Women's Hour Tomorrow!

[MsBeaujangles]

The consultation is going to be discussed tomorrow on Women's Hour. They are asking for our views!

Discussion is certainly policed on Mumsnet although perhaps not in the way you're implying. We are watched and reported on by men all the time on here.
For all that it remains about the only place where I feel I can discuss this issue and I'm sure it's the same for many posters on here. Its a feminist board so we focus on women and girls.

Thank you for your response Beaujangles

I have heard that the term Terf was invented by Trans Inclusionary feminists to distinguish their position from those that might be less inclusive of trans people. Would anyone like to comment on that?

I like to think it's perfectly possible to be a feminist, female centred, and also a trans Allie.
I have trans friends, both MTF and FTM

I think there's a difference between supporting individuals, juggling and critiquing the ideology and the current political climate in which women's rights are very much under threat. These boards tend to focus on the latter.

We have a middle way: the GRA 2004. It's not good enough for transactivists. They want to erase women's rights completely. If you want a middle way, fill in the consultation to say No to Self ID. There's your middle way right there.

All feminists are trans inclusionary. Specifically, we include in our feminism women who believe they are men.

I've emailed this:

Self ID of sex would make all protections women currently have under the Equality Act meaningless.

Women will be, and are already being, due to organistions forming policy based on self Id, being put at risk.

There has been a sytematic campaign to prevent women discussing this and the impact this will have on women.
Women's Hour's total ignoring of this issue up until now has been a glaring example of this.

I hope the discussion tomorrow centres on women, women's concerns, and women's rights and not on issues for males who are trans.

Who is Women's Hour for, women are asking ourselves??

We have a middle way: the GRA 2004.
Yes, exactly. The Gender Recognition Act of 2004 was a compromise. It was a poor law because it was based on feelings rather than on facts but many, if not most, of us accepted it in good faith as a genuine attempt to support trans people. Now look where we are.

Feminism: includes trans, excludes males.
HTH.

Messaged

Perfect, baby

I have emailed.

I have emailed. Gone for NHS Physiologists have to use birth sex to reference results of test eg lung function because using female results would mask impaired function in trans women.

I'll see if they can make that into bigoted hate speech.

@JugglingFromHereToThere I actually have two good family friends who are both transwomen. This move to self-ID will harm them, the one who lives here in the UK is very worried that she and other transpeople will bear the brunt of any backlash as usual. Both of them feel that they have "done the work", years of therapy and surgery and hormones and neither believes they are women - they are transwomen and are fully aware that they are biologically male and grew up and were socialised as male. Their only wish is to quietly keep their heads down and not make a fuss, dress like other women of their own age (over 50s) and see the loud demands of trans rights activists for self-ID as threatening to their safety. They have both labelled "truscum" by activists (well, one has, the other lives abroad and isn't on social media - but she would be if she were).

Many of us have come to this debate with friends and colleagues who are trans, and worry about the effect that self-ID will have on them as well.

I made multiple attempts at suicide as a child. The first when I was around seven or eight, and it was a silly thing that in retrospect would never have been successful but at that age I thought it could. I made much more serious attempts as a teenager with problems far beyond worrying about "my identity". Suicide has affected my life in my own desperation and in the desperation of friends.

I am so so fed up of self harm and suicidAl thoughts being used by trans activists to try and get their own way. I cannot believe that people who do this have any real experience of this issue, not close to them, not that has affected them. It is something that most people affected by it don't discuss, in my experience. Maybe its because those TRAs are narcissists and just don't give a shit about other people except in how they can use them for their own demands.

Anyway. It's a fucking disgrace and I'm sick of it.

Aren't there any other trans allies here, with friends that are trans, or children that are trans or might be?

I have a transsexual family member. Who is more gender critical than I am. Having friends, children, whatever who are trans does not mean people will agree with transactivists.

In my email I stressed that I believe that people can suffer from gender dysphoria and that I am supportive if it is medically diagnosed and if medication and surgery can alleviate their discomfort with their bodies.
However I said that I am against gender self ID for all the many safeguarding reasons already listed on here and I am totally against the inappropriate treatment of children with puberty blockers, cross sex hormones and surgery.
I don’t see how anything I said is transphobic.

I have sent multiple emails-one list of questions, then again individual questions but I imagine none of them will be addressed tomorrow.

Can someone change sex? No, its impossible. So why are women expected to welcome male bodied people into their sex segregated spaces-how does that fit with safeguarding.

What signal does it send to young women in competitive sports if they see male bodied people winning all the medals?

Why do we have sex segregation? Why are we now allowing men to break down those barriers and have access to womens & girls spaces?

Etc Etc

I've emailed

I'm going to email 🙂, I hope they get lots of response.

^responses 😳

I've emailed. Tried to keep it concise, but it's hard because there's just so MUCH.

I'd just like to defend my mentioning the issue of suicide. True it isn't easy to talk about but many of us who are suicide survivors are trying to break down that taboo and raise awareness wherever we feel it is relevant.. I do think it's a relevant issue to raise in this discussion, as statistics show the LGBT+ community are more vulnerable - which I guess should not be a surprise given society's attitudes towards this whole group - basically anyone seen as different

Emailed, working tomorrow though.

I've emailed, 3 v short paras each on a seperate topic
re the suicide discussion, I don't know about suicide and LGB people, but the suicide statistics re trans youth have been shown to be pretty much exaggerated, which in my view tells you a lot about the people who are pushing that angle.
I'm sorry for your loss Juggling

statistics show the LGBT+ community are more vulnerable - as far as I can see they do show more vulnerability than average but it's rare to see that broken down separately into trans vs the L G and B, or separated out from comorbidities.

The more parts of the ethos that become unmentionable, the harder it must be to carry out good research in the area.