Surprise! The Masons now welcome Transwomen but not women

[Indierockandroll]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6013141/Freemasons-break-tradition-allow-women-join-brotherhood-born-male.html

The key point here is that you need to be invited. I suspect the old boys wont be particularly welcoming to "new boys", surgery or not.

What HideandGo is saying is that transwomen in this instance are women's rights pioneers, breaking through that ceiling of power which they could never have got through before. (Well, you know, except for the fact that they have, but we'll overlook that...)

So, HideandGo is encouraging us to eagerly anticipate the imminent high profile campaign led by transwomen to use their privilege to open up opportunities for women.

Telegraph article

Trans activist defends being a Freemason amid hypocrisy claims

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/08/01/freemasons-allow-women-members-first-time-joined-men/

From article posted earlier

"Vera Baird, who as Labour’s solicitor general was involved in drafting the legislation, says: “We obviously looked with bared teeth at the prospect of getting rid of them [all-male gentlemen’s clubs].” However, very quickly they saw that this could not be done without also forcing a parallel ban of women’s swimming clubs or gay choirs."

Interestingly, the woman's swimming clubs and the gay choirs are/ soon will be, no more. The "gentlemens" clubs remain.

So, HideandGo is encouraging us to eagerly anticipate the imminent high profile campaign led by transwomen to use their privilege to open up opportunities for women.

Oh yes!

Wow...this is incredible! Men really do look after their own.

How are transwomen going to handle being called "brother"?

Talk about pick-n-mix your sex.

So when they have to bare their chest to prove that they are not a women, and they've had implants, what are they going to do?!

Obviously being mis-gendered is only violence when women do it. When men mis-gender it’s OK, you know.

The times article seems to say that this is them accommodating the EA in their terms, rather than actually welcoming in trans women. So they can't join as a transwoman, but if a man who is a Freemason already transitions to female then he isn't hoofed out, because that would break the law under the EA. I think!

but if a man who is a Freemason already transitions to female then he isn't hoofed out

Yes this is very interesting.

Not just that the Fremasons (unlike the GirlGuides) wouldn't encourage a trans woman to leave a single sex (is it gender now now like the Guides?) organisation, but that perhaps some trans women would choose to remain in this long-standing men-only organisation.

That's the way I read it, REOLay.

Presumably then there would then be no further need to bare a breast implant.

The whole scenario makes me want to puke, tbh.

So...so....let me see if I've understood this...

You have to be a man to be a Freemason.
If you then decide that you are a woman after joining, you can still be a Freemason (is this Self ID as a woman or full gender reassignment?) but if Transwomen ARE women surely this is hypocritical?
You will be addressed with a male noun "brother" (isn't that misgendering and literal violence?)
If you are a woman who decides to be a man (again self ID?), then you must have had full gender reassignment to apply (it's not a given that you will be accepted at this point).

If people who self ID are what they self ID as surely they don't need to have gender reassignment surgery to be able to be Freemason?

My head hurts....is it too early for something stronger than .

Reading that back I don't think I make any sense lol!

Surely the Freemasons should be next on Man Friday's list? 'Cos if TWAW, then TMmustbeM...

Some very good comments under the Times article - with a number pointing out that this has been placed next to the article about finding the Monty Python lost sketches

More on Teddy boy's MEMBERshipd here (as well as being caught up in a sting with the Bureau of Investigative Journalism).

Edward's pronouns are he. His spouse/partner Meg looks to be a transmen? Campaigner.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Lord

Look at us all trying to make sense of this insanity. But no doubt more delusionists will be along to put us right about our womaning and sadly lacking knowledge of womaning.

Surely being called "brother" will be incredibly triggering and "literal violence" against them.

I expect that this has come about as a reaction to a few individuals already within the Masons who wish to remain so - and want to indulge their cross dressing fetishes at the same time.

They are also avoiding law suits.

Its not uncommon though for some male born people to transition in their 40s 50s+ having being involved with very stereotypically masculine pursuits.

On the recent SKY News focus on the GRA one of the interviewees was Sue Pascoe.

Sue has talked about her transition and this aspect of it in a Daily Mail article:
"The former Master of a local Hunt who lived for 50 years as a man is now celebrating life as a woman after undergoing cut price gender reassignment surgery in India.

Successful businessman Graham Pascoe swapped his life as an alpha male, living on a 40-acre farm in North Yorkshire with his wife and two children, to become glamorous Sue after being diagnosed with gender dysphoria in August 2014.

