Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Start here! Womens rights & trans ideology for beginners

27 replies

slowsloegin · 20/07/2018 13:50

A friend has asked me to send her a few links to explain the issues to her.

Which ones would you recommend?

There was a great beginners thread on here before - can anyone remember what it was?

I thought, maybe if we create a list and keep it bumped, that'll be useful for all the new people coming onto the this board.

(I'll post my suggestions below also).

OP posts:
Original poster
slowsloegin · 20/07/2018 13:51

Magdalen Berns on You Tube is a great, of course!

www.youtube.com/channel/UCvTTakI97sQ4SkMnsH8r0qQ/videos?disable_polymer=1

OP posts:
JackyHolyoake · 20/07/2018 13:55

My first step would be to refer your friend to fairplayforwomen.com

Original poster
slowsloegin · 20/07/2018 13:55

James Kirkup in the Spectator has written some good articles:

blogs.spectator.co.uk/author/james-kirkup/

OP posts:
Original poster
slowsloegin · 20/07/2018 13:56

Excellent link, of course, thanks Jacky :)

OP posts:
Original poster
slowsloegin · 20/07/2018 13:56

Does anyone know the MN thread I mean? It was called "break it down for me" or something like that - but I tried searching for it and couldn't find it.

OP posts:
JackyHolyoake · 20/07/2018 14:14

Break It Down For Me:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3145470-Break-it-down-for-me

Original poster
slowsloegin · 20/07/2018 15:00

Excellent thank you!

OP posts:
Indierockandroll · 20/07/2018 23:13

Thanks from me too Datun your posts on Break it Down are glorious.

How long have you all been valiantly posting on this on our behalf? Feeling not worthy right now Grin

SarahAr · 21/07/2018 13:06

As expected lots of links to individuals with a transphobic ideology to push. A lot of the material is down right wrong or misleading.

Would suggest

www.stonewall.org.uk/truth-about-trans
www.gires.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/LEAFLET-Feb-2017-Transgender-Experiences2.pdf

Stonewall and GIRES are both well respected mainstream groups with specialist knowledge of trans matters.

SarahAr · 21/07/2018 13:09

And there is no "trans ideology".

There are just people with or who had a medical condition (gender dysphoria) and people who are gender non-conforming living their own truths.

Bowlofbabelfish · 21/07/2018 13:09

Which bits are wrong?

Indierockandroll · 21/07/2018 13:11

You mean men then?
Their 'truths' are not mine.

NoProbLlama78 · 21/07/2018 13:11

Aren't we all non conforming? I'm female but I don't conform to female stereotypes.

NotTerfNorCis · 21/07/2018 14:06

SarahAr Trans ideology states that people can be assigned the wrong gender at birth, that we have gendered brains, that transwomen are really women etc. It's only semi-coherent , but it's an ideology.

Snappity · 21/07/2018 14:15

SarahAr Trans ideology states that people can be assigned the wrong gender at birth, that we have gendered brains, that transwomen are really women etc. It's only semi-coherent , but it's an ideology

It is science.

The ideology is that doctors never assign someone to the wrong sex. Supposedly it's the only administrative task with 100% perfection guaranteed.

NotTerfNorCis · 21/07/2018 14:18

Intersex is a different thing, Snappity.

TellsEveryoneRealFacts · 21/07/2018 14:22

The ideology is that doctors never assign someone to the wrong sex. Supposedly it's the only administrative task with 100% perfection guaranteed.

They seem very accurate at predicting which of the babies will go on to produce sperm and which might go on to produce eggs.

Unless you can show one person that was born a male [with penis and testicles] that went on to gestate children, or one person born a female [with vagina and a uterus] that went on to produce sperm, the science still holds, surely? Without bringing intersex people into it of course [which you will do]...

If you have the science to back it up, please do share.

Yambabe · 21/07/2018 14:24

Doctors observe sex at birth based on the visible genitalia, they don't assign it.

You've been told so many times that intersex, a series of very rare conditions where the visible genitalia may be absent, deformed or not actually corresponding to the chromosomal sex, does not equate to trans and that intersex people don't (in the main) want to be co-opted into the trans argument.

Your insistence on conflating intersex conditions with trans is getting tiresome now.

So leaving that aside and bearing in mind that humans are mammals and (like most other mammals) already display visible genitalia which correspond to them being male or female, how else do you propose to differentiate?

Bowlofbabelfish · 21/07/2018 17:07

The ideology is that doctors never assign someone to the wrong sex. Supposedly it's the only administrative task with 100% perfection guaranteed.

As we’ve said many, many times before, if there is any ambiguity there’s a mechanism to delay reporting until genetic and physical testing has taken place.

Not that it matters - DSDs tell us nothing about being transgender do they?

Bowlofbabelfish · 21/07/2018 17:09

people who are gender non-conforming living their own truths.

Most of the women on here are gender non conforming.

‘Living your own truth’ sounds like meaningless claptrap to me - what’s that supposed to actually mean?

R0wantrees · 21/07/2018 17:21

recent Twitter thread about some of some of GIRES information:

Dr Em:
twitter.com/PankhurstEM/status/1018457216272171008

R0wantrees · 21/07/2018 17:29

This is an ideological position.

Start here! Womens rights & trans ideology for beginners
R0wantrees · 21/07/2018 17:31

Recent thread re intersex
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3305291-Trans-activsims-appropriation-of-intersex

NoProbLlama78 · 21/07/2018 17:32

Living your own truth suggests its no one else's and therefore not true.