‘More acceptance’ of S&M needed

[Imnobody4]

talkradio.co.uk/news/more-acceptance-needed-sm-activities-19032230392
My morning isn't starting well. Haven't heard the programme - not sure I could stand it.

Having their behaviour normalised and validated by wider society is core to their kink.
I don't enjoy high protocol because anyone validated or normalises me for it. It certainly isn't core to any part of my kink.
In private I have adopted a certain way of (agreed upon) speaking/writing/sitting/mannerisms etc. In social settings with people involved in kink, I have only a very few times then extended that towards Dominants I was not in a relationship with.
I don't practice many protocols to this day either, since I live with my Dominant partner I would find it exhausting.

Having my behaviour validated is not in the least core to my kink. I don’t do high protocol and I can’t soeak for those who do. You would need to ask them.

I’m a part of a community because those people are my friends and I organise (less than I used to) meet ups with those friends.

I share an interest with them. That’s it. It’s not about validation from wider society.

Also I think we need to keep space open for women exiting BDSM, just as we keep space open for women exiting prostitution and for detransitioning / desisting women.

So as much as 'here is how hitting women is progressive' makes me want to shout and smash things, I attach no blame to women who have internalised that message.

Wider society - society beyond the bdsm community.
I am not practicing anything publicly and I don't continue any form of high protocol into wider society. I'm very confused

It's not really about you Bankofenglandfiver.

I’m confused about that too.

I practice at home. In the context of my sexual relationship with my partner. I go to events with like minded friends.

It’s not about wider society.

I’d like to see kink more accepted so that I can do what I previously said - but if wider society isn’t going to change, then I’ll live within my own boundaries that I set for myself quitehqppily.

People are asking me questions, and I’m answering.

Fair enough, I’ll go.

I hope you all have a lovely evening.

I’m not talking about high protocol or carrying out sexual acts.

I’m talking about the ‘special club’ and no true Scotsman approach to bdsm.

Where some people who are into bdsm have a very deep seated need to have their version of what a Dom is and does, what a sub experiences, what bondage is, agreed upon by a community. Following from this they want wider society to validate that their version of bdsm is the true, right and correct version. Anyone not adhering to that version is to be explained away or brushed aside.

Where does that desire to have your specific experiences validated come from?

Where does that desire to have your specific experiences validated come from?
I'd imagine it comes from the central point of BDSM, SSC. I still don't understand who is asking anyone to validate anything though.

The topic of the thread is the normalisation of bdsm!

People repeatedly saying that xyz is not real bdsm are asking for validation of their specific experiences and perspectives.

What research does show is that there is a huge increase in women experiencing hair pulling, choking and other sadistic acts.

The need for some people to say, oh but we need you to understand that sadism, bondage and dominating people have nothing to do with my bdsm is just totally self absorbed.

Normalisation of bondage, sadism and domination is an issue. People in special clubs who want to talk about the finer points of sub drop, really not the experience most people are having when it comes to sadistic, dominating or restraint based sex.

This is all very interesting but my chest is still getting tight every now and again. I absolutely cannot understand how people could be into it. What if the dom had a heart attack or seizure while you were tied up or something? What if they just had a moment of unforeseen madness? It freaks me out to contemplate. This isn't a judgement BTW, just a report of how the topic affects my fight or flight responses.

I would like to know how that fits in with the sub having all the power in the relationship, WeRiseUp, it's a good question.

We rise up, what you’re saying kind of is the issue in the original article.

Should the law allow people to agree to physical acts that are being conducted by someone who is incompetent to carry out such acts?

Should people be allowed to restrain another person outside of an environment like a hospital or prison?

I think what it makes me realise is how utterly darkside bondage actually is. It really is about accessing some deep, dark part of the psyche. It is about power play, fear of death, control. 'Kink' just sounds a bit light-as-a-feather for what is actually being talked about here.

So in cases where women have died or been maimed during ‘rough sex’ and the defence is consent, should the law be that nobody can consent to an act carried out by an incompetent person in an unsafe environment.

If I die at the dentists, the dentist can’t say as a defence that I consented and he just got carried away into criminal negligence.

How do you expect people to comment on something outside their scope of experience, EndofDays?

If the posters here don't associate with people into hairpulling, choking etc then they are no more able to comment on it than vanilla people.

It is also worth considering exactly who is normalising BDSM. It doesn't seem to be those here, who have wanted it to remain in the shadows.

Posters have been asked to describe what BDSM means to them. Calling their responses self absorbed is unfair.

I don’t think people into bdsm are more qualified to talk about the topic than anyone else.

Talking about situations beyond your own experience is essential when discussing social issues.

I don’t believe it is self absorbed to talk about one’s own experiences. It is self absorbed to claim those experiences are somehow more real or authentic than a great number of other people’s.

If you look back to the original post, it’s includes the question of whether or not someone can consent to having their ear removed in a bdsm context.

Very few people have had that experience, but that is the context in which acceptance and normalisation are being raised.

What if the dom had a heart attack or seizure while you were tied up or something?
You know this is something that in over ten years I have never even considered! Perhaps worth having my phone close by so I can tell Siri to call an ambulance. How awful when the paramedics showed up though.
Fight or flight is one of the natural responses in play I enjoy. But I don't want to sound self absorbed so I'll leave it at that.

Please leave siri nearby and check she still knows what you are saying when you're gagged!

It would be pretty awful from the moment the call handler came on and you had to explain that you couldn’t follow their cpr instructions, and your partner lay potentially dying on the floor.

It is also worth considering exactly who is normalising BDSM. It doesn't seem to be those here, who have wanted it to remain in the shadows.

One poster here has expressed a desire to roll back the legal protections against the consent defence being used by violent sadists. And compared it to lesbianism.

By the way, all the feminists here. You got a glimpse on this thread of the exact mentality and arguments that mean sadism is now considered a minority sexuality in need of rights and acceptance where I live. Sadists are now 'queer' and publicly identify as such. If Stonewall survives the trans movement, you can bet your boots the sadists will be coming for it (if they aren't already).

"Part of their kink is adhering to a set of rules set by, smiled upon by and witnessed to by a community.

Having their behaviour normalised and validated by wider society is core to their kink. "

This rang a bell for me. It's the difference between having a single Person X who likes to do Y, and being part of a community/group, however large or small, that has rules and regulations, however formal or informal. It legitimizes it. Both for those currently in the group, and for those outside it. The in-group specialized language plays a dual role, in that if you're in you know what the phrases mean, but the phrases chosen also seek to make things sound innocuous. Breath play, the repeated use of play itself, the linkage of what most of us think of as childhood 'not real' let's pretend, with very real adult physical acts. Goddess, doesn't that in itself tell us a whole load about what is actually going on here!

Forget the 'play', let's get back to the normalisation that means that women are being expected to engage in and enjoy ever more sadistic and formerly niche sexual interests. Even at the heights of the lesbian sex wars, I don't recall the actual abuse or erosion of womens boundaries that seems to be happening now, just (at worst) mockery if you were boringly vanilla.

"Kink' just sounds a bit light-as-a-feather for what is actually being talked about here." Hiding behind the words, it's not actual pain or abuse or wounds or bleeding or fire or cutting, it's just 'play'. (some of the things I used to come across in discussions about lesbian S&M BTW).

And it's still as disconcerting as I used to find it 20-30 years ago. That's not because I'm not educated enough, or haven't met the right participant to explain it to me properly, or it isn't just because it's not what I'm into -- the basic concept here, as someone else said, it's not coming from a healthy place or a good place in our psyche.