Hello Lurkers!

[BadgertheBodger]

Hi. Hello. Howya doing?

I have unwittingly become a lurker on this board as I often find the brilliant long-standing posters have not only got there before me but put my contribution to shame.

But! There’s a place for every woman in feminism and I wanted to start a thread for lurkers, or less confident posters, to share their thoughts. I want this to be a thread which has less of a focus on the most amazingly analytical comment, and more about posters (particularly lurkers) sharing thoughts and working out ideas in conjunction with all the incredible resources available on this board.

Here’s to all of us looking, thinking, but not posting. Your opinion is welcome too. I would love this to be a thread where we shared our thoughts

I have been lurking...

When I realised (in real life) that I felt afraid to say something (straightforward and obvious) about young women's safety it was a signal to try to understand what on earth was going on.

I think once you realise you are afraid, or 'walking on egg shells' then you know something is wrong. I am grateful for the clarity of thought here.

I have 'dealt with' a number of examples of male violence to women: often this has had to be very discreet and strategic in order to protect the victims of the violence. But discovering that it could be a problem to talk in general about male violence against women has been terrifying.

I appreciate how grounding these discussion here are. I am scared that I have alienated people that I have (tentatively) spoken to face to face.

Hi. Been around for ages but don't really post that much. Just learning all the time.
Thanks to all you regulars that keep this conversation going in the most incredible ways!
Cheers

Hello fellow lurkers I rarely if ever post but visit the forum a number of times a day. It's like a stress reliever for me to know that there are many others out there who can call out so articulately the misogyny in society and the absolute madness of some of the TRAs.

I work for a VERY woke US west coast tech firm and I know I can't speak out at work without harming my career.

But i do my bit in my own way like others here ...

Hello like-minded people

I, too, am a lurker on these boards for the same reasons laid out by other posters here. It probably relates to feeling that what I have to say would not be good enough.

I joined MN several years ago and tentatively began reading some threads on the FWR boards not really knowing what to expect. These boards have opened my eyes and lit a fire inside me that has taken me by surprise.

I have recently name changed to become more active on these boards although I am afraid of the possible repercussions. I have a twitter account that was only ever used for banal local groups, weather, politics and transport (to try to circumvent any emerging commuting issues in case you were wondering ).

I noticed the other day that the people/groups I follow are becoming more GC and less innocuous as a result of direction from here. I never post or retweet, just lurk. I can be easily found through there and it's starting to make me feel a little nervous.

My work has many inclusive networks. Having read on here about how people have been targeted, their employers informed and the fall out from that as a result of being GC, it does make me think twice about becoming too involved IRL.

It's taken me several years to get to the point of even posting my views on here however I can feel my momentum building and like I'm ferociously clawing my way through a dark tunnel in an attempt to burst through into the sunlight.

As an aside, how can you be anonymous on twitter? Asking for a friend..

I haven't spoken to a single person IRL about this (apart form the odd rambling brain dump to my DH) and feel a bit of a fraud having all these thoughts swirling around inside me and keeping a lid on them.

I'm at the point now where I want to go to feminist meetings to meet like-minded women who can understand my jumbled up thoughts on these injustices we are faced with.

I look back at my life with fresh eyes and wonder who I was back then when I accepted unwarranted and unwanted sexual advances and harassment from men; when I wondered if I was in the wrong when I told others of one particular incident and was made to feel by men and women alike that, at 17, it was my fault in some way and he wasn't like that ; when I was the "cool wife" to my first husband and turned a blind eye or became complicit in his porn use/strip club visits/sexual demands on me; when I became hysterical and inappropriate around male strippers at hen parties.

The list goes on.

Now, I want to make a difference. Now, I need to. I can't brush this under the carpet any longer. Now my eyes have been opened they can't and won't be shut again.

What a lovely thread this is.

Wow, I'm so happy there are so many people who like me, lurk and that lots of you do so for the same reasons I do- feeling less eloquent, articulate or informed. Easy to feel that way, the women on this board are amazing.

I'm here everyday and FWR has given me real life confidence to speak about things I never would have a few years ago. It helps me organise my thoughts and talk to my young DD about issues with fact based language rather than emotion. It's opened my eyes to a lot of things and taught me so much. And the humour and wit is the cherry really.

