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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Women's Place event in Reading - 4th Dec

159 replies

ContessaHallelujahSparklehorse · 16/11/2018 08:55

It's local to me so I'm delighted!!

www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/a-womans-place-is-at-the-bar-tickets-52641760924?utm-medium=discovery&utm-campaign=social&utm-content=attendeeshare&aff=escb&utm-source=cp&utm-term=listing

OP posts:
GreenHats · 05/12/2018 19:43

That small group of boys outside the meeting last night are old enough to be abusive. They were enjoying themselves thinking themselves intimidatingly. And they were, I walked past knowing no one, they were the age of my son, I'm the same age as their mothers. As I walked back to my car parked in an unfamiliar car park I noticed a young man keeping pace with me, I stopped and moved to one side, he stopped just past me and looked at a bus timetable. I walked on, he walked on. I'm not tall, men with their height advantage don't tend to walk at the same pace.

Possibly coincidence, and he was trying to find a bus, I hadn't looked at the protesters closely so no idea if he was part of that group or someone passing. But when I was the age those boys were I had my first experience of being stalked by a boy their age I'd brieflÅ· dated. At the end of the day he'd come up to me and tell me everywhere I'd been that day. So as a result I got better at losing someone following me. I then had to go into that deserted car park, find the machine to pay and walk across to my car the opposite of the floor.

By the time I got home I was too hyped on adrenaline to sleep.
So whether that was a man was following me because I'd been in that meeting or it was coincidence doesn't matter. Those abusive young men half succeeded in what they wanted to do which was intimidate us, I was scared. They also wanted to scare us into giving up and that won't work. This was the first time I've been to a WP meeting but It won't be the last, that fear and how royally pissed off I am today at being scared is going to make me more determined.

If these young men have to resort to trying to scare ordinary women their mothers age out of talking to other women about human rights law and how it applies to them they are most certainly not on the right side

rightreckoner · 05/12/2018 19:58

The only group of people those silly boys target on their title page - apart from rich people - is feminists. TERFS and SWERFS get fucked. Women get fucked. They have no awareness of how their misogyny betrays itself.

And it amazes me that any man has the brazen lack of shame to call anyone a SWERF. It’s basically saying - how dare you deny my right to buy a woman?

Oh and boys - please could you use your Communist credentials to describe in clear terms exactly why prostitution is good but capitalism is bad ? Is it that capitalism won’t let you in to your rightful place at the top table because you are just students but at least you can still buy a woman while you wait to bring down capitalism (unless you manage to make loads of money and decide to keep capitalism going after all?)

KayM2 · 05/12/2018 19:59

That's awful! The walk to the Broad Street car park ( was it that one?) was not very nice, and it was nearly empty.

GreenHats · 05/12/2018 20:06

Quite, according to them SWERFS can get fucked, guess that's so they retain their ability to fuck (rape) a trafficked 'sex worker'/slave

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 05/12/2018 20:11

We were lucky at the Bath meeting in November. The protesters there were faintly preposterous though Maria McLachlan was understandably a bit nervous.

GreenHats · 05/12/2018 20:17

Yes Kay I'd parked in Broad St car park, it's not nice at night, I thought I'd got past being so jumpy about being followed it was an awfully long time ago but I guess the effects of male violence last for ever Sad and there's always a new lot of violent males ready to start intimidating women as soon as they come of age Angry

R0wantrees · 05/12/2018 20:20

thread re protestors & their supporters:
twitter.com/JammersMinde/status/1070305529925378049

ShotsFired · 05/12/2018 21:43

Their first post says "silent vigil".

What the hell kind of education are these kids getting if they can't even understand what "silent"means? Daft little oddbods.

ContessaHallelujahSparklehorse · 05/12/2018 23:36

In retrospect I'm quite glad that kindly MNetters offered me a lift home - waiting at the bus stop 100m from the venue might have been a bit of a dim move!!

OP posts:
heresyandwitchcraft · 06/12/2018 08:16

Flowers for GreenHats (and yet more Flowers for Rosa and anyone else facing this)

Sometimes my reaction is to laugh inappropriately. I still think the ridiculousness of the situation (read: unhinged bizarre behaviour of these activists) is so beyond my comprehension of real life, so absurd, so "if you wrote it as fiction, your readers would complain it's over the top", that really all I can do is cackle.

Clearly, the abusive behaviour of these TRAs is beyond the pale.

Please take care of yourselves out there!

BernardBlacksWineIcelolly · 06/12/2018 08:31

it was quite enjoyable watching a host of smart educated grown ups spank the bottom of the Reading Communist and Anarchist Society on this thread

twitter.com/UoR_CAS/status/1070041195412422656

they do sound like twerps

KayM2 · 06/12/2018 14:22

A few people have reacted angrily on another thread to some of my posts. I'd like to feel that in person they might make the same points in a different way; if I can get tickets to the next one, and you/ they recognise me, please search me out and we can talk about these issues. No-one did at the Reading meeting, but that may be my fault as though I arrived early I did not stay till the end.

I found people to be perfectly welcoming , whatever they thought of me, (or did not spot about my past) , but I like to be open with people, and I can listen.

