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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions
AngryAttackKittens · 23/12/2018 09:32

infants relating such items as fire hats, hammers, fir trees, and bears with males

So, at that age children don't understand where baby bears come from and that their production must logically involve a mummy bear. This is because they are very young and their brains aren't very well developed. Why, then, is anyone claiming that they know what their "gender" is? What if that particular child just really likes hammers, or is afraid of bears?

AngryAttackKittens · 23/12/2018 09:33

they had to perceive that fir trees share some attributes with men

Dad uses pine scented bath products? Honestly, how does anyone look at this rubbish, stroke their chin, and go "yes, this is very convincing"?

R0wantrees · 23/12/2018 09:38

Andrew Gilligan Sunday Times article,
'Lottery thousands pay for former trans stripper to sway public opinion
After the £500,000 given to Mermaids, the same amount has gone to Stonewall to ‘empower transgender leaders’
(extract)

"David Davies, the Tory MP for Monmouth, said: “Nobody objects to grants designed to provide services to LGBT people. But my concern with grants explicitly described as being for ‘influencing’ is that the lottery is taking a clear position at one extreme of what is a highly contested political debate.

“That is explicitly prohibited by their own rules which say that ‘political activity’ cannot be funded.”

After 24 years of lottery playing, a national obsession is in decline. “It’s gone right off the radar,” said Peter Grant, former director of its new opportunities fund, now senior lecturer in public and charitable funding at the Cass Business School in London. (continues)

Yet the proceeds remain enormous — more than £1bn last year. And the BLF, the largest of the 12 grant-making bodies which hands out £500m of the annual total to community causes, may be quietly shifting its priorities.

A search of its grants database reveals that last year £5.5m was paid to projects mentioning the word “women’s”, the lowest for any full year since 2004. In the first 10 months of 2018, £3.7m was paid to women’s projects, suggesting a further drop across the full year.

In the same 10-month period, £11.6m was paid to projects mentioning the words “older people”, again indicating less than last year (£21m). The declines are only partly due to the overall fall in money raised for good causes.

The BLF said that many projects benefited women or older people without naming them in the project summary. Including these, it said, meant that spending in the last financial year was £70m for women and £83m for older people. It claimed that on this basis “average annual spending” on both groups had risen.

“I would be very sorry if the lottery has fallen out of love with the older people’s sector,” said the television presenter Dame Esther Rantzen, whose charity for the elderly, the Silver Line, had its lottery funding ended this year.

“I think they think that older people have got a lot of advantages these days because of what the media say, but that’s not looking at the truth.”

Some of the new money has gone towards increased spending on identity politics. The grants to Mermaids and Stonewall may be traceable back to an event last year held by the LGBT Consortium, an umbrella body for most of the sector’s charities and lobbyists, with the BLF’s portfolio development director, Gemma Bull.

“Basically the pitch was that public donations to LGBT organisations have gone down dramatically since equal marriage, so the lottery needs to step in,” said one person who was there.

A few months later Bull went on an LGBT leadership course run by Stonewall and this year was named as an LGBT role model by the organisation OUTstanding.

Early this year the lottery paid for the LGBT Consortium to hire a new staff member, Matt Halliday, to draw up grant applications and work on a new funding model. Halliday left in July in apparent dismay. He tweeted that he had “written to the funders of my project with a report on my project and the things I’ve seen” but neither he nor the consortium would comment last week. The BLF said it had received no report from Halliday.

It appears that neither the Mermaids nor Stonewall awards were considered at the highest levels. One former staff member said only the largest grants went to the BLF board to be scrutinised by external figures. Projects of £500,000 or less were approved by heads of funding, the 12 or so people who are part of the BLF’s middle to senior management.

They “would typically have up to 165 different funding applications to consider in a three-hour meeting”, the former officer said, which meant a little more than a minute on average for each grant. “They would make their decision based on three to four sides of A4 submitted by the funding manager responsible for assessing the application. The vast majority just went through on the nod.”

A senior BLF manager disputed this, saying a maximum of 25 applications were considered at each meeting and the paperwork ranged from 1-10 pages.

The former officer said levels of scrutiny had deteriorated in recent years because of problems with a computer system: “In order to cope, they cut down a lot of the questions they asked applicants including, crucially, on safeguarding. You used to have to describe in detail what the safeguarding risks were and how you’d address them. But now you only have to tick a box saying you’ve considered safeguarding.”

The review of the Mermaids grant could prove important in setting parameters for political grants in the future. Passions are high on both sides: MPs have weighed in and the charity’s supporters have adopted the Twitter hashtag IStandWithMermaids." continues

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/lottery-thousands-pay-for-former-trans-stripper-to-sway-public-opinion-6lw9xbwgr

sackrifice · 23/12/2018 09:44

Bears and fir trees?

Grin
AngryAttackKittens · 23/12/2018 10:02

What about other types of trees? Is the delicately pretty silver birch female, and the robust oak tree manly? What if the manly tree has female squirrels living in it?

AngryAttackKittens · 23/12/2018 10:03

Also what about bonsai trees? If a child likes them what does that tell us about their identity?

Mariotta · 23/12/2018 10:13

I have an apple tree that fruits apples with a pinkish flesh. Girl tree, right?

howlsmovingcastle84 · 23/12/2018 10:32

Where do grafted trees fit into this? Has anyone considered them??

NotBadConsidering · 23/12/2018 10:40

Also what about bonsai trees? If a child likes them what does that tell us about their identity?