Sometimes I write something to post, read it back and delete it all, feeling stupid.

Great idea for a thread.

And another reason to lurk - my teenage DD has just come in and said she'd seen something on twitter about a transwoman insisting on having her balls waxed and how did a woman have balls. And I could say 'Let me tell you all about it and then you tell me what you think....so that you can make up your own mind.'

Mamello, hasn’t that creep done women a wonderful favour? Just think how many parents are now being given a wonderful opportunity to show how this self identify nonsense can damage women. Your daughter will start to question the TRA directive now.

@NonnyMouse1337

Thank you for writing that, and sorry it took a little while to write back, I was surprised, and very overwhelmed, and needed to lie down - in a good way! I would love to teach you how to ride a bike if you ever come to London (I have 2!). There's nothing like trundling along, feeling the wind blowing through your hair,and the sun on your skin, and I imagine we'd be both be able to understand and enjoy the gravity of that little pleasure together. Sometimes it's the smallest things that are the biggest victories. I hope I can teach you!

I lasted on CEMB forums for about 5 minutes, years ago. Got into an argument with a dude offended by my username (I think I was Toms, Dicks & Jihadis), so I flounced off to LEMC & other places instead.

I stopped doing any ex-Muslim activitisty stuff a few years back. This was after a really bad experience with a so-called 'ally' that was hanging around the ex-M community group I was involved with. He was a predator, targetting vulnerable girls & women, who have just left religion, families etc, and a journalist. It's left me deeply suspicious of the motives of many 'allies', especially the ones with penises, especially when vulnerable people are concerned.
Even though everyone rallied around me, and the other girls/women that then came forward afterwards that had much worse experiences than me did too. It was relatively minor, considering previous experiences I'd had, just a grope when he thought I was asleep. I had a meltdown, and for once things worked out. Everyone believed me, many others (including a teenager with vulnerabilities) came forward, ad hoc processes were put in place, to keep the creep away and warn similar groups. So, all the things that should have happened, did happen (which was the first time I'd seen/experienced that, especially considering previous reactions when I'd raised sexual assault), which is good. But I withdrew from all of it because of reasons I don't quite understand. I had no intention of dominating the thread (again - am sorry!) but I just wanted to write that because I've read a lot of warnings about allies on here, and I wanted to reiterate that. Of course we need allies, but every single one of us must remain vigilant, as we do not understand other's motivations. Realising that I have a blind-spot that I have in this area (ability to perceive

My Mum's a convert too (so was my Dad's 2nd bigamous wife). I've met ex-JWs who had a torrid time. One starved by his family & nearly died. I know Faith2Faithless have done events with ex-JWs. We all have similar traumas & experiences, doesn't matter which cult-flavour we are escaping - the pain of ex-communicating oneself or the alternatives is both unique & ubiquitous. I was so amazed when you said you were autistic as well. That made me really happy - I was only diagnosed a few weeks ago, and it made me feel even more isolated from the world (like I might be the only one). So seeing your message out of the blue really changed that, in a big way. For me, my feminism, my apostasy, my moral outlook outlook is part of my autism/Aspergers, I think. I just didn't know that it was that until recently, I just thought it was some weird quirk and inflexibility of my mind, and pig-headedness, but how odd to suddenly discover that my personality is not quite, only that. I'd love to be able to compare notes with you. I felt a lot less alone just knowing there was someone with that can understand both apostasy & autism out there in the world. So, thank you. Seeing your message was a bit like suddenly seeing an oasis in the distance in the desert, with 2 little bicycles laying there waiting. I haven't cried in such a long time, but I did a little yesterday after reading your message. Am so grateful. I hope that all doesn't sound like too much! I'll send you a DM

@JessicaWakefieldSV That would be absolutely amazing, thank you, thank you, I got jazz hands! :) I will send you a DM.

@lakeswimmer Reading about your devastation finding out about your school friend and her daughter really brought home how everyday and normal this hatred/violence towards women is. It's every where and really drives home how we need to all keep an eye out for each other. The words 'by someone supposed to love her' won't stop going round my head. It's heartbreaking and probably true of each of that growing list of murdered women, and so many other violated women too. It's the up-close and personal part I don't understand, it's so alien to me.

