Banned from women-only FB group

[maet]

A trans woman edited by MNHQ because OP is using second language posted in a women's only FB group wanting free emotional labour and "validation" from untrained women to help them with getting over their abusive ex boyfriend.

I stated it wasn't appropriate to ask untrained women to take on their emotional labour, especially considering what had happened to them was so traumatic (according to them they ended up in hospital), and especially not for free and suggested they seek professional help instead.

Cue trans woman and women stating I was being transphobic, and "wouldn't understand the fear a marginalised group would go through."

I was told I hadn't been through a traumatic experience before so couldn't possibly understand what the OP was going through.

I've been banned from a group specifically designed for women. Nowhere in the post did I mention anything about the OP being trans.

I am so sick of this shit. The world has gone mad.

maet

Your English is excellent and you have been very clear. I don't know if this is your first visit but welcome to the board and i hope you will stay and spread the word in Germany regarding MN and FWR.

I haven't heard much regarding trans issues in Germany so am curious.

Sorry not meaning to derail but genuinely very curious as mostly posts seem to be about English speaking countries.

I could say the same thing about you responding here. I wanted to ensure the person knew it wasn't an appropriate place and direct them to a more appropriate place to find the help they needed.

But there are ways and ways of saying that.

Lots of people come onto MN to ask for help on a variety of issues, often asking for free advice from people that usually you would expect to pay to help, legal problems are just one example. Often I think that people actually need professional help from medical or mental health practitioners And many posters explain exactly that but in a tactful and supportive way. I can't think of any occasion where a poster talking about a sensitive issue like abuse has been bluntly told that this isn't the place to seek help, stop asking posters to do emotional labour and provide free help.

I also used to moderate a group for women suffering from a condition related to pregnancy - anyone posting a response similar to yours would have been spoken to because that isn't necessary to be so harsh.

If you felt this person was in the wrong group or needed professional help why not approach the mods and suggest that, but in a supportive way?

Maybe you were banned for how you said something rather than what you were saying?

Why would someone assume a group for women in tech start up's is an appropriate place to get untrained therapy?

They wouldn’t.

Unless they were attention seeking and got a kick out of invading women’s groups and being “accepted “ as it makes them feel validated as women.

Or unless they believed that it’s women’s work to make them feel better about their problems, because women are all so kind, fluffy and understanding.

Or unless they believed that women should not be starting up tech companies and should be caring for men’s hurt feelings instead. When they are not taking about nail polish and periods of course.

It’s a sad inditement on that FB group that the admins felt powerless to say not to a man. Even German woman in tech need to centre the all important male ego. Sigh.

@Catapultaway I don't. I have a problem being called transphobic when I'm not being transphobic. But it does highlight other issues going on within feminism currently. Intersectional feminism seems to be the most popular form of feminism and seems to centre men in feminism. It poses a lot more questions. And the admin removed me and possibly others because a man complained. So a man had a say, not a woman.

What exactly was your response to this person OP? Did you really get banned just for saying ‘OP I think a professional would be best placed to help with this’?

Also, you are repeatedly calling this trans woman a man. Many people include trans women as women. This was a private Facebook presumably not set up by you. Maybe your views weren't in line with the people who set up the group and so they didn't want someone with your views in the group,which is their right really.

Maybe you could set up your own group and then you can set the terms for your group?

@DecomposingComposers I was tactful and supportive. I was called transphobic because I didn't give the correct answer to the trans woman. They wanted everyone to fawn over them, and when most didn't they called us transphobic and I was banned.

@DecomposingComposers
I also used to moderate a group for women suffering from a condition related to pregnancy - anyone posting a response similar to yours would have been spoken to because that isn't necessary to be so harsh

You are forgetting that German conversational style is much more direct that British English. What might be seen as harsh in an English pregnancy support group might be fine in German tech support group.

Context is important.

@Earlywalker yes, my response was:
"Most members won't be able to provide appropriate help for you, as we are in tech and not medically trained. However there are many English speaking therapists in Berlin, and I hope you'll find the help you need!"

I'm confused as to how it's transphobic. I would post a screenshot but their name and picture would be visible.

Some of this is depressing reading.

It simply wasn't an appropriate space for the discussion this person wanted to have. The fact they joined the group and started this discussion is in line with a lot of behaviours displayed online by certain types of people. Where you want to believe it happens or not there is plenty of evidence and experience to show it does.

Would anyone join a professional discussion group targeted at men and start talking about their abusive relationship? No.

*whether you want to believe

Right and you got kicked off the group and called transphobic for that?

Sounds believable for sure.

@DecomposingComposers trans women are men. They are biologically men. I can't lie and say they aren't. My post wasn't harsh at all.

I'm an admin for a special interest group and after you've been around the block a few times it becomes very easy to recognise when people are there with the purpose of transgressing boundaries and derailing.

The mod team in your group probably think they are doing the kind thing by 'protecting' this person but they will be in for a sharp shock down the line when the group ends up decimated.

Btw - If you’re on IPhone Op, you can easily click ‘edit’ on a screenshot and scribble out their name and picture.

@Earlywalker well, I did. I find it hard to believe but it happened. If someone could tell me how I could remove the name of the person from the post - such as blurring it out - I'll be happy to post my response and theirs.

Earlywalker you are clearly not in the know on this.

@Earlywalker I'll try that, thanks.

Right and you got kicked off the group and called transphobic for that?

Everything is transphobic. They find a way to twist everything into transphobia.

What's really transphobic though is holding the bar of behaviour so low as if trans people cant possibly be expected to behave appropriately and allowing them.to get away with this shit.

I wouldn't start posting screenshots OP. There's no need and some people like to use these threads for twitter fodder or worse as a means of doxing women.

What Ova said.

@OvaHere okay... although I'm happy to share them privately with anyone who doesn't believe this is true. Unfortunately it's more common than people think. And if someone had told me 2 years ago these things would be happening, I wouldn't have believed them either.

Obviously don’t include any names OP or names of the group you’re in if you do post them op

Don't share even by PM. You don't know who anyone is here.

It's a small step from finding out which group you were part of to people finding out your real life identity especially if this is a FB group.

What's really transphobic though is holding the bar of behaviour so low as if trans people cant possibly be expected to behave appropriately and allowing them.to get away with this shit.

Quite. Apart from the transphobia how is it beneficial to transpeople when expectations of them are so low? When expectations of a demographic are low there is considerable evidence that they don't try to do better, they are being limited by the low expectations of others.