Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Times 'Lib Dem trans activists ‘hounded’ abuse victim (Natalie Bird)''.Article refers to Zoe O'Connell & Sarah Brown

338 replies

R0wantrees · 19/10/2018 09:40

article by Lucy Bannerman
(extract)
"A victim of domestic abuse was removed as a judge of a radical thinking prize and “hounded” out of her role within the Liberal Democrats for saying that she did not believe that men who identified as women should have access to women’s refuges.

Natalie Bird, 38, a mother of two who fled an abusive former partner, was accused of “dangerous transphobia” by transgender activists in the party. She had said that opening up safe spaces without proper safeguards to anyone who said that they were female could put women at risk.

She opposed segregating women’s refuges by chosen gender instead of biological sex, and said that it was not fair to make female victims of domestic violence, abuse and rape share services with people with “functioning” male anatomy.

After being allegedly bullied on social media by party activists, Ms Bird was brought before a disciplinary hearing to face a complaint in the name of Zoe O’Connell, on behalf of the LGBT+ Liberal Democrats. The correspondence says that Ms Bird had “expressed troublesome views”.

The hearing found no evidence to support the complaint of transphobia, but Ms Bird lost her position as chairwoman of the Radical Association, made up of party members, following a vote of no confidence. This cost her her role as a judge of the Ashdown Prize for Radical Thought; an ironic move, Ms Bird said, given that the prize’s aim was to reward “big, bold, radical” solutions to society’s most “daunting problems . . . no one has the courage to argue for” (continues)

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/lib-dem-trans-activists-hounded-abuse-victim-b6dx39tv3

Hopefully many LibDem Members will stand in support of Natalie Bird.

O'Connell and Brown make a mockery of the LibDem priciples and their bullying abusive behaviour has been allowed to run unchecked within the party.

The Liberal Democrats exist to build and safeguard a fair, free and open society, in which we seek to balance the fundamental values of liberty, equality and community, and in which no one shall be enslaved by poverty, ignorance or conformity. We champion the freedom, dignity and well-being of individuals, we acknowledge and respect their right to freedom of conscience and their right to develop their talents to the full. We aim to disperse power, to foster diversity and to nurture creativity. We believe that the role of the state is to enable all citizens to attain these ideals, to contribute fully to their communities and to take part in the decisions which affect their lives.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
22
TheElementsSong · 19/10/2018 18:37

"How to Lose Friends and Alienate People" Grin

FatherBuzzCagney · 19/10/2018 18:38

I don't want transphobes to vote for our candidates

Given that your definition of transphobe is anyone who says that transwomen are not women, then your candidates are going to be losing a lot of deposits if they don't. Please do try to get the Lib Dems to adopt 'only vote for me if you think women can have penises' as a slogan on all your campaign literature, I think that would be amazing.

BettyDuMonde · 19/10/2018 18:38

So, none of the 97% of Times readers who think male bodied people should stay out of women only spaces?

And none of the 82% of people who responded to the recent Pink News survey?

I didn’t think the Lib Dem share of the vote could fall much lower than it did after the coalition but it seems likely that I am wrong.

The majority of the U.K. public simply do not accept that women can have penises. They just don’t. They will nod along to be polite but they think it’s nonsense.

Doobigetta · 19/10/2018 18:38

Hello, just checking in to confirm that I’m a LibDem member and a GC Feminist, and I know a lot of others. I also know a lot of not-particularly-GC-or-feminist LibDems who are shocked and appalled by the way the party is being hijacked by these lunatics. There are an awful lot of people who will need to be thrown out if the party is to be thoroughly cleansed of the nasty TERF stain. And by that point the brave and stunning warriors left might be looking back on the days when there were 12 MPs as a golden age of triumph. Given that the party has spectacularly failed to gain from being the only one unequivocally representing 48% of the electorate on Brexit, it would seem a little optimistic to pick an issue that only 2-15% of the public support as the one to go for.

R0wantrees · 19/10/2018 18:39

I don't want transphobes to vote for our candidates, I am more than happy to get the vast majority of the pro-Trans rights pro self-ID public to vote for us

and this is how you are damaging a party at a critical time in British political history.

You have defined what you deem to be 'transphobic' &by your definition you will find the vast majority of the population are 'transphobic' .

They're not by the way, any more than 'us lot' here.

It is a grave mistake to underestimate people.

OP posts:
LangCleg · 19/10/2018 18:47

LangCleg Idk where you get the idea that I want anyone here's, or more importantly anyone who backs Natalie, vote. I don't. Go vote UKIP or something, or the greens if they go full transphobe, cos they are the only parties backing your vile anti trans agenda. Or maybe the National Front/BNP/EDL or whatever its called these days will back you as well.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

LangCleg · 19/10/2018 18:51

I don't want transphobes to vote for our candidates, I am more than happy to get the vast majority of the pro-Trans rights pro self-ID public to vote for us

That's very ambitious of you, going for 18% of the electorate, tops. Aim high, why don't you?!

DereksSexyPyjamas · 19/10/2018 18:53

I didn’t think the Lib Dem share of the vote could fall much lower than it did after the coalition but it seems likely that I am wrong.

