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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Munroe Bergdorf: all women are a fantasy and transwomen are living their own fantasy

69 replies

QuietContraryMary · 27/02/2019 21:42

Some sexist bilge for you here

www.glamourmagazine.co.uk/article/munroe-bergdorf-transactivism-interview

"Ed Razak, the marketing executive at Victoria Secret, said he would not cast transwomen in the annual show because they can’t sell a fantasy. All women are a fantasy, and transwomen are living their own fantasy. It’s great to see female owned businesses supporting transpeople and actually putting what they preach into practise."

I can see after tens of thousands of pounds of plastic surgery why Munroe might identify as a fantasy, but I'm not clear how Munroe thinks that applies more generally.

Bonus ageism

"Twitter is the worst, people can be so vile, whereas there are less comments on Instagram. It’s mainly transphobic old men or women who think trans people are hindering the feminist cause when in reality it’s the complete opposite. "

Ah yes the feminist cause of being a lingerie model. Bra selling rather than bra burning.

Munroe is fronting an ad campaign www.bluebella.com/blogs/news/loveyourself-this-valentines for a lingerie company. It leads with Munroe and then features nine non-trans-woman, such as actually stunning and brave Stefanie Reid, amputee Paralympic medallist. Obviously Munroe gets top billing though because of her inspiring story of having shitloads of plastic surgery just because she can.

OP posts:

terryleather · 27/02/2019 21:50

If we ignore these fools will they go away....?

I'm so very very tired of the tiresomeness.

AnyOldPrion · 27/02/2019 21:55

My eyes have rolled so many times today that it’s astonishing they haven’t fallen out,

My life has been so far from fantasy, and many of the difficulties are related to being born female.

Monroe appears to be living in a fantasy world and seems to be extrapolating Monroe’s fantasy and assuming that’s what womanhood is.

boatyardblues · 27/02/2019 21:57

All those years when I was elbow deep in nappies and laundry. Now I’m rocking perimenopausal flooding and insomnia with a side order of teenage sass from my eldest son. Yeah, I’m living the dream. 🙄

Agree about the tiresomeness. Will it ever end?

RockyFlintstone · 27/02/2019 22:02

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

littlbrowndog · 27/02/2019 22:07

Who knows rocky
But we know wha5 you mea;

DancelikeEmmaGoldman · 27/02/2019 22:10

Being a good model is an actual skill. Great models are, of course, genetically gifted, but they also have the ability to engage the camera through movement and facial expressiveness. In photo shoots their eyes are alive and engaging with the viewer.

If you look at someone like Coco Rocha you can see what a great model brings to her work; it’s not just about being pretty.

Which is to say, Paris Lees doesn’t strike me as a particularly good model, particularly when the whole point of models is to sell us something.

DancelikeEmmaGoldman · 27/02/2019 22:12

Sorry, Ms Bergdorf is the not-so-skilled model. Blame a headache for my brain fart.

terryleather · 27/02/2019 22:17

Agree about the tiresomeness. Will it ever end?

I ask myself this same question every day boatyard

DoctoressPlague · 27/02/2019 22:24

Women are fantasies and people who disagree are just old?
The arguments are getting more and more desperate.

tobee · 27/02/2019 22:39

Monroe is apparently 31. Time is ticking away. That's not so young.

I'm 51 in a couple of days

AncientLights · 27/02/2019 22:39

Got to stand up for Bergdorf here (shudder). All trans women are indeed living their own fantasy. Not one many of us would recognise though. But what do we know? We're only the old-fashioned cunty type, not brave and stunning at all.

ErrolTheDragon · 27/02/2019 22:55

All women are a fantasy

Said no woman ever, afaik.Said no man who isn't a misogynist either, I would think.

OlennasWimple · 27/02/2019 23:02

Am I womaning wrong again?

Cloven · 27/02/2019 23:09

All women are a fantasy

THEY’RE DENYING OUR EXISTENCE! Fetch the pitchforks! And the smelling salts! And somebody in West Yorkshire dial 999 for the love of god. We’re going to riot, TRA-style.

...okay no, but they literally are denying our existence. I’m a person, not a fantasy. Munroe clearly experiences themselves differently but they need to stop projecting that shit onto women.

Oldstyle · 27/02/2019 23:15

There is indeed a superabundance of shit being projected/thrown at women of late. I stand with the West Yorkshire pitchfork owners. That's a fantasy I can get behind.
But seriously this trip back to the 1950s is doing my head in.

calpop · 27/02/2019 23:17

What about old women? Are they real?

I do wonder how all these self loving 30 soenthing transwomen will cope with old age. What will happen when their skin starts to wrinkle and their tits sag and they are no longer some trans fetishists wet dream?

Good luck with the menopause biatches - cos presumably you're having that too, for that authentic womanly experience?

TemporaryPermanent · 27/02/2019 23:19

All women are a fantasy. My God could you express misogyny more directly than that?

BickerinBrattle · 27/02/2019 23:20

Long time poster, name changed.

Thank you, Monroe, for your honesty about living a fantasy.

My questions are:

when did "living a fantasy" become a civil rights issue;
why should others be required by law or policy to participate in your fantasy;
do ALL citizens have the right to require by law and policy that others participate in their fantasies, or do only people who identify as the opposite sex have that right?

trumptrump · 27/02/2019 23:29

I just showed those photos to my straight boyfriend. I can't type what his response was as it would break the talk guidelines.....

Original poster

QuietContraryMary · 27/02/2019 23:37

"I do wonder how all these self loving 30 soenthing transwomen will cope with old age."

Check out Caitlyn Jenner for size.

OP posts:

TallulahWaitingInTheRain · 27/02/2019 23:51

I am actually not a fantasy. Nor living one.

R0wantrees · 28/02/2019 07:31

2) why should others be required by law or policy to participate in your fantasy;

Or coersion?

Womens March London 2019, Munroe Bergdorf ends speech to crowd:
"I want you to join hands with the woman next to you. I want you to join hands.... everybody! And after 'three' I want us all to promise to be there for each other, not only the women that you know but the women that you dont. And not just the women like yourselves but complete strangers.
So after 'three' I want you to repeat after me, "I stand by you my sister"
crowd reponds to MB, "I stand by you my sister"
"again after '3'... 1,2,3"
crowd responds towards Munroe "I stand by by you my sister"
"Thank you"

twitter.com/MunroeBergdorf/status/1086694394814713858

bsc · 28/02/2019 07:38

Surely transpeople are able to set up businesses, including lingerie businesses, just the way someone that isn't trans can?
There's probably a market for attractive underwear that fits male-born pelvises better than female-born-shaped pelvises...

JellySlice · 28/02/2019 07:50

Weird.

Of course you can sell a fantasy. That's exactly what lingerie companies do. You never see comfy big knickers being promoted!

As for womanhood being a fantasy, sure, it is. A male fantasy.

Go you Bergdorf. Live your fantasy. Just don't expect me to validate it. I do not consent. I'll get on with living the reality of being a woman.

FemalePersonator · 28/02/2019 08:06

So Bergdorf is telling us how to be women again? Or that we're not womening correctly? Or they're better at womaning than we are?

Lather, rinse, repeat.

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