@BadgertheBodger I agree with everything you said in your post and think similarly. Especially about being fucked in so many different ways. It's cumulative. Sometimes it's not even the big things that break us, but the little things. Relentless and who knows which straw will break the camel's back? With me, it was none of the big stuff that broke me. I'm pretty resilient, but eventually, was some ghastly little man with a power complex, who didn't like opinionated women, bullying me at work, after bullying loads of others, and the fall-out from that. That still surprises me, after everything else, but just goes to show.

I'm not sure I'm ready for my own thread yet, to be honest, I hope that's ok. Am a little self-conscious and socially awkward just now, and (this is an Aspergers thing) I agonise about some things which might seem silly - like some very kind things have been said to me and I know I should say thank you, graciously, and authentically, and i feel those things, but I just feel so awkward because my brain tied up in knots between how I'm supposed to act, react, feel, respond, and what I'm actually feeling (usually confusion/awkwardness), and expected response, then my brain worries about accidentally offending someone by getting that whole thing wrong, or not saying the right thing and so on, or forgetting something. I think, just right now, my brain isn't brilliant at processing some bits of social interaction, so my own thread feels like not the right idea (just now). I know that all sounds weird, but thought I'd try to explain in case I've done any of the above already.

But I also feel like I'm dominating this thread, and didn't want to, and I don't want to.Sorry! I didn't mean to accidentally transition from lurker to blurker, but here I am. My pronoun is discombobulated Maybe someone else can start a blurker thread or something, or come up with some clever idea/solution/alternatives, so any conversations can be carried on/moved from here to there? Then I can stop worrying about derailing/dominating the thread.

Argh no edit button!

Helena - threads have a mind of their own. You're not dominating.

Helena don’t be daft mate you’re not dominating. I want to reassure you that nobody here is offended by anything you’ve said or not said and it is always your own decision to start a thread - no pressure, just that you sound v interesting and I’m sure you would have lots to share; in your own time or not at all!

Everyone else, I am so enjoying hearing your thoughts! It’s brilliant to see so many who, like me, have been introduced to feminism on this board. It’s not called the Radicalisation Portal for nothing

Bless you for Blurking Helena

Yours, and others posts have made wonderful and very difficult reading. Am both grateful and very moved all at once (sniffy with all the dust this end).

Also, laying these for one mother and one daughter, amonsgt the many.

Been a bit blown away by the positive strength of response on this thread.

Throw a stone and watch the ripples.

That seems to be what this thread is, all the ripples that are reaching into other's lives and further connections, and on.

The pp on teen learnings/teachings to the woke teens in ones family is helpful, have been scratching around for long with this one.

Raising a (hun? - hilarious, put in mind of the other net for mums!) to the thread.

I guess unmumsnetty ❤️

Still lurking around, just popped on to express thanks and solidarity to all the regulars and lurkers for fighting the good fight here on the boards and out in the big wide world!

Hello fellow lurkers I rarely if ever post but visit the forum a number of times a day.

Me too. :-)

I also read here every day, and would like to say thank you to all the brave, passionate, clever and articulate women who take the trouble to post. You are making a huge difference.

To those pp's with teenagers who disagree: keep the dialogue going if you can. We don't agree on some things, but my teen has gone from a hardline no-debate mentality to being open to discussion on the subject.

@HelenaHandcart awww I'm so humbled that you were touched by my message! Brought a tear to my eye reading your messages too.
I like the thought that we have a bicycle ride to look forward to.

I have never heard of LEMC. I think I used CEMB from about 2006-2007 to about 2011-2012. It was pretty much the only space for Ex-Muslims back then, that I knew of anyway. Met a few lovely folk from there. It's a shame you were harassed by a poster there. I would have thought it would be one of the last places where your username would be controversial!!

