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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Day of protest in Canada

102 replies

Trousersdontmakemeaman · 22/04/2018 02:50

Monday 23rd April 11am PST
7pm Uk time

twitter.com/JennSmith64/status/987857664762724352

We need brave women REFUSING to be silenced. TRUTH IS NOT HATE! IGNORANCE IS NOT STRENGTH!
We are that woman.

OP posts:
Rufustheconstantreindeer · 25/04/2018 20:18

that's your country. Your country has different laws to mine. Stop saying we have nothing to be concerned about

There we go

Looks better now

OvaHere · 25/04/2018 20:28

This happened last Friday in a gender neutral bathroom. There's a reasonable chance it might not have happened in a female only bathroom due to other women being around or someone noticing a man following a woman in. We segregate by sex for reasons of privacy, dignity and safety.

www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/woman-allegedly-sexually-assaulted-in-toronto-nightclub-bathroom-police-say-1.4631453

thebewilderness · 25/04/2018 20:33

The only people who seem to be more homophobic than the religious right are the transgender advocates. Have you noticed that?

ItLooksABitOff · 25/04/2018 20:39

Meh, no one's rattling my cage. I just think it's really ironic and sad that anyone who considers themselves feminist aligning with someone like Kari S and her ultra-conservative acolytes.

I just checked the one rad-fem transition house that I know of locally and it looks like they're still sticking to their cis women only thingy. I mean sure, it's not a good thing for anyone to be triggered - but I'd also be curious as to what the trigger was. Not all trans women look male. Or have stereotypically male bodies. So i'm curious about that.

it remains that here anyway trans people are at a higher rate of violence. That's what I'm concerned about. And all this backlash is just making them more vulnerable.

I really respect many first nations' views on this: that 2 spirit people are just that, 2 spirit, and should be respected and honoured for what they are. In one nation (blackfoot) men who were 2s were taught the same tasks as cis women but were still considered 2s, not women. They aren't men. They are 2s, trans.

Rufustheconstantreindeer · 25/04/2018 20:41

That makes sense to me itlooks

Rufustheconstantreindeer · 25/04/2018 20:42

The spirit bit

ItLooksABitOff · 25/04/2018 20:43

Considering the history of the gay community in North America in ultimately rejecting the work of Sylvia and Marsha P Johnson in starting Stonewall BECAUSE they were trans, the fact that some in the gay community are doing this again proves...well, that some in the gay community don't like trans people. So what.

DodoPatrol · 25/04/2018 20:44

For myself, ItLooks, I'd be happy to consider trans-identified males as neither men nor women. I have huge sympathy for those who are unhappy being male, but it doesn't make them female. But we don't have that tradition: and I don't know if it's likely to spread to other cultures.

ItLooksABitOff · 25/04/2018 20:44

Me too Rufus. And then Christianity arrived...blech.

Rufustheconstantreindeer · 25/04/2018 20:46

And then Christianity arrived...blech.

Yeah

It seemed to have a habit of doing that

UpstartCrow · 25/04/2018 20:46

it remains that here anyway trans people are at a higher rate of violence.
Really? Do you have stats to back that up?

The violence and homicide rate for Native women is so high that Amnesty called it 'a human rights crisis;
www.amnesty.ca/sites/amnesty/files/iwfa_submission_amnesty_international_february_2014_-_final.pdf

thebewilderness · 25/04/2018 20:46

it remains that here anyway trans people are at a higher rate of violence.

Transgender suffer a much lower rate of violence than men and women.
A great deal lower that the prostituted and First Nation women, but zombie lies never die.

ItLooksABitOff · 25/