Rape victims must hand over phone or police won't pursue crime

[RedToothBrush]

Both Independent and Times carrying story on their front page.

This is going to backfire spectacularly.

They told me it would contain evidence JackyHolyoake I asked them what evidence and they said messages between me and the man who assaulted me. I asked why couldn't they get them from his phone and they said they needed to go through both.

Despite the man admitting it via messaging , there wasn't enough evidence as the police said they weren't able to be sure it was him who had logged into his account and messaged me those things...

Despite the man admitting it via messaging , there wasn't enough evidence as the police said they weren't able to be sure it was him who had logged into his account and messaged me those things
Then it's pointless then isnt it just another way to show women and girls who's boss

Let's also remember the woman who used her phone to record her own rape who still ended up being told she wasnt the right kind of victim and the man got off

The use of the victims mobile phone will help more cases than it hinders. It's not just for Rape, it is a form all victims of crime are required to sign.

"Despite the man admitting it via messaging , there wasn't enough evidence as the police said they weren't able to be sure it was him who had logged into his account and messaged me those things"

"Then it's pointless then isn't it angry just another way to show women and girls who's boss"

Indeed, it is pointless because, conversely, police cannot therefore be sure that it was the victim who logged into their phone and sent any messages either.

So, yes, this could now seem to be a tactic to deter victims from reporting sexual offences to police.

I want to know the exact details of what sort of messages and other information is being sought and why. This information needs to be listed in detail on any consent form.

And this is why I will never report a sexual crime

And this is why I will never report a sexual crime

One suspects that's the entire point.

It makes men look bad doesnt it. So lets make it as difficult invasive and degrading as possible .

This is absolutely absurd. There were plenty of flirty texts between me and the guy who raped me, I went on a date with him and was actually quite smitten, planned on sleeping with him as things progressed. Didn’t stop him raping me though.

And no, I didn’t report it. I knew (as did he I’m sure) that there was no way I’d be considered a credible witness with that background.

I've always wondered what exactly is enough evidence to get a conviction. If the woman who filmed her own rape didn't have enough evidence then what on earth is enough?

Suspects' phones are routinely seized and interrogated.

I dont even think that was the worst comment jessica

The facebook comment is dreadful...

I went through this and it was years ago. My investigator started to act suspicious of me once I was crying about losing my work phone. It took me 2 years after the case ended to get it back. Very traumatising

@Jessica

🤔 And I support that. When it was an issue of not getting clothes back I thought that was terrible. But this is your phone, which is an important piece of evidence, and which you get back shortly after!

I don’t understand how anyone could be so offended by the thought of handing evidence over to the police, but still expect that their attacked be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

It’s not a ‘horrific comment’ it’s my personal opinion, based on having gone through this horrible process personally.

(No crime is fun, no process of achiving a prosecution is easy. But it shouldn’t be- because the legal system is a two way street)

There were plenty of flirty texts between me and the guy who raped me, I went on a date with him and was actually quite smitten, planned on sleeping with him as things progressed. Didn’t stop him raping me though

If the defence statement is based on consent (as Harriet Wistrich said on R4) what's wrong with that evidence being presented to the jury - on a ''the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth' basis.

My attacker was convicted BTW, several years in prison. So I can’t say I regret for one moment handing my phone in for a few weeks!

When I was raped my phone was my only comfort as it allowed me to contact friends and family, so no I didn’t just give it up. It also contained images of my child, and possibly images of my own naked body which they will have gone through. Horrendous

Oh and mine wasn’t convicted due to lack of evidence. Even though there were literally eye witnesses to the rape. I was unable to work properly for 3 years without my smartphone. Providers will not replace them on insurance if the police have got it and you’re ‘getting it back’, had to manage with a cheap thing that would crash every 2 mins

Please get off the feminism board if you’re going to attack rape victims. How disgusting

Well you had better get off the board too, freetone, in that case.

This legislation applies to all victims of crime; there is no specific targeting of rape victims, however it is true that with the crime of rape it becomes more complex and sensitive.

There is also no 'must' about it; victims will be asked as part of evidence gathering but it will not be demanded. We have heard from at least one poster on this thread how location evidence gathered from the victims phone helped secure a conviction. If the problem is the idea that evidence on phones may be used to exonerate a rapist, e.g. flirty texts, then surely that is a problem with pervasive rape myths, and not the act of handing over a phone. The problem is the rape myths, not the evidence gathering.

Those accused of crimes are frequently asked to give up their phones, so I am unsure why so many posters have said they aren't. There has been a high profile case recently (that cricketer) where messages on his phone were used to help secure a conviction.

it is true that with the crime of rape it becomes more complex and sensitive

Yup

And unfortunately the media are all over the 'take phones from accusers to stop false accusations'

Media reporting does not help...at all

It does not help at all Rufus.

Every headline I've seen this morning has said "rape victims to give up phones" (or words to that effect); there doesn't seem to be any headline without the word rape in it despite the fact it would be much more accurate.

The media are clearly zeroing in on that particular angle.

I know there have been cases where the victim has been found to have made false claims proven by phone messages - but surely this will be seen on the phone of the other party?

Traumatic enough to have gone through and attack and pluck up the courage to go to the police - but to then have your phone taken from you (for god knows how long). All your contacts, your support, even your work.

And what about the poor women murdered during sex that ‘got out of hand’? There have been a few of these recently so what would a phone say for some woman who almost dies? Arranging a meeting for, whatever - and that is seen as consent to a beating or throttling?