If Stalin and Churchill could be allies-in - the -fight, I'd like to think that TS people who support WPUK's aims could be allies too.

Mumsnut · 06/12/2018 14:34

'brownskirts' Grin

R0wantrees · 06/12/2018 14:39

Kay you've chosen to make your personal details public. That's your choice.
Mumsnet users do not usually do this for good reasons.
Important to respect this, I think.

Any poster on the site may be challenged on the posts they make. Sometimes robustly.
Its not personal or just about you.

ColePorter · 06/12/2018 14:51

Thank you anlaf for the commentary Flowers It was sold out by the time I first saw this thread.

I would have loved to go to the meeting or to join your local group, but unfortunately I'm in a bind as I have teens who have drunk the kool aid and I don't want to rock our boat with too much confrontation. But thank you everyone for going and speaking out.

I've thought about popping over to the university and buying Prof Freedman a coffee / gin though, for support Grin

Ereshkigal · 06/12/2018 14:55

I'm sure she'd like that. She said at the meeting that she was very happy to elaborate on the themes and chat to people.

KayM2 · 06/12/2018 15:16

Rowantrees;
Yes, I have chosen to make certain things about me public. Mumsnetters are , of course, quite entitled to keep their own identities private. At least one has chosen to post to Mumsnet feminist threads that she has met me, while she was out leafletting. She introduced her self to me then in "mumsnet name " terms, presumably because in person I did not seem all that awful.

So though I obviously DO respect people's right to privacy, I didn't think it was unreasonable to suggest that anyone who meets me at a WPUK meeting would be welcome to come up to me and say their piece. They would not have to reveal their name or mumset "title" would they?

R0wantrees · 06/12/2018 15:22

Not sure why you would suggest someone disclosing or not their MN user name would be whether you were seen as 'awful' or not.

As you've acknowledged, the vast majority of MN users keep their username private for good reasons (their personal reasons)

ZuttZeVootEeeVro · 06/12/2018 15:44

I didn't think it was unreasonable to suggest that anyone who meets me at a WPUK meeting would be welcome to come up to me and say their piece.

Do you wear a fancy hat or something? Grin. How would anyone know who you are or even remember you from here?

Women are at the meeting to hear brilliant speakers and talk to other people. Not 'say their piece' to random strangers.

ContessaHallelujahSparklehorse · 06/12/2018 15:56

There were indeed some splendid hats about at the meeting jellyslice but I don't recall seeing Kay in one.... I think you spoke at a previous event in Reading if I'm correct, Kay? It was very interesting too Smile

Incidentally, I think 'talking to other women's can easily be the same as 'saying your piece to strangers' at a meeting where you don't personally know everyone there! Some of us go to hold forth, some to listen, most go and do a mixture of the above. Conversation is good, I think.

OP posts:
KayM2 · 06/12/2018 16:03

ZZVEV

Because although WPUK are perfectly happy to have TS people there ( we even discussed the loo situation ) and are most encouraging, we know that not everyone is as happy about that sort of thing. As we see on some MN threads.

We try to do the " decent thing", and to be open and honest. If it is true, as is often claimed, that we are always " easy to spot", then it seems only decent to say that we would be happy to hear other people's views, face to face.

Some at the Reading meeting did not " spot me", to judge from things said to me. Some did; one sees the " Hard Paddington Stare. :-)

I mean to attend other such meetings. So I thought, lets say that I am not going to have a fit if some says; "oh, I suppose you are that bloody awful Kay M".

Just trying to do the decent thing.

KayM2 · 06/12/2018 16:08

And I did, so I'll give this thread a miss now.

The presence or not of a few TS supporters of the WPUK's campaign is irrelevant when one looks at the antics of the worst of the TRAs, or the treatment of Prof Freedman.

R0wantrees · 06/12/2018 16:13

All of the women's meetings are open to people who are there to listen and to ask questions respectfully regardless of sex or gender identity.

On a number of occasions some TRAs have attempted to disrupt meetings both within and without in a number of different ways.

For the opposite situation, see Jean Hatchet's account of attending the 'TerfWar' meeting in Sheffield.
thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3429911-Jean-Hatchet-attends-T-War-tour

ZuttZeVootEeeVro · 06/12/2018 16:24

Because although WPUK are perfectly happy to have TS people there

And where did I say that they didn't? Stop putting words in my mouth.

AlwaysTawnyOwl · 06/12/2018 17:21

I was at the Reading meeting which was great. If anyone is nervous about attending a future meeting please don't be put off by TRAs. In the flesh they are no more than sad little lads - young enough to be my son - too inarticulate to argue their case and so resort to trying to intimidate women. Big brave boys! Why they think that a middle aged woman who has been around the block a few times should be anything other than irritated and amused by them I have no idea. In the end I felt they rather added to the gaiety of the evening (apart from of course poor Rosa) - trekking round Reading in the cold and wet holding up their banner at a variety of venues before finding the right one then spending 2 hours getting cold and wet while we enjoyed alcohol and burgers! I am still laughing at the memory of it and the twitter threads are hilarious. Well done ladies - cabinet ministers may be scared to speak out (James Kirkup) but we're not.

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