please don't vanish - we are all crucial to the future for women and girls

[loveyouradvice]

This is just a plea for that really....

I do understand how upset so many people are about Mumsnet's recent policies and the confusion and hurt they have caused - yes I have sobbed tears late into the night too

But please stay! I am sad so many are fleeing - and hope that some will maintain their sanity by not being on here every day, but coming on when feeling strong enough.

More than anything I think it is important that many of us are here now, with the government consultation launching on 7 July - speaking out on this board and AIBU and chat - so that people understand the conflict between women/girls right and trans rights as currently proposed - so that people understand what we may be about to lose before we do - and recognise that this isn't transphobia, but actually talking about the challenges and doing that much-quoted but seldom done "equality impact assessment" for everyone affected

It is fine and fair to ask about what will happen to women and girls - and to want transpeople to have strong rights

Dicks take us by surprise sometimes but then we just know them for being dicks. Long as we can spot the dickish behaviour then we fine

I knew id spelt firey wrong

Oh yep, Rufus or loins too. Though that always feels very male, whatever the fuck that means nowadays!

Bellies/loins/wings/beaks...just not arses.

It's been a long day!

(Thank you MaryZ for awesome pic though!)

Dicks ducks dicks ducks

Heck I confused myself

Right off to bed

Night all

littl
I typed a response to your latest post that included 'fire' and 'arses'.
And then I deleted it.
And then I posted it again, cos, you know, as above, it's been a long day and I have lowered judgement.
And then I deleted it again. As it wasn't that long a day!

U cool reindeer nightie

Night Rufus, hope the heat doesn't fire up your loins too much overnight! Keep those toes out of the duvet :-)

By the way, if anyone is around you might bump my thread

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/site_stuff/3288716-Message-deleted-by-Mumset-etc

I was trying to work out how many posts a certain poster had had deleted, only to find that it's now hidden. And I also can't find out how many posts of mine have been deleted. I can't see a single genuine reason for suddenly hiding this information, so can only come to the conclusion that MNHQ don't want us to know

I'm off too peeps. Sleep tight.

I think that MN don't want feminists here anymore.
The guidelines restrict free speech which in turn makes feminists or GC women either choose to leave or get banned.
Probably easier than deleting the FWR board.

Will just be handier to retitle to FWRCATDAM (Feminism And Women's Rights Chatting About Anything That Doesn't Annoy Males)

Sadly I agree with that, Abouttoblow.

Their lives would be easier if we all disappeared. They could have the occasional WAWAG thread on the main boards, but could mainly not upset the TRAs, and the world would keep turning and the money would keep coming in.

Not for the first time I'm disappointed in Justine. Over the years I've ebbed and flowed in my admiration for her. I accept the pressure must be huge; I'm sure if I was being attacked in real life and in my real name I'd be running scared, but I truly believe that she is making a mistake here. MN has come so far - changing now won't protect Justine or her family; she's still considered terfy and fair game by the MRA/TRAs.

This latest round of appeasement won't be enough. There will be further demands which will mean deleting/hiding FWR and banning us all.

Life is so much easier for women when they (we) appease men isn't it... Until we finally come to understand that,for them, nothing is ever enough until we've lost absolutely everything and they walk away almost satisfied.

Go where you're celebrated, not tolerated.

They don't want us, so why should we stay?

Strategy SPOFS, strategy. Public forum = awareness raising.

Plus I'm an obstinate old bag who hugely resents attempts to control me and resists to the max

Because if we don't, SPOFS, the lurkers will be blind.

A few years ago I was all for trans rights. I had no idea how they conflicted with women's rights. If the posters on FWR hadn't remained calm, accepting, logical, sensible, I'd still have no idea.

If all the knowledgeable ones head off, a new generation of lurkers will remain ignorant.

I agree with Maryz, it is the welcoming of the abusers that upsets me the most.
It took me a lot of years to repair the damage as best I could that was done to me by abusers in my childhood.
To see them welcomed on to a so called feminist board and women told that we must watch our tongue lest we hurt the feelings of those who are demanding we submit is distressing to put it mildly.
I will not walk on eggshells.
I miss my friends who left when they were put at risk by Mumsnet's lax security.

To see them welcomed on to a so called feminist board and women told that we must watch our tongue lest we hurt the feelings of those who are demanding we submit is distressing to put it mildly.
I will not walk on eggshells.

This.

^^ Exactly.

We don't want to hurt the feelings of the vulnerable.

We're posting on the FWR board about issues which affect the rights (and heck, yes feelings certainly of the vulnerable ones) of women and girls.

I just went and had a quick look at the LBGT boards... I didn't spot any familiar names from here, invading that support space. (Actually there was one thread with no replies who might find views from here helpful but I think she needs to find us not us dive in there.)

I think MN genuinely tries to hold higher standards than many other platforms but the result is a variant on the old story - women having to be nicer than men.

I know I don't post that much but, for what it's worth, I'm not going. I wouldn't give them the satisfaction. Plus I think it's vital to keep the discussion going on a public forum - if it hadn't been for these boards, I'd probably still be thinking, 'Where's the harm?'

I've asked for the details of the new place but at the moment, I'm only planning to activate them if it all goes tits up here.

And as a former, long time lurker, I can assure you the new goady posters are doing themselves and their arguments no favours whatsoever.

The blatant nonsense spouted by the activists shows up the flaws in their arguement, every time. As frustrating as it undoubtedly is, their presence on the FWR board only helps to trans peak the undecided, who can read it for themselves.

I'm relatively new to all this but plan to stay. I found this board via The Spectator articles and others will too. It's so important to keep the discussion going on a open board.

I'm staying.

I’m staying until I’m deleted. I’m a stubborn git and lo and behold the last years dealing with toddlers, work and life generally have bestowed me with some semblance of rhino hide, and patience. I think it’s important that someone is countering all the ridiculous pseudoscience that’s being spouted and I can do that. So I will.

So I’m here until I’m booted off. Which I’m sure will happen but until then I’ll do my bit.

I totally understand why people are leaving and that’s their prerogative. I don’t blame them at all. Sorry to see them go, but everyone needs to look after themselves first and foremost.

Btw spontaneous I did email the owner of the other place but I haven’t had a reply for a link to join up - any chance you could remind, I may have got lost somewhere...