Spreading the idea that everyone has a gender identity

[Macareaux]

Mermaids has quite a reach. Influencing consumer groups.

The ease with which schools, workplaces and other organisations are being brainwashed is quite astounding

Like, yes, people absorb and then rather thoughtlessly regurgitate stereotypes about all kinds of things, and are aware of which ones apply to groups that they're part of. Why with "gender" are we trying to frame this as an internalized "identity" rather than just people absorbing stereotypes because they've everywhere?

I’m pretty sure I’m female because I have one baby in utero as we speak and another one snuggled up next to me who very definitely was gestated and birthed by moi.

Do I have a gender identity? Nope. Don’t think so. I get up in the morning, shower, put jeans and a t shirt on, feed the offspring, drive them to nursery, and work all day as a scientist. Then pick up offspring, dinner bath and bed. My husband, who is most definitely Male (I know this because he impregnated me with both said offspring) ALSO gets up, has a shower, pits t shirt on ... blah de blah blah. Same stuff. Similar job. Same clothes (I’m currently wearing his socks, god knows where mine are...)

Literally the only ways our days differ is that I’m pregnant. And that’s because I am female.

So no, I dont have a gender identity. I have a sex and a personality.

Nobody has EVER managed to explain to me what an innate gender identity IS. Not without circular logic, or invoking souls. Now I can get behind the idea that society has expectations of me, as a female, that they assume will be ‘me’ but that’s not innate.

If anyone can explain what am innate gender identity actually is, I’d be interested. Just no Cartesian duality or circular logic, Ta.

The division between over and under 18 is simply one of time. Age is simply a material reality. The treatment and observation of age might be socially constructed, but age itself is not.

Jamieand, I think astrology is a good analogy. Unscientific woo.

The truly ridiculous thing imo is that "agender" is included under the trans umbrella; so trans organisations and campaigners clearly accept that some people can believe they have no gender identity, just not that the uncool mummies/aging women could possibly be in that group...

Sometimes you talk to them and explain that you don't feel this sense of being a woman that you're meant to feel and they go "OMG, I get it now, you're trans!". And then you sigh.

Our personalities reflect our socialisation and our response to that, as well as our humanity, and this is unique to is all. As i say those who advocate gender identity are pathologising what is just our personality. Of course we all have a personality and of course we are all unique, but it's not what gender actually is, gender is a system we are socialised by. Gender identity as an ideology ignores sex, asserts how our personality reflects femininity and masculinity is due to an innate essence rather than due to being a combination of just human triats and gender socialisation/response to that socialisation. It's utterly baseless, ignores science, sociology and feminism, and allows stuff like all male panels/boards/whatever to remain unchallenged cos 'we don't know their gender identities and we mustn't ask'. The while thing is a measure of narcissism and stupidity imo. Much like queer theory it's largely about the dull trying to feel special....

...gender identity is basically queer theory actually...

I am a woman because my body is biologically female. I don't have an innate sense of 'i am girly or female'. I'm just me (albeit me who has been socialised along the way because society has expectations of biological sex).

There are many ways to be a woman. I have always presented quite feminine in my appearance but am quite 'tomboyish' in personality. I prefer mixed sex friendship groups and find very girly friendship groups unbearable. Other women are different to me because they have different personalities.

I got to 56 years old without being aware of my 'gender'...wasn't ever a factor in my life...do i have to have one?

I knew my sex - female (this was noted at birth...not assigned)

I am just...me

I was a girl...I am a woman...sometimes 'feminine' in appearance sometimes not, these days...comfortable clothes rule.

As I became an adult I believed we were moving towards a time where it didn't matter what you wore or what skills you had or what job you did or what your hobbies were.

Or who you loved. And who loved you. True equality.

Now it feels like we are heading the other way...being separated out into smaller and smaller 'groups' with some 'more equal than others'.

Being labelled...and pigeon holed...and told 'we must'

Limitations being imposed re-imposed.

It's all very depressing...and makes me really worry for my daughters and grandchildren.

How is anybody supposed to find meaning or develop as a full human being when they are being told to define their minds in relation to how girly they or other people are?

I know this because he impregnated me with both said offspring

Bigot.

(MNHQ - I'm joking. Don't smite strike me!)

My 'gender identity' is based on my body and the way I've been socialised.

Yes Not but something happens to some people (mixture of biology, genetics, environment, culture) that causes them to develop a 'gender identity' that is not based on their body.

I have a sexed body.

I have a personality/temperament.

I have preferences that are informed in part by my personality/temperament and in part by my experiences and socialization that often were directed by my sexed body.

I don’t have a gender identity. I don’t even hold much truck with the notion of any kind of fixed, verifiable identity because to my understanding, identity is essential just the narrative of our life from a particular perspective.

If that perspective changes, our “identity” changes.

We can consciously decide to change our perspective, we can reframe our experiences, we are free to change the way we react to stimulus (which is not to say that it is easy to do, but it is possible). If we can make choices regarding our identity then there is nothing fixed or innate about identity except those bits of it routed in material reality.

