Female prisoners in England left to give birth alone in their cells

[hackmum]

www.theguardian.com/society/2018/nov/13/female-prisoners-in-england-left-to-give-birth-alone-in-their-cells-report-reveals

I feel increasingly despondent about the way inmates are treated in women's prisons. Not only is it now apparently acceptable to shove a male rapist in with a bunch of vulnerable women, there is a lack of basic care for pregnant women. In my view, pregnant women shouldn't be in prison in the first place, unless they've done something very seriously wrong, which the vast majority haven't.

This particular report highlights the fact that some female prisoners have been left to give birth alone in their cells. It's a depressing read.

I have long had strong feelings about women in prison. I have never really known what to do or think about those feelings because I feel pretty powerless but I want society to care more about these very women, given that some of them will be the most vulnerable and damaged in society. So thank you for this thread and I'm off to look into the charities mentioned now. I am horrified by this story.

@MNHQ - a campaign on this would be very much up Mumsnet's street, surely?

Choochoothepanda may mean that the article doesn’t say women literally give birth alone but that there is no midwife in attendance, just prison nursing staff who may not even be trained to recognise the symptoms of early labour, let alone deal with any complications.

Not sure if they’re trying to say that means everything is fine

A friend of friend went to prison. She didn't know she was pregnant. She didn't have access to a pregnancy test whilst in prison. Nor was she offered a test when she was admitted.

She did not realise she was pregnant for months. She thought she was just putting on weight cos of the awful food and missed periods because of the stress of the place.

It could have saved her an awful lot of heartache, simply by acknowledging that women get pregnant and they are extremely vulnerable in prison.

Its such a simple thing, but the consequences of biology of women are profound. The issue is more acute in places where there are large numbers of particularly vulnerable women. Top of that list always comes women's prisons.

Women who have been criminalised for minor offences and very often are the result of just trying to get by in a world where they are already invisible.

The Pankhursts were motivated by the political invisibility of women in the workhouse.

Nothing has changed.

Choochoothepanda - is that aimed at me, or did you mean to post on a different thread?

Aimed at you. I was wondering why your thread title was misleading? Is it deliberate?

'“A nation’s greatness is measured by how it treats its weakest members.”

Women in the workhouse who were given the choice to leave with their babies and go on the streets with nowhere to go, or to stay in the workhouse and possibly be separated from their child in days.

The parallels in history are all too close.

Hmm. There are times when I do not understand how the callousness with which we treat the vulnerable carries on.

Then someone posts on a thread like this and reminds me that some people are just fucking horrible.

Aimed at you. I was wondering why your thread title was misleading? Is it deliberate?

I used the headline in the Guardian.

Generally, the attitude 'some people deserve everything they get' only extends to women and the undeserving poor

I see the Guardian has actually changed the headline now. But I simply copy and pasted the original one.

Women in prison tend to end up there for reasons relating primarily to poverty.
They do not offend in violent ways in anywhere near the same rate as men.

Women are effectively criminalised because of poverty and lack of opportunity.

Everything suggests that it could be prevented in a sizeable number of cases, with the availability of resources and appropriate support.

We just don't want to see this, because if we do we might feel like we have to take action. We would rather ignore it and for the problems of these women to be invisible to us. We don't want to think about how we might be responsible for putting some of those women there.

Let's bring even more babies into chaotic households

Why are they chaotic households?

The original Guardian headline, the same as the thread title, is still clearly visible in the url in the original post.

Do you understand the difference between male and female criminals?

Do you understand why it is not acceptable to leave a birthing women without medical care?

Jesus Christ - Pregnancy tests are so cheap as to be virtually free (if you get the little pee sticks, rather than the fancy digital ones) - how can there not be a clinic in prison which women can use to access these? What possible harm could someone do with a tiny plastic strip? They don't need expert interpretation - there's simply no reason to restrict them.

As to the situation with the woman who gave birth in her cell - frankly, it's just a continuation of the normal treatment of women - how many times I was told to try a warm bath and paracetamol, when I knew that what was going on in my body wasn't right?

This total lack of trust in women, in us knowing our pain levels and when something's wrong is bad enough, but doing it to women when you have complete control of their life, when you are literally locking them in a room so they can't advocate for their own care - that's insupportable.

Then someone posts on a thread like this and I realise that some people will excuse the behaviour of another, just because they they have the same genitals. There's no need to stop committing crime. Mad eh?

Have you statistics to show that all the pregnant women in prison are there having re-offended?

Your judgement on these women aside, how about their babies? Are they undeserving of proper medical care during birth?

Choochoothepand: you might find it useful to read Baroness Corston's 2007 report on women in prison:

<a class="break-all" href="http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20130206102659/www.justice.gov.uk/publications/docs/corston-report-march-2007.pdf" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20130206102659/www.justice.gov.uk/publications/docs/corston-report-march-2007.pdf

It's quite long (110 pages) but if you haven't got time, here's a particularly relevant paragraph from the foreword:

"There are many women in prison, either on remand or serving sentences for minor, non-violent offences, for whom prison is both disproportionate and inappropriate. Many of them suffer poor
physical and mental health or substance abuse, or both. Large numbers have endured violent or sexual abuse or had chaotic childhoods. Many have been in care. I have concluded that we are
rightly exercised about paedophiles, but seem to have little sympathy, understanding or interest in those who have been their victims, many of whom end up in prison. The tragic series of murders in Suffolk during December 2006 rightly focussed public attention on these women as women first and foremost - someone’s daughter, mother, girlfriend, then as victims – exploited by men, damaged by abuse and drug addiction. These are among the women whom society must support and help to establish themselves in the community."

Corston spent a good deal of time carrying out the research for her report. We can trust her conclusions.

I don’t think any crime committed by an adult justifies putting a neonate at risk.

The offender’s genitals are only relevant because babbies don’t get birthed out of dicks.

I know TRA types are trying to induce confusion around biology, but this is a non-trans thread and the posters of MUMSNET still know where babies come from.

ChooChoo, you goady eejit, this is nothing to do with why a woman is in prison. If she's pregnant, she needs the same excellent care that any other woman in the country is entitled to.

Oi, I'll direct you to your previous comments, the substance of the article is women not receiving adequate care while pregnant in prison.

Not whatever drum you have to bang about how you don't like female criminals, blah blah blah.