Courting the far right is wrong.... part two

[CaptainKirksSpookyghost]

Previously:
Posie is bad, bad and bad.
Sodastream's are under whelming
We need to be nice for the bigger boys to like us.
Camp Coffee is revolting
Evidence is never presented for why our leader and saviour is bad.
Mr frosty is crap, all agree
TimeLady's mum made a camp Coffee cake back in the day.
Also a coffee kisses recipe is found.
The alt-right are mentioned a lot.
Paul McCartney gets a mention
So does Terry Pratchett's discworld.
Mr Fruity is remembered and discussed.
Nazi's were mention by early.
We were told we "need a common enemy"
(Why we need this is presently unknown.)

And now the exciting conclusion....

“You think pro-lifers are anti-woman. Yet here they are, protecting our rights to have boundaries and have spaces free of males.”

You mean when they’re not busy denying other women’s rights contraception - or abortion, even when they’ve been raped?! You don’t see a problem getting in bed with people like this? Seriously?

To get back to our ol’ mates the Nazis (where would we be without them?!) this kind of specious ‘reasoning’ would be like supporting Hitler because he created more jobs, despite his persecution of Jewish and gay people.

I’m against self-ID and I’m against any people/organisations with an anti-woman agenda.

And against anyone with a fascist agenda.

After Early originally posted that, they went on to say exactly what I wrote, that Posie was blaming Pakistani culture for ‘rapists’. That is twisting.

My culture has an issue with domestic violence, child abuse and silencing of women on the Marae. It’s accurate to talk about it and say, sexist Polynesian culture. It’s also accurate to say Polynesia has a history of terrible homophobia, such that they create Fa afafine because they’d rather trans them ( you can look up older gay Polynesian men talking about how that traumatised them ). None of that is racist. Lots of people talk openly about America and their racist culture too. If she was to say Pakistani culture introduced rape culture to Britain, then I’d absolutely call her out for it. She didn’t.

Maybe, but which culture?

Sorry, I was responding to the post about the serious one, poor timing on my part.

Ok, things make slightly more sense now that people are talking at cross purposes if Earlywalker thinks she’s talking about Emily Zinos and everyone else thinks she means Posie.

I think for someone to be able to use woman’s facilities they should hold a GRC, which means living as their sex for 2 years, drs letters, medical diagnosis etc.

In cases of sport, I think it must rely on biology with no exceptions.

In cases of prisons specialist ‘trans wings’ or similar.

Although that’s off topic but that’s my views.

I signed the self ID consultation as I disagree with it. I disagree with people on here a lot when I feel they are being derogatory about trans people in general, when it does not directly affect woman. E.g trans rememberance threads, calling them ‘men with fetishes’, things like that.

Earlywalker
You don't think Posie should work with this woman.
You don't think we should be associated with this woman.
I get it.
I don't care.

Early Walker doesn't seem to have a clue who she is talking about

I've got no problem with the women who are at the coal face of this, like Jean H and some of the others who have found this crossed a red line for them, drawing back because of their conscience. That's absolutely a mark of integrity and I respect their conscience decisions.

Others thing differently, as has been patiently explained over two threads now.

Posters like Earlywalker, who have done fuck all but pick and jab at women who are active, have no basis whatsoever for giving advice about who to work with to achieve the current aims.

You don’t see a problem getting in bed with people like this?

Did you read the first thread? We have explained, too many times, why working with people on this issue that we will disagree with on other issues, is essential. Nobody on the left is supporting us or giving us space to talk, so what do we do?

The point was not just about Posie working with her. It was about people with actual bigoted views, jumping on the feminist bandwagon in order to alienate transgender people, and feminists welcoming them with open arms.

Cwenthryth it’s important to read the other thread too. Posie is speaking with these people, that’s the issue we are discussing overall, and our lack of condemnation of Posie for doing so. Many of us would not work with them, but respect her for making her own choices and setting her own limits.

Ok, I understand now. Early Walker has just posted the exact phrase that they hope will get them some lovely screenshots

why do I not have a clue who I’m talking about?

Where have I ever said Posie was anti-abortion? If you read the thread I have been talking about the same people, just because people have not read correctly does not mean I don’t know who I’m talking about.

I don’t even have twitter to post screenshots. Although I would like to know where I can read ones on twitter that you all keep talking about?

The ones I get are from google images. Is there like a TRA twitter page? I feel like I’m missing out by not seeing it since you all think I’m one of them anyway.

In my opinion Early has actual bigoted views.

It harmed girls impacted by CSE, directly, when they were told they could not discuss the race profile of offenders cos it meant they were racist. Street grooming ad a race profile that was very distinctly pakistani muslim and related to structures and organisations in a community linked to businesses. This was known. It was harmful to those girls both in their recovery and in managing it that htey were not allowed to just say they avoided pakistani businesses, taxis especially, and why. That was not ok,
It was also not ok that the far right harmed htose girls, targeted people, exploited this issue, that police wer eso busy managing the far right they didnt see those girls. It was not ok when the far right raped those girls. Far right are abusive men who use violence.

Jean was apppalled because she knows the score with what happened I stand with Jean on that, and we all know when we hit a far right debater trying to exploit this issue. I have always responded to that in 100% the same way.

Labour placed those girls in the middle of a race row because they didnt want to talk about the instituional priority of this, which was that it wasnt a priority and nobody gave a shit.

The far right have been working to use cse and have been asked not to by victims, by campaigners, and they dont care cos the far right are nasty violent abusive thugs and they are linked to organisation and the reason they are rejected is not suppression its because they are repeatedly, consistently and reliably rejected as what they are. Thugs. Racist thugs exploiting girls who have already been harmed and put them at risk.

I have my own concerns about the lobbying groups around the right, but they are pre-existing political positions. We have a mainstream political party who atre at the roots of current far right threats, and who were directly at the root of the system failure around CSE, who were willng to place child rape victims in a race row rather than address it. That caused harm.

It is not racist to say that street grooming had a specific race profile, it does and it did. It is racist to say that that structure of offended is peculiar to a single culture because the fact is its a common structure that evolves, and is unchallenged when its white men. Its still not racist to say that that was the race profile or that race politics played a huge part oin it being ignored. Its disturbing to try and say the far right and Tommy Robinson were a solution when the only solution they offered was further harming rape victims.

You don’t see a problem getting in bed with people like this?
Ok. So here's a scenario. You hate Bob across the road. He's a Hell's Angel wannabe, his motorcycle is really loud and he plays Motorhead all day at full volume.
A huge land company buys the plot next to yours and wants to turn it into an abattoir.
Do you a: fight them alone because you hate Bob or b: accept Bob's support and no, you never realised he was vegetarian?

If we have the same opinion on this subject as a large group of other women that is a positive and has zero bearing on anyone's opinion on any other matter. Once we have won this battle, we don't have to stay friends with Bob. Bob might not want to stay friends with us! But we have something in common at a point when numbers matter.

Yes, it's a shame it didn't really happen.

nobody on the left is supporting us

Why is that, d'you think?

I’d really appreciate it if people joining this, read the first thread. It’s not fair to ask us to repeat everything again.

It was about people with actual bigoted views, jumping on the feminist bandwagon
Nobody is jumping on a feminist bandwagon. Feminist is as uncool as word as lesbian.
Those other groups have their own followers and don't need to pretend to be feminist.

It was definitely NOT posie parker who made this issue into a far right issue. I can get you the statements of the Labour politicians who did that deliberately to avoid discussion of system failure on their watch. In the middle of it, were actual girls. Who as far as I can see never made it out of being objects in other peoples identity to be abused and stoill have to deal with far right exploitation and widescale institutional neglect.