Horrible that you and other women were targeted by predatory men posing as allies. I visited London once to meet a bunch of women from CEMB and we all went out for a meal and then to a nightclub. It was quite good to have a mix of ages and the older ones kept a close eye on the younger women. Quite nice to know we were all looking out for each other since many of the women had understandably very little life experience of socialising in such haraam spaces. :)

I'm glad that you were believed and action was taken.

I've been really pleased to see new organisations and communities like Faith to Faithless springing up. You're right that there's so much common ground and experiences among apostates and it's great that there are groups providing much needed awareness and support. CEMB was a great lifeline for me when I was so depressed and lost coming to terms with being an atheist and realising that everything I was taught and believed in was a lie. I felt out of place amongst white British atheists who had never left a high control religion like JW, Mormon etc because they couldn't grasp how profound and difficult it is to become an apostate and why I can never tell my aging mum that I no longer believe in the JW faith. Arab and South Asian atheists seem to understand without any explanation. :)

I was formally diagnosed as on the autistic spectrum / Asperger's in March, though I strongly suspected for a number of years and was slowly building up the courage to be professionally evaluated. Never fitted in anywhere my whole life, especially among other women. It scares me how I could have been sucked into trans ideology if I was a young person today.
Like you, my atheism and feminism is very strongly linked with my autism. I can be extremely stubborn, logical and super passionate / angry at injustice and unfairness. Although I am a relatively quiet and mild person, I can get fired up and surprise people by my passion (and obsessive interests) at times.

Feel free to send me a DM when you feel like it and I hope you will feel like sharing your thoughts and experiences in other threads when you're ready.

Another lurker, pretty much daily. Not intelligent or articulate enough to join the debate but learning lots (and have been able to use it in real life and work, which is fantastic).

Thank you regular posters, for all that you do.

MN has taught me a lot about feminism. I very rarely post. I'm not the most articulate and usually someone else make my point much better than I ever could. I love reading everyone's points though, it's just the one place I don't feel confident enough to contribute anything.

I mainly lurk, very occasionally post. I don’t have time to keep up in real time, and posting on a thread days or weeks later doesn’t really work. I think the only reason I registered on MN in the first place was to post on the Spartacus thread.

Helena, which bit of London? I swim. No idea about teaching but I could give it a go, or at least get you started, the main thing is learning to trust the water. PM me if Jessica’s coach doesn’t work out.

Sticking my hand up as yet another lurker, for mainly the reasons given by so many posters above. I'm vocal on twitter and irl as much as I can be, but someone here has nearly always said it first and with much more panache than I could. I lurk so much because it soothes my rage to see so many women here who haven't swallowed the bullshit.

What a terrifically heartwarming thread. Thank you.

I don't post much in FWR but read every day, follow links, have spoken to my MP. In RL have to be cautious, I have fingers in a few pies, like many the lines drawn are cause for concern.

So KOKO you lovely, lovely women.

NB blurking is a great phrase and Be More Nanna an aphorism - clever and funny - to live by.

Yet another lurker. I discovered this board when I read something about Germaine Greer becoming persona non grata. Before that I was only vaguely aware that womanhood was under attack, as I don't Twitter or Facebook, and there hadn't been very much in the press. To be honest what I've learned since has hit me pretty hard and left me feeling that (to borrow a phrase from the TRAs) women's existence is being denied, certainly undermined. I think "How dare they appropriate my state of being? How dare they think they know what being a woman is all about? How dare they push in places where they have no business to be? I'm so very grateful to the articulate and intelligent women on this board that very patiently post day after day, to give the rest of us knowledge and ammunition to spread the word.

Another long time lurker here. Like other lurkers I dont feel I have much more to offer as the regular posters usually say what I feeling much better.
After eading here for many years now though I have felt able to put my head above the SM parapet on facebook (cant figure twatter out) to be continually shot down & called bigot/terf by my predominantly liberal lefty friends list. I dont care anymore and have been more than able to hold my own. I know Im unlikely to change any of their minds... but hope that there are lurkers who will read, be intruiged & read/research more.
So many smart & inspiring women on here, thank you all.

Another lurker here (though I have to take regular breaks because it all gets just too depressing and enraging so I don't lurk as much as I used to), never really have anything to add to the discussions but I have learnt so so much from here, I am very grateful to the amazing intelligent posters here.