I am a gender atheist because I believe that everyone should be free to shape their own preferences without reference to strict societal dictats based on sexist tropes.

The difference is knowing that gender is a set of socially imposed stereotypes, or believing that your preferences are as a result of your sex. And if they go against your sex you must be the other sex.

It makes me laugh, and despair in turn.

Cooking for a family seems to be a female stereotype, being a famous chef, not so much.

Sewing, making curtains etc, a female stereotype. A tailor on Savile Row, not so much.

Being interested in fashion, handbags, shoes and how to make clothes look good is a female stereotype. A famous fashion designer, not so much.

Being emotional and over excited, a female stereotype. Jumping up and down screeching in glee or despair at a football match, not so much.

Most of these 'masculine' or 'feminine' behaviours are utterly imposed, and twisted or interpreted, depending upon which sex you're imposing them on.

I have no doubt that a man who sees these 'women' behaviours and wants them, feels as though his sex won't allow him to have them.

The difference is he thinks he needs to change sex to get them, whereas feminists think he should be able to have them irrespective of his sex. And vice versa for women.

Also, if gender identity is innate, how do you account for gender fluidity?

I know the reason, but having a zillion different genders to label and categorise normal human behaviour is another way that sex based oppression is ignored and sidelined.

SarahCarer - I just realised how selfish that sounded, it didn't come out as I meant lol.

What I meant to say was that if people what to believe in gender ideology then thats fine as long as it doesn't affect me & others who don't believe (e.g. in the same way that its fine to be a Christian, Muslim, Hindu as long as you don't preach to me etc).

We need to make sure that schools don't push this ideology on young impressionable children either so that our children aren't adversley constrained. Unfortunately its appears that its already happening.

www.transgendertrend.com/who-is-making-policy-for-schools/

Datun yy

If that wiki article doesn’t make the innate belief in a grnder hierarchy, with women firmly at the bottom absolutely crystal clear then nothing ever will.

Bloody terrifying.

Yes Not but something happens to some people (mixture of biology, genetics, environment, culture) that causes them to develop a 'gender identity' that is not based on their body.

But what IS that gender identity? Can you define it? I certainly can’t. How can they KNOW they think or feel like a woman or a man when there is no single way women/men think? Logically, what is that feeling?

When you examine this concept it breaks down.

I feel like a woman. Ok.., how do women feel?
I think like a woman... ok how do women think?

And when you probe deeper what it comes down to is that that person feels more comfortable with the stereotypes associated with the opposite sex.

Now at that point, society should shrug and say ‘well grand. You do you. Why should you be in the ‘girl’ Box - be who you are.’

What society is doing is saying ‘well you are in the wrong body then.’ And no one is in the wrong body because we don’t get decanted into bodies as souls (well some people believe that but it’s a faith based view and one I dont hold with.)

So instead of people celebrating the fact that boys can be as feminine or as masculine as they want, they tell them they’re in fact a girl. And by the way, that’ll be a load of therapy, blockers and hormones and surgery.

That just blows my mind. It’s so much damage that doesn’t need to happen.

Every one does have a gender identity like they have a sexuality
Nope. Sorry everyone doesnt.

Gender identity as an ideology ignores sex, asserts how our personality reflects femininity and masculinity is due to an innate essence rather than due to being a combination of just human triats and gender socialisation/response to that socialisation.

Yes exactly.

I've been thinking about men and women in societies which aren't as gendered and hyper-sexual as ours. The cultural and social expectations put on women's appearance and behaviour vary greatly, but our functional role in society not so much. Why would a gender identity compel an individual to want to take on the appearance and behaviour of a woman according to that societies expectations of how a woman should look and behave, but not compel him to take on the functional role?

Gender is a social construct.

I often perform femininity by doing things such as wearing makeup and wearing high healed shoes- in the 1700s these were seen as masculine traits, as upper class men wore heals to show they didn't need to work and could afford to wear extravagant footwear.

I have a biological sex. No-one is born with gender identity- it is something that is imposed on us by society.

If we did away with the idea of rigid gender stereotypes and let everyone dress how they wanted and act how they wanted without judgement, a lot of these issues would go away.

Our society is so hyper sexualised, the word sex seems to no longer have two meanings and has been replaced by gender due to blushing.

To clarify, by functional role I'm not purely talking about reproduction. Women do the majority of unpaid labour, have the caring responsibilities. I think this doesn't vary much across the world.

Yes of course how society treats age is a social construction but the ageing of the body is a material reality.

A bit like how reproductive sex is a material reality (sex) and how society treats sex is a social construction (gender).

Humans can think and philosophize and we have self-awareness. Therefore we have a sense of identity and that identity is constructed both through our material reality and how society treats that material reality. What we don't have is the ability to transcend our material reality by making up words and claiming that social constructions are individual inner realities that individuals control.