I think it might actually be a world’s first and go into minus figures.

Sarahconnor1 · 19/10/2018 18:56

I don't wanttransphobesto vote for our candidates, I am more than happy to get the vast majority of the pro-Trans rights pro self-ID public to vote for us

Good luck with that. I will actively campaign against any party that does not take women's rights seriously.

acivilcontract · 19/10/2018 19:00

soros it's worse than you think, dh and I have stood for lib dems in the past 😂. I have have actually had people vote for my t...f arse. I would do again if I was in UK at present.

I don't think you understand that there are lots of people who support trans rights when asked and they support trans people in many ways but not to the point of risk or exclusion of women. Very much what was said in the guardian. There are others like my dh who say yes but would go nuts if dd had to sleep as a teenager in a tent with a male bodied teenager and no sensible risk assessment.

Rufusthebewilderedreindeer · 19/10/2018 19:03

lorrttas

Im just sat here like Shock

Dh and i have both voted libdem and ds1 is a member

Ive been thinking about whether to stick with them but honestly...If as an organisation they are struggling with the definition of female...not woman...female! well, it probably explains why they domt seem to have a cat in hells chance of making it to government

Rufusthebewilderedreindeer · 19/10/2018 19:03

Dont...obviously Grin

FatherBuzzCagney · 19/10/2018 19:09

By the way Soros, if you've "been a member much longer than a few years" I guess that means you were happy to campaign for a party led by Tim "homophobe" Farron. But a woman sticking to the biological basis for the definition of woman is your bigotry red line, is that right?

LangCleg · 19/10/2018 19:09

The only reliable polling we have had (Pink News via YouGov) had 18% public support for self-ID.

This is how thick these people are. They openly say they don't want the votes of 82% of the electorate. They don't think politics is about persuading people to your point of view. There's just one policy:

Trans Year Zero

Rufusthebewilderedreindeer · 19/10/2018 19:13

Someone still a member of the lib dems should pass this thread on to them

Its all very well saying that transphobes arent wanted by the party (and why not indeed) its not a good advert when your idea of a transphobe is someone who believes this

female
/ˈfiːmeɪl/Submit
adjective
1.
of or denoting the sex that can bear offspring or produce eggs, distinguished biologically by the production of gametes (ova) which can be fertilized by male gametes.

TwistedStitch · 19/10/2018 19:15

Well. Sounds like Aimee Challenor will fit in nicely anyway.

TimeLady · 19/10/2018 19:21

And there we were, thinking Momemtum were the crazies.....

R0wantrees · 19/10/2018 19:29

And there we were, thinking Momemtum were the crazies.....

Given the ease that Aimee Challenor switched from the Greens to the LibDems, I'm increasingly of the opinion they're much of a muchness.

OP posts:
R0wantrees · 19/10/2018 19:33

This is how thick these people are. They openly say they don't want the votes of 82% of the electorate. They don't think politics is about persuading people to your point of view. There's just one policy

I am going to quote Prof. Michael Biggs again:

I have entered this debate not because I am a feminist but because freedom of speech is one of the highest values of a democratic society, and the basic foundation of university life.
Transgender activism poses a grave threat to freedom of speech. I think of the young MPhil student who had to disguise herself to attend this meeting because she feared the reaction of fellow students. This is the generation that we have educated.

users.ox.ac.uk/~sfos0060/FreeSpeechOxford.pdf

OP posts:
terryleather · 19/10/2018 19:36

^Hark, hark, the narcs do bark
TRAs are coming to town
Some in rags , and some in jags
And some in velvet gowns^

Lisa Muggeridge called it, the narcissistic rage is reaching a crescendo and is quite something to behold.

Ereshkigal · 19/10/2018 19:47

Thank you so much for mentioning Cluster B. I swear, that’s what this whole fucking movement is about.

Absolutely. And the country needs to wake up to it.

IfNotNowThenWooOoOoo · 19/10/2018 20:09

Sooo...a bunch of men bullied and harassed a female survivor of domestic violence out of the group because she wouldn't accept that men are women?
Yeah. That sounds reasonable.

NowtSalamander · 19/10/2018 20:10

To be honest, we should just all stop talking because sometimes intelligent women speaking forthrightly for their rights gets people’s back up (I wonder why...) whereas people live to take the piss out of stupid.

We should fill these pages with statements like: “I don’t want votes from anyone who thinks women don’t have penises” and we’re done.

R0wantrees · 19/10/2018 20:17

Sooo...a bunch of men bullied and harassed a female survivor of domestic violence out of the group because she wouldn't accept that men are women?
Yeah. That sounds reasonable.

and then women here who thought this was very serious were told off by friends and LibDem allies of Sarah Brown and Zoe O'Connell.

OP posts:
nononsene · 19/10/2018 20:18

I donated to the lib dems at the last election. They will not be getting any more money from me. I’m furious about all this.

I think I’ll have to spoil my ballot paper in the next election though as the alternatives are not really any better when it comes to this issue.

Swipe left for the next trending thread