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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

What can we do to get Penny's ROGD inquiry moving?

44 replies

ByGrabtharsHammarWhatASaving · 06/05/2019 23:17

Between the Times "Trans experiment" piece, the publication of the Littman ROGD study, and the inquiries into the same phenomena announced recently in Sweden, someone needs a fire lighting under their arse.

I've just been reading the stories at www.parentsofrogdkids.com/what-we-do and nope, nuh uh, this is not fucking on. I know that's an american site but you can find similar stories on our own LGBT kids board. Many people in this forum have had it happen to them. Seriously, it's bloody obvious what happening here. Any one with a brain can see the patterns, and the attempt to block research just confirms it.

My kids are just babies still but I'm seriously frightened. Like, not sleeping, can't concentrate on anything else, having nightmares levels of frightened for them. For all the children being used as ammo by this insane movement. So come on, she's had since September to piss about over this, how do we get things moving?

OP posts:
LangCleg · 06/05/2019 23:21

I have a plan to write to my MP asking him to progress with the minister.

Will provide more detail once I've got the points, citations - and my shit, generally - together.

Genderfreelass · 06/05/2019 23:27

Now she's defence secretary I think women and equalities will be even less of a priority for her. I don't undrstand how any decent human being can think it's ok what's happening to these vulnerable youngsters.

ROGD needs investigating and all minors presenting as trans should be helped and supported through watchful waiting. How they can do anything else when GIDS have said that leads to the majority desisting is beyond me. If PM doesn't have this investigated these youngsters being drugged, mutilated and their lives destroyed is blood on her hands, she will be complicit in horrific experiment against children.

Sorry bit of a rant

HumberElla · 06/05/2019 23:34

Gosh yes so it’s been 8 months gone by. Urgent enquiry eh? Looks liked kicked to the long grass more like.
Yes I’m absolutely keen to keep pressure on PM. How do we make sure she can’t continue to ignore it?

ByGrabtharsHammarWhatASaving · 06/05/2019 23:48

I'm thinking some sort of Shawshank Redemption-esque twice a week letter writing campaign.

Seriously.

I'm actually seething over this. How dare anyone be so cavalier with the lives of children. I was starting to believe that the silent majority was a myth, that maybe they were silent because they didn't exist, and that we were lone voices. But watching the explosion of support on Maya's thing that can't be named has made me bold again. And angry. My god I can't tell you how angry. Time to cut the shit and get things moving.

OP posts:
FannyCann · 07/05/2019 00:07

From one of the stories on the link:

"After she told us about being “trans”, we immediately made an appointment with the local pediatrician, who told us this happens sometimes if there is a trauma during pregnancy, and that she wished her daughter would have done this because she thinks she would have been happier as a male."

WTF do they teach at medical school these days?

Thingybob · 07/05/2019 07:33

I believe the Tavistock annual statistics are due this month which are likely to show that there have been around 3000 new referrals in the past year.

Surely that will make the politicians sit up and take this epidemic seriously?

KatvonHostileExtremist · 07/05/2019 12:09

She ignored my question about that here. It's so frustrating. It's so important!

OhHolyJesus · 07/05/2019 12:25

I've written to her office, no reply. I did get a response from dept for Children and Families and was mostly fobbed off so I replied to get an actual answer more info.

Wasn't there a thread on a Letter Writing Campaign? Will dig it out...

Ali1cedowntherabbithole · 07/05/2019 13:43

Make it matter to men. Actually, make it matter to men who matter.

And the dreadful truth is that children and especially girls with ROGD don't matter enough, at least not in their own right.

Some may be persuaded by arguments about a lack of future Grandchildren, but this runs the risk of "it won't happen to me / my family".

The economics may have traction in some quarters though, due to the costs, now and far into the future, of ROGD. Maybe tell Penny she can't have her new battleship or whatever as the money has been spent on Healthcare.

