see if it was a safe space to discuss. I've read. I've listened. I've replied.
You need to back the fuck off.

OldCrone

No you don't. You want to derail the discussion. If you wanted to know more you'd go off and read the break it down for me thread like the OP did.

No, I wanted to agree with OP and then leave. Agreeing with the OP is the opposite of derailing the thread. Christ you honestly think I'm going to waste my time any more reading further threads right now? Just leave it alone.

Colour me shocked. Another thread reduced to Groundhog Day. I feel for OP, whose thread has been hijacked.

I wanted to agree with OP and then leave.

And you didn't because...?

So no question has been asked?

Can I just point out the predictability of that Novembersbean?

You're more irritated by the way questions are asked and maybe not answered, than you are the actual subject.

And you wonder why people get snarky.

I did not set up this thread to attack anyone.

Well, you did attack the regulars on FWR when you called their views extreme. I must have missed the apology post explaining that you don't think they are extreme at all but all perfectly normal views.

I started a thread here to see if it was a safe space to discuss. I've read. I've listened. I've replied. You need to back the fuck off

Loving your 'nuance' there.

People do realize that commenters here aren't paid, right? Unless you're paying me you don't get to tell me what to write and how to write it, and I don't think I'm alone in that. If someone wants staff then perhaps they should hire some.

Oh. I must have missed OP's post. Okay - not feeling for them either!

Well, you did attack the regulars on FWR when you called their views extreme. I must have missed the apology post explaining that you don't think they are extreme at all but all perfectly normal views.
You did miss a couple of posts clearly yes.

OP posted this on the Break it down for me thread:
This thread is enlightening. Thanks so much to everyone who has posted useful links and info. I'm aghast.
Let her catch her breath, fgs

You did miss a couple of posts clearly yes.

Which ones?

We deffo need more ghasts

So no one has any questions, everyone has been signposted towards break it down for me thread, which contains dozens of other links (although as it's quite old, a lot might be out of date, things have moved on).

So no questions, answers not necessary, links provided.

Just left with a bit of non-nuanced swearing and a prodigious thirst for some sloe gin, then?

Sounds like a regular day on FWR.

What was funny about this thread is that someone gave OP something to read and she said oh hey cool I'll go read that, and somehow that made no difference at all to whatever other people are attempting to prove.

It would never occur to me to haunt a web community full of people who I think are terrible in order to tell them that they're terrible and how they can remake themselves to be more pleasing to me. Odd hobby. that.

Vodka, rum, whisky, sake, shoju...pretty much anything that's not gin really. Just don't see the appeal. My stepmother loves the stuff.

Although Sloe gin is a traditional christmas special, I have to recommend Damson Gin, with which you can reuse the damsons to make alcoholic flap jacks.

Sounds like a regular day on FWR

Yup, another will be back tomorrow, and maybe one day the OP will be the one effing and jeffing and flipping their lid.

And as you say regularly, if you aren't raging about all this, you just haven't worked it out properly yet.

It would never occur to me to haunt a web community full of people who I think are terrible in order to tell them that they're terrible and how they can remake themselves to be more pleasing to me. Odd hobby. that.

Maybe we should do an experiment? As long as someone else does the groundwork, obviously.

I like whisky

Specifically speyside

Sake is nice as well

Not so much vodka and rum

gin gin is like being forced to drown in perfume

Gin gin, is literally the same as vodka; just with juniper berries added.

I once accidentally made a gallon of totally unflavoured wine. It was basically just neat alcohol. I have no idea how it happened.