The keen horse rider, who is the process of divorcing her wife, was left devastated when doctors told her she would potentially have to wait up to four and a half years to have gender correction surgery on the NHS" (continues)

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3163747/Master-Hunt-woman-age-54-marks-day-man-going-bowling-enjoying-burger-sons.html

Sue Pascoe in her own words:

Link to discussions about the many interviews on SKY News including Sue Pascoe, SwearyG, Heather Brunskell-Evans, Debbie Hayton, Heather Peto, Susie Green & Jess Bradley (NUS Trans Officer currently suspended pending investigation)
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3311038-Sky-News-9-30am-today-re-GRA

I would imagine a number of later transitioning transwomen may well have been Freemasons

Edward's pronouns are he

Indierockandroll
I believe Edward Lord currently prefers the pronoun they/them.

It may be that you've read an earlier document (it can be a bit of a minefield). Not sure when Edward Lord started preferring these pronouns / identified as non-binary.

See Andrew Gilligan Times article this weekend:
(extract)

"However, Edward Lord, the chairman of the City’s establishment committee who identifies as non-binary and asks to be described by the pronoun “they”, said there “shouldn’t be a debate” about the changes because they “shouldn’t be controversial”.

“Trans women are women,” Lord added.

The move follows controversy about some lavatories at the Barbican being made “gender-neutral” and a row about transgender women using the City-controlled women’s bathing pond on Hampstead Heath.

Hannah Clarke, a feminist involved in the Hampstead Heath protests, said: “This is mind-blowing. It effectively abolishes women’s protected spaces ... It is dangerous for women and girls.” (continues)

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/ladies-loos-at-city-landmarks-may-open-to-trans-women-l5lxjjv0z

Also twitter.com/edwardlord

Thanks R0wan - I want to some more reading up on the Dark Lord.

Edward's Wiki page (which I appreciate he doesn't own) refers to 'he' and makes it very clear that Edward's spouse/girlfriend prefers 'they' which indicated that they (collective) might be Wiki savvy so to speak.

But before MN accuses Wiki of misgendering I will refer to them as simply my lord.

I think the Masons argument is that if a person joined as a male, then their transition is protected under the EA, so they can't be asked to leave.
I would definitely show this to the Girl Guides and ask how this squares with their guidelines of asking girls identifying as boys to leave. My reading of the EA does not specify which direction of change that applies to.

Just as an aside (with apologies)

I noticed that Sue Pascoe gave evidence to the Womens & Equalities Select Committee within a year of 'coming out' (her words):

Q180 Ben Howlett: Thank you ever so much for giving up your time to come in today. I thought it would be a warm-up question to ask about the good aspects and the bad aspects of being a trans person in the UK today. Sue, would you like to start?

Sue Pascoe: I am 55 now, and it took me until I was 54 years old to come out and have the confidence to lose pretty much everything in my life to be myself. I had to wait until my father and my mother had died, and divorce freed me from my duties to my wife, and then I could start to look at being myself. I told my wife before we were married that I had a feminine side to me, but she did not want it in our marriage and that became very difficult. I hid myself as Sue most of my adult life. I was made fun of when I grew up, and I knew with pretty much certainty that if I tried to come out when I was a partner in PricewaterhouseCoopers or in Andersen, that would probably be the end of my career. I had to wait for the latter part of my life to make those transitions.

It is interesting. I made my decision to become permanently Sue in July last year, and I thought that I would lose all my family, my friends, my business and my farm, be ostracised by my friends, and need to go abroad for an operation and then start a new life with a new identity. That was the basis upon which I decided to become Sue. Amazingly, it has not really been like that. Most people who perhaps have not been in my life have been fantastic and that is the general response I get—former work colleagues. It has tended to be people who have been very close to me—knew me as Graham and now see me as Sue—that find it quite hard to make that mental leap, but that will come with time. What is clear is that going back into the workplace, which I am going to try to do—I just do not know how I am going to be responded to, but I thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak today. Graham never got to address Parliament, so this is one up for Sue. "

data.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/committeeevidence.svc/evidencedocument/women-and-equalities-committee/transgender-equality/oral/23159.html

Double standards yet again! However, this one goes against TRA, showing that TW are not women after all. Bad luck TRA but we have been trying to tell you. Thankyou Freemasons.

This is the way it's going to go.

Some women will be privileged above others.

The ones born male and (possibly) the ones who go through surgery to emulate males.

This is all a moot point though, because trans women don't become women, they were always women. Therefore someone couldn't be a trans woman if they joined as a man, because they were never a man. Therefore there will never be any trans women in the masons. Ta-da!