R0wantrees · 07/05/2019 14:32

Might be worth writing to Victoria Atkins MP (Women's Minister) as it was she who, last summer, raised the concerns about increase in numbers of children presenting to Tavistock.

Victoria Atkins also spoke with balance at the Westminster Hall 'debate' when Layla Moran talked about seeing people's souls.
See James Kirkup article:
(extract)
First, Victoria Atkins, the minister for women and equalities at the Home Office is a good thing, and someone surely heading for more senior ministerial office in due course. Ministerial responses to Westminster Hall debates are often boilerplate bromides written by officials and recited unthinkingly by the minister concerned. Atkins’ contribution was a lot better than that, and strongly suggests a minister who has taken the time to think critically about the issues (and actors) in an area where critical thinking has been painfully lacking.

Again, I don’t endorse everything Atkins said (I think she’s a tiny bit blasé about how effectively the Equality Act 2010’s single-sex exemptions are being implemented in everyday practice) but her general approach and tone were the right: it’s a complicated, contentious issue where loud voices on the extremes have drowned out and sometimes silenced legitimate questions.

Here are two eminently reasonable Atkins quotes that should be utterly uncontroversial but which are, in this context, refreshingly bold:

‘People are sometimes almost too scared to talk about things, which is not right. We do not want a climate of fear in the debate. We want people to be able to express their views respectfully and in a caring and careful manner, so that we ensure that questions are flushed out and answered.’

And:

‘I get asked about this issue regularly, and we all share a sense of sadness about the fact that this important debate sometimes gets taken over by loud and sometimes aggressive campaigning by activists. I am sure they hold their beliefs very strongly, but they perhaps lose sight of the fact that we have to be able to talk about this issue in a reasoned, respectful and caring fashion. The vast majority of the public—and, I am sure, parliamentarians—are in the middle. We want to talk about this issue in a caring and careful way so society gets to a position in which we are all comfortable with the consequences of the changes to legislation and so on.’ (continues)

blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/11/this-mp-has-summed-up-everything-wrong-with-the-transgender-debate/

Given Dawn Butler, Layla Moran, Mhairi Black, Maria Miller & Penny Mordant's contributions thus far, I think Victoria Atkins may be the best starting point within Women & Equalities dept as she seems less thoroughly lobbied.

R0wantrees · 07/05/2019 14:35

August 2018 Telegraph:

'Women's minister 'cautious' over the number of teenagers undergoing gender reassignment treatment'
(extract)
he women’s minister has said she is “cautious” about the number of teenagers undergoing gender reassignment treatment and warned the country needs to be “particularly alert” to the issue.

Victoria Atkins expressed concern that a rising number of teenagers were seeking “life-changing” medical interventions. Young people were undergoing treatment to change their gender because they regard it as “an answer to questions they are not asking themselves”, the minister said.

In an interview with The Telegraph, Mrs Atkins, who has responsibility for the Government’s gender equality policy, said: “I read in the paper recently that there has been a large increase in the number of teenagers who are identifying as such, and I think we need to get down to the reasons why this is happening." (continues)
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/08/26/womens-minister-cautious-number-teenagers-undergoing-gender/

R0wantrees · 07/05/2019 14:38

See also support from Tim Loughton MP after Victoria Atkins was criticised by TRAs & lobbyists:

Daily Mail 28/8/2018
"Transgender activists are 'too quick to stifle debate' says ex-children's minister worried over growing number of teenagers seeking to change sex
MP Victoria Atkins said she is ‘a little cautious’ about use of gender reassignment
But prominent LGBT+ campaigners accused her making 'damaging' comments
Former children's minister Tim Loughton said Ms Atkins is 'absolutely right'
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6105259/Transgender-activists-quick-stifle-debate-says-ex-childrens-minister.html

truthisarevolutionaryact · 07/05/2019 14:56

This enquiry will be facilitated by the Civil Service. Given that there are senior civil servants creepily removing women's rights to sex segregated toilets and changing rooms in the work place, I would be very concerned that they will get their hands all over this enquiry and stifle it at birth. As they also actively police women's expressions / demeanour on entry to toilets and then run training sessions to "educate" women on the correct behaviour on finding KarenWhite a born male in said places, I really am not sure that there will be anything other than a dismissive outcome.

