Maya Forstater

[DianeBrewster]

MN have deleted the thread started by Maya - who lost her job for speaking up for women- because it talks about her crowdfunding for legal costs

Here is today's times article on the case https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/tax-expert-fired-for-saying-trans-women-aren-t-women-tpqgnm9vj?shareToken=3f12f5cae61c02fd41040eb816fd37b4&wgu=2705255426441557045162977940f0d76fa1&wgexpiry=1564821162&utmmsource=planit&utmmedium=affiliate&utmm_content=22278

Yeah, it's the age of opinion and over-confidence. No one is interested in facts. Tom Harwood is mansplaining to feminists that self-id is a good thing because it means that men who want to use women's spaces can access medical treatment quicker . The guy doesn't have the first idea about the modern trans movement or the feminist position on gender ideology or what self-id actually means. He thinks it's all about the removal of the penis.

"He thinks it's all about the removal of the penis."

Slight ammendment.

(As in, I rather suspect thats his general approach to women's rights in general...)

But was it ever any better? Has there been a decline, or do we expect more now?

The obsession with identity politics and 'feeling' politicians has led to the decline. I'm not saying politicians should be unfeeling technocrats, but the absence of critical thinking is very worrying.

Very interesting point about identity politics in Caroline Criado Perez ‘s book.

She contends that we’ve always had identity politics, it’s just that up until about 30 years ago the only identity being catered for was white, rich man

I blame the fashion for favourite talking heads who are, by and large, entirely ignorant of the topics they're paid their fees to opine about

Agree. I think it’s supposed to create interesting TV, but the problem is they rely very heavily on a small group of people who seem constantly available and probably hang around outside the studios waiting for a call.

With so much competition there is a tendency to prioritise sound bites and conflict over information.

YY Floral. Penis-centred in more ways than one.

But was it ever any better? Has there been a decline, or do we expect more now?

It's my perception that there's been a decline. I think of Profumo. After the scandal in which he was disgraced he left politics and volunteered for a charity for the rest of his life.

OK, he was unusual, but I think slightly more politicians in the past had a sense of public duty and valued what they saw as their personal honour/integrity.

Maybe I'm away with the fairies though..

Blackwhite...when applied to an opponent, means the habit of impudently claiming that black is white, in contradiction of the plain facts. Applied to party discipline it means a loyal willingness to say that black is white when party discipline demands this. But it means also the ability to believe that black is white, and more, to know that black is white, and to forget that one has ever believed the contrary.

Transwomen Are Women

prawn

I've often thought of the Profumo affair and the genuine shame that it provoked.

I can't help thinking it would barely get a mention today. Or he would be on Big Brother next week. Or she would.

Tom Harwood is mansplaining to feminists that self-id is a good thing because it means that men who want to use women's spaces can access medical treatment quicker

Here's Tom explaining feminism:

www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=5&v=7mm9ujHMww8

I don’t know who this Tom is but I absolutely can’t stand the twerp

Loving the comments in support of Maya, Tom Harwood has been great in raising extra support 😂😂😂

Has politics declined - I think it has, with identity politics being used to shout down opposition critical thinking and common sense were pushed aside. Feelings have become more important than facts and people think they should not be offended. I think SM has played a big part in this as it allows for those offended to shout down enmasse the perceived enemy, something that is far harder to do in real life.

The problem with current left wing identity politics is that it confuses the need to have respect with the need to have rights.

It’s more interested in punishing blasphemers than analysing the causes of inequality.

I can 100% understand that the ability to use public toilets enables participation in society and that without that people are excluded. It should be possible to have facilities for all.

However Stonewall are more interested in dying on the hill of a man’s right to use the toilet of his choice because on Tuesdays she wears nail varnish.

The panel were incapable of more than soundbites

The Panel was a good illustration of how mouthpieces and politicians all sing from the same song sheet.

The BBC tries to balance the participants across the political spectrum. The panelists differed when talking about the party system and other topics. It was striking how they all agreed on this political hot potato: self i/d was to be implemented at any cost.

The symbolism and parallels were not lost on me.
Here was the The Metropolitan Elite chattering, while Maya was reduced to the role of onlooker. I can imagine that Maria Miller's Enquiry team worked in much the same way.

New theory. It will be like Hamlet.

All the main characters die and Prince Fortinbras of Dorne turns up at the end and finds them. He takes the throne but gives them all a nice funeral.

Oops, wrong thread ( thinking if Game of Thrones), that would be a bit dramatic for BBC News.

It would certainly up the entertainment factor of politics live if that did happen merrymouse

I love the confidence that a private school education gives you.

Tom Harwood. What a wally.

Prince Fortinbras of Dorne turns up

I’m now picturing Maya turning up at the tribunal and sweeping into the room, like Prince Fortinbras. 😁 I’ve no idea who he is, but I’m really hoping he’s one of the good guys or I’ll be apologising to Maya later.

It’s more interested in punishing blasphemers than analysing the causes of inequality.

YY

Maybe Tom should conduct a poll for his readers on the GuidoFawkes website whether they think TWAW. I think he might get a bit a shock.

thank you maya! just got round to pledging Only yesterday a friend of mine has had her livelyhood put at risk because she publicly stated that she had concerns about the ideology that " trans woman are women" and has been accused of being a transphobic, bigot and terf to her employers. I have no doubt that if I was to publicly do the same then my career would be in jeopardy also. thank you for standing up for us all

It was striking how they all agreed on this political hot potato: self i/d was to be implemented at any cost.

Which wasn't even the topic. The topic was whether Maya should have lost her job. Jo Coburn asked Molly Scott Cato whether people should be able to say what they feel. Scott Cato responded by saying that it's the Green Party's position that transwomen are women, and she wasn't sure whether it (?) should be a public debate.
But there was a public debate about the government's self-id proposal, and Maya's view is based on her belief that men cannot become women (hardly controversial). She should be allowed to say it without fear of reprisal, and it has absolutely nothing to do with whatever the Green Party's policy happens to be.
It's this frankly idiotic mindset demonstrated by Scott Cato that led the Green Party to fuck up so badly with the Challenor case. I despair.