Didn’t Glinner’s friend they wanted to be Ralph Macchio when they were a kid?!

R0wantrees · 23/12/2018 10:42

This Rowan is woman-tree.

Others I can't speak for.

Binglebong · 23/12/2018 10:43

I would love the Times to publish that response in full. And after each statement a clear debunk showing how things are being twisted. Maybe even ask a few scientists to confirm how their results are being used to show something against the findings.

Binglebong · 23/12/2018 10:44

The would find grafted trees to be like clownfish Howl - with a little help they can show the tree they were born to be.

sackrifice · 23/12/2018 10:49

This tree is very confused...any ideas?

www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/science-environment-24348394/man-grows-tree-with-250-varieties-of-apple

HandsOffMyRights · 23/12/2018 10:50

Helen Mimmymum (let's all wave to a fellow MNetter) is spewing out more desperate tweets using emotional blackmail.

Helen🧜🏻‍♀️ (@mimmymum) Tweeted:
The Times are making themselves look really bad about now.

Attacking @Mermaids_Gender, a charity supporting trans kids just before Christmas, and now going for @stonewalluk just because they advocate for trans people.

So much for this being the ‘Season of Goodwill’?! 😯

☮️✌🏻🕊 t.co/bZLznwRjW2 twitter.com/mimmymum/status/1076787455154679815?s=17

ScipioAfricanus · 23/12/2018 10:51

Since trees can produce both male and female flowers (I think?) surely they are non-binary?

HandsOffMyRights · 23/12/2018 10:52

It's Christmas time so please ignore science and safeguarding and abuse.

If you believe in Santa then you'll turn a blind eye - for the kids of course.

Tanith · 23/12/2018 10:57

*Young children between 18 months and 3 years learn how to use the words 'man' and 'woman' to identify themselves and others (Berk, 2013: 531).

I have never heard any young child identify themselves as “man” or “woman”.

R0wantrees · 23/12/2018 10:57

Helen Mimmymum (let's all wave to a fellow MNetter) is spewing out more desperate tweets using emotional blackmail.

Helen should be reassured that the BBC is still firmly onside if Radio 4 Broadcasting House is indicative:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3458545-R4-Broadcasting-House-discussion-about-sexist-portrayal-of-women-in-papers-with-reference-to-Hannah-Graf-possible-first-trans-woman-James-Bond

I think Mimmymum may be more of a MN monitor than Mumsnetter
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3444548-Vice-how-an-online-forum-for-moms-became-a-toxic-hotbed-of-transphobia

HamiltonCork · 23/12/2018 11:07

Helen Minnymum has had a colossal 9 likes for that tweet.

Mermaids should be shut down immediately. It’s pedalling a load of dubious shite.

howlsmovingcastle84 · 23/12/2018 11:12

Bingle
The grafted tree in my garden has declared themselves non-binary and are now going by tzee

JackyHolyoake · 23/12/2018 11:32

And it seems that Helen chooses to miss the point that The Times article refers to the training session for teachers that was recorded and transcribed, in which it is clear from the words of the trainer from Mermaids that the so-called "science" she refers to is extremely suspect.

It is because we all care about children that we are challenging the claims made during that training session.

Maybe Helen should listen to the recording or read the transcript?

R0wantrees · 23/12/2018 11:34

Re Helen / Mimmymum,, threads:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3177923-This-is-what-Helen-from-Mermaids-writes-about-MN-feminist-posters

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3210806-Helen-from-Mermaids-has-started-a-Twitter-thread-smearing-Kiri-Tunks-Anne-Ruzylo-and-Womans-Place-UK

Times July 2018
'Facebook blocks links to women’s rights group'
(extract)
Facebook has blocked links to the website of a feminist campaign group after been targeted by transexual activists.

Woman’s Place UK fights for women-only spaces and raises concerns about people being able to self-declare as transgender. Links to the site were blocked over the weekend by Facebook on suspicion that they were spam or breaching community guidelines.

"Woman’s Place UK fights for women-only spaces and raises concerns about people being able to self-declare as transgender. Links to the site were blocked over the weekend by Facebook on suspicion that they were spam or breaching community guidelines.

The clampdown coincided with a message posted on Twitter by @mimmymum, whose profile said it belonged to “Helen”, an “intersectional cis feminist” who is “passionate about acceptance for transgender people & trans kids, equality & making the world a better place”. “Cis” is a term used for people who identify their gender as the same as the body they were born in.

The Twitter profile posted a guide on how to report Woman’s Place UK to Facebook for breaching guidelines. “Helen” accused the website of transphobia and excluding transwomen." (continues)
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/facebook-blocks-links-to-women-s-rights-group-q367rvz5m?shareToken=8912e7caa7b6869480647eb0fb1f4b32

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3314779-The-Times-reporting-on-the-harassment-of-A-Womans-Place-UK

HomeStar · 23/12/2018 12:55

archive.fo/uYkfl

Just found this. It seems this person blames Mermaids for his son's suicide. Sad

Can't be 100% sure because the first part of his tweet is missing, presumably deleted by Twitter.

deepwatersolo · 23/12/2018 20:03

So if there is anything archaetypical about the gender of trees, trees are clearly all feminine, judging from Latin and all those Nymphes associated with trees in Greek and Roman mythology, no?

Vegilante · 23/12/2018 20:28

OMG, if fir trees are male, then the one in my house now wearing shiny, glittery baubles, tinsel & twinkly lights must be a transwoman tree! And all along I've been misgendering it - oops, I mean her.

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