First Trans Pride in London this weekend

[FeminismandWomensFights]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-49447918

Quoting Get the L Out
But the actual issues that mean there are a serious clash of rights is not being represented clearly or fairly by the Beeb.
It’s not about feminists just being meanies FFS.
Also the organisers of this Pride/protest have a raised fist on their promo for their event .

www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-49447918

On the raised fist thing, I don't know what your thoughts are OP, but have seen others suggest it is a threatening gesture.

I'm not sure how it is intended but I read it as another racist appropriation of the language (body language in this case) of the civil rights movement. I see a raised fist and immediately think Black Power salute and the powerful image of the '68 Olympics 200m podium.

With the raised fist, isbit a sign of support though? Or are Pride and Trans Pride organisers going to go into battle for the 'best Pride ever!'

Much like the libfem vs radfem division, if indeed it is one, it could be interesting to see how they handle this.

Well the punch a TERF fist was very reminiscent of Nazi propaganda posters.

I agree, the raised fist is appropriation of the Black Power symbol but for me that context was about inner strength not violence. In the context of the trans movement I see it as a warning sign of their intent to violently take what they think is theirs, a statement of their goal to achieve their agenda by whatever means. It is a clear indicator of the masculinity behind a movement that’s answers resistance with violence.

Interesting that this event is considered too toxic even for Mermaids to touch (so rumour has it).

Was it stalin/lenin, with the fist always?

I am pleased they do their own thing, the trouble is, I don't agree, in terms of the trans don't go to pride! Not atall.

A third of transgender people report being discriminated against in public in the last year because of their identity, according to a survey by LGBT charity Stonewall of 871

So, a third of 871. A bit farcical for Stonewall to be quoting these figures when they actively encourage discrimination against women! To the extent it affects the whole female population, which is a bit more than the 290 that are feeling discriminated against.

They are pushing policies that affect half the population, already at considerable risk (death for gender based vawg), into greater risk for the 290 ish who feel discriminated against. They try to justify actively increasing the mortality rates of women and children, by removing safeguards.

They talk about the violence or aggression they anticipate. I have no violence or aggression to be taking to their secret march thats all over the national press with very strong looking male fist in defiance.

No part of that thank you.

I absolutely understand and agree that in the context of trans privilege activism it will be read as a violent threat by many, and quite reasonably so.

I was just wondering if others saw the appropriation or if younger posters were unfamiliar with that context.

Whatever. Crack on. Good luck.

Just a shame that all other Prides are now effectively trans pride instead of gay pride, and the trans influence has wiped out lesbian groups and representation and women's groups and representation.

And while lesbians and women doing anything like holding a march about their particular needs and social causes get stomped all over and disrupted by trans lobbyists for not centering them and their interests and shutting up about anything the trans lobbyists don't like, it's apparently fine for trans groups to have things all to themselves.

Again, whatever. No time or interest to spare on the double standards.

And while lesbians and women doing anything like holding a march about their particular needs and social causes get stomped all over and disrupted by trans lobbyists for not centering them and their interests and shutting up about anything the trans lobbyists don't like, it's apparently fine for trans groups to have things all to themselves.

This. Why can't people see the hypocrisy and entitlement?

Can you imagine the outrage, hue and cry, if lesbians appropriated Pride for themselves, and had an purely Lesbian Pride, which it would seem perfectly reasonable to do now.

The precedent it set , and the divide and conquer fall is starting.

The breakaway factions from Pride and LGBTQ+, and all the good it once stood for.

Can you imagine the outrage, hue and cry, if lesbians appropriated Pride for themselves, and had an purely Lesbian Pride, which it would seem perfectly reasonable to do now

It would be absolutely reasonable. The problem is it would be attended by trans 'lesbians with penises'.

So Trans'women' get:
Pride (LGBT)
Trans Pride
Lesbian Pride
... any others that they feel like appropriating.

I'm really confused as to why they expect violence?

It's all "LOOK AT MEEEEEE!" then "people look at me and I don't like it".

Grow up and stop dressing like a clown and you'll bend in just like the rest of the world. Or dress like a clown if you want (also absolutely fine) but people will look.

Enjoy your march.

It’s not that they expect violence it’s a symbol to show their intent to beat the crap out of anyone who disagrees them.
Rather like football hooligans spoiling for a fight, maybe that’s considered passé now - this is the equivalent for those who consider themselves above all that.

Already all the Pride celebrations and Pride month was taken over by trans rights. We have anything about women i.e. International Women's Day taken over by trans rights. Now a Trans Pride? They really are the most marginalised in society.

I really don't buy into the whole 'I'm an outsider at Pride' argument.

They should have their on trans pride instead of hijacking LGB Pride.

*their own

Repressed or denied content - in this case being male/masculine - tends always to present itself in extreme ways when it breaks through. The irony of presenting as a woman and yet engaging in the most negative, violent masculine aggression possible.

I am very uncomfortable with violent imagery on political event/demo promo material because deliberately it sets the tone of forcing through the event aims, on threat of violence and encourages violent knobheads to show up and see how far they can push it.

But especially in this particular context where there is a climate already of women being intimidated by men and women have actually been punched for disagreeing with them on this particular brand of politics.

Maria McLaughlin was punched to the ground at Speakers’ corner by transwoman Tara Wolf and although Tara was found guilty of this attack, in court Maria was forced to use female pronouns for her attacker by the judge

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3223856-Court-and-enforced-use-of-preferred-pronouns

So punchy fists imagery is particularly shit in this context.

Nobody should face threats or violence for being who they are or wearing what they want but that goes exactly the same for trans people and for women and anyone else.

Some threads if anyone wants to read up on intimidation of women by TRAs, just to name a couple:

Bristol Jam jar event in 2018 where women were physically trapped on a staircase by masked TRAs and verbally abused (police did nothing to get them to stop it)

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3228462-To-be-shocked-that-this-is-happening-in-Britain-in-2018

Lesbians kicked out of public events by police just for being there as a peaceful ticket holder:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3539529-Lesbians-removed-from-Accenture-inclusive-trans-event-by-7-police-officers

I really don't buy into the whole 'I'm an outsider at Pride' argument.

Probably because it's utter DARVO bullshit.

Already all the Pride celebrations and Pride month was taken over by trans rights

Which actually goes on for three months rather than one.

We have anything about women i.e. International Women's Day taken over by trans rights. Now a Trans Pride?

Brighton has already had their Trans Pride this year and don't forget they also have LGBT History Month, Trans Day of Visibility and Trans Day of Remembrance.

And it's not just women's events that are taken over by Trans people. Last week it was World Suicide Prevention Day and I saw several Twitter feeds that expressed no empathy for victims and families as a whole but made it all about Trans people.

I would imagine the public and even their most dedicated supporters must be tiring from this constant demand to always centre trans people

Radio 1 lunchtime news covered it unsurprisingly. The person they interviewed wants to go but there's so much violence aimed at trans that they are unsure whether to go. All very brave and stunning of course.

It was a Newsbeat story so it was always going to be broadcast.

I would have thought anyone trans would be far safer at standard Prides than a trans one where they are the sole targets. Unless they are only worried about the 'literal' violence of words.

Oh excellent, discussion of the whole "appropriating the black power symbol" thing - I've been fretting over that.

Raised fist for black power purposes = a symbol used by the oppressed class to demonstrate collective resistance.
Raised fist for actual feminist power purposes = a symbol used by the oppressed class to demonstrate collective resistance.
Raised fist for trans power purposes = a symbol used by the oppressor class to demonstrate collective dominance.

One of these things is not like the others...