Fallingirl · 07/05/2019 16:20

This thread seems relevant.

I am personally no good at working out who is doing what within Westminster, but maybe targeting both Atkins and the APPG mentioned by Chattylion is an idea?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/a3570445-The-2019-MP-Campaign?msgid=86728879#86728879

R0wantrees · 07/05/2019 16:41

Fallingirl thank you for the link:

theOtherPamAyres wrote:
"There is an All-Party Parliamentary Group on Young People's Health

This would seem to be an avenue for the enquiry into the state-sponsored experiment on children?

The Chair is Martin Whitfield (Labour, East Lothian)
Martin Whitfield MP, House of Commons, London, SW1A 0AA.
Email: [email protected]

publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm/cmallparty/190327/young-peoples-health.htm

jamrollyolly · 12/05/2019 18:39

Could we try emailing her (and/ or some of the other politicians listed by RO) all at the same time? If she got, say 30 or 50 emails at 9.15 on Monday, it may make more of an impact.

JackyHolyoake · 12/05/2019 18:57

Penny Mordaunt is Defence Minister now. I don't know who has replaced her for Women & Equalities.

jamrollyolly · 12/05/2019 19:05

I'm pretty sure she still is. You see Penny is so unbelievably talented and defence won't take up much of her time and women and equalities are so unimportant..

Procrastinator2 · 12/05/2019 19:15

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

jamrollyolly · 12/05/2019 21:27

Procrastinator, is that the right link?

jamrollyolly · 12/05/2019 21:27

Procrastinator, is that the right link?

SirVixofVixHall · 12/05/2019 21:59

16 year old daughter of a friend swiftly put in hormones, 15 year old girl in dds class at school wearing a binder. There must be stories like this everywhere. It is a tragedy that these girls are being shunted onto a pathway with sterility and mutilation at the end.

OhHolyJesus · 12/05/2019 21:59

Here is the text from the email to cut and paste in emails to MPs.

Good Morning,

After the huge success on "Lesbians on Chairs" we now turn our attention to our next event.

Standing For Women is pleased to announce our meeting at the House of Lords, hosted by Dr Lord Moonie entitled "First Do No Harm : The ethics of transgender healthcare."
3.30 - 5pm 15th May 2019, House of Lords Committee Room 2A.

Our talks are:

"Towards compassionate science based medicine/care for gender questioning individuals."
Richard Byng GP and Professor of primary care medicine at the University of Plymouth "Freedom to think: the need for thorough assessment in gender dysphoria"
Marcus Evans Psychoanalytic Psychotherapist, Member British Psychoanalytical Society and The Institute of Psychoanalysis
"Medical Harms of Gender Affirmative Therapy"
Michael K. Laidlaw, MD. Endocrinologist
"An Urgent Call to Action to Protect Young People and End Experimental Identity Medicine"
Leila Leoncavallo Kelsey Coalition consultant
"The Spread of an ideology and the targeting of children in UK schools"
Stephanie Davies-Arai Author, teacher trainer, parent coach and Founder of Transgender Trend
followed by a Q & A lead by Dr Lord Lewis Moonie

This meeting is limited to parliamentarians. Please encourage your MP to attend this meeting and ask them to RSVP to [email protected]. There are limited spaces available and so we operate on a first come, first basis.

Have a great Sunday!

Posie and Venice

#firstdonoharm

OhHolyJesus · 12/05/2019 22:01

Is anyone a constituent in Portsmouth North to write to Penny asking her to go?

Procrastinator2 · 12/05/2019 22:24

Jamrollyolly, no sorry it is not the right link, but OhHolyJesus has the correct information. I will ask Mumsnet HQ to delete my post.