Is lingerie empowering to women?

[NeurotrashWarrior]

https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2019/01/30/munroe-bergdorf-female-empowerment-lingerie-trans/?utmsource=Facebook&utmmmedium=Buffer&utmcampaign=PN

Are these the kind of empowering messages our young girls need?

Please by all means promote ways in which gender stereotypes are smashed but I'm not sure lingerie is going to do this.

I'm rather confused by what PN are doing in this article. I'm semi convinced they're double bluffing.

I'd really like this thread to stay please as these messages and discussions are extremely important for young girls and boys. I'm shouting a tad lot more into my cuppa.

I used to wear lingerie (of my choice) sometimes as part of my sex life, and it did help to make me feel sexy and beautiful so I did probably did feel empowered, in the sense of being more self confident.
I certainly have no interest in Munroe 's opinions on female empowerment though and don't feel they have any relevance to me. It will be interesting to see how succesful this line is though.

Empowering over used word and always seems like it’s used for women

Very true

empower
/ɪmˈpaʊə,ɛmˈpaʊə/
verb
gerund or present participle: empowering
1 give (someone) the authority or power to do something."members are empowered to audit the accounts of limited companies"
2 synonyms:
3 authorize, license, entitle, permit, allow, sanction, warrant, commission, delegate, certify, accredit, qualify; More
4 

◦ make (someone) stronger and more confident, especially in controlling their life and claiming their rights."movements to empower the poor"
◦ synonyms:
◦ emancipate, unyoke, unfetter, unshackle, unchain, set free, give freedom to; historicalenfranchise "movements to empower the poor"

Bergdorf. So not aware of the day to day life of us plain ordinary women

Where does the real power lie in our society?

Not with the people dressed in frilly knickers.

How true.

I'm very grateful for the vast range of bras as there's now one (yes, only one) that fits me. It's really stretchy but firm, is underwired in the right place and is comfortable enough for actually moving in.

There is no lace or anything but is one of those 'smoothing' double layered bras so no nipplage. My norks are enormous so without it I couldn't bloody walk or even sit comfortably.

So yes, my bra 'enables' (not empowers - weird word) to live I suppose.

Underwear = very empowering
"Lingerie" (scratchy/silky/"sexy") = less so

I was so so happy to find a decent nursing bra that helped me stay comfortable, held my breastpads in place and looked smooth under clothes. It wouldn't be an exaggeration to say it helped me feed my baby longer which is one thing I'm proud of. Similarly I couldn't (wouldn't) have stuck at the exercise and learnt to run 5k without my ShockAbsorber bra.

That Smalls for All campaign suggests that decent undies can help reduce the rate at which women in refugee camps (for example) are sexually assaulted.

I say again: underwear=very empowering. "Lingerie" designed for the male gaze? Much, much less so.

Of course that ad campaign is not empowering, everything about it screams coercive misogyny. Just look at the tag line '“All women are the fantasy, no exceptions!”

All women - You're a woman, this applies to you. No point in arguing that it's doesn't. You have been told.
Are - not 'can be'. Not 'empowering choices'. Are. You have been defined.
the - note the definite article: there is one way to 'woman' and we are telling you what it is.
fantasy - think it's your reality that matters to who you are. It isn't. What matters is living up to someone else's fantasy and it's pretty clear from the pictures that that fantasy is a man's sexual fantasy.
no exceptions Just in case you haven't got the point. This is what a woman is. You are not permitted to dissent.

What happens if a woman wants to be anything other than 'the fantasy' I don't know. I guess that makes her not a woman given that that's what women 'are'.

It's a horribly sinister sounding campaign slogan and I can't believe that it's so tone deaf. I assume it was written by men for men buying valentines presents. I'm just glad it's an advertising slogan for pants and not a political slogan but I guess there's still time...

'it' not 'it's'. Clearly I have not fulfilled the fantasy of mastering the English language.

Apparently no one has yet solved the engineering riddle of how to make a bra for women with one breast due to a single mastectomy who don't wish to wear a prosthetic.

Luckily a lovely lady crochets nicer prosthetics apparently.

I don't think there's a bf option in this range? Not inclusive to all after all

Ha silly me! Boobs are just for the male gaze aren't they.

Tut tut Neurotrash, get with the programme. All Women Are The Fantasy, No Exceptions. Breasts are just wank fodder, not a complex biological system for keeping offspring alive.

'Empowerment' is 99% bullshit. What actual power could underwear that appeals to the male gaze give a woman? The 'power' of being sexually appealing to men, great. It is classic old-fashioned misogyny to interpret the fact that heterosexual men are attracted to women as a power that women have over men. It doesn't come as a surprise to me that Munroe Bergdorf believes that female power and value are connected to being the object of male desire.

It's such a fucking scam to tell women that conforming to patriarchal ideals of womanhood and basically doing exactly what men would want them to do is somehow going to stick it to sexism. Think of a stereotypical sexist man and if you think he would be all in favour of what you're doing, that should be a clue. Now that's not at all to say that you can't or shouldn't do it, but don't be fooled into thinking you're challenging sexism.

I always want to ask the question "what is this thing (which is being sold at me) empowering me to do? Is it empowering me to live my life the way I want to?"

Frankly I can't see how a bit of strappy lace is going to aid me in my black belt exam, study my target language or get me through a day at work with small children, so no, not empowering.

When questioning if something is truly "empowering" to women (lapdancing, prostitution etc) I usually ask myself, "are straight men doing it?" This individual has buggered that up slightly 😶 but not the majority of lingerie wearers are men so "no".

Fab analysis of the subconscious message in that statement Ana86.

That's a very good filter to use njord. Applies to many things.

"make (someone) stronger and more confident, especially in controlling their life and claiming their rights."

As mentioned upthread, my trusty shock absorber (and an amazing one by m and s years ago that they never made again) have helped me here in (attempting) to run, very handy when I did martial arts too.

‘All women are the fantasy’

Sounds like something an incell would say, it sounds like a threat.
No matter what you do, no matter who you are men are going to wank over you.

I’m aware all women are the fantasy that’s why I’m a feminist.

I hate the word empowerment, it feels like it is power that someone else gives you rather than being powerful: something you are all by your own efforts.
Empowerment can actually fuck right off, if it's given then it can be taken away.

Empowering over used word and always seems like it’s used for women

Yea little and 99% of the time used in a sentence with sexy.

How come it’s always used about doing things like burlesque and putting glitter on your tits, and not about not having a beauty regime, having sexual boundaries or telling the patriarchy to fuck off.

No, I don’t think lingerie is empowering, that’s too strong. But I do like nice lingerie and (soft) lace. It makes me feel good about myself when I get dressed each day. I dress for me but I like to look nice.

Having a comfy bra, under comfy warm tidy and clean clothes, a decent comfortable pair of shoes, a coat against the cold.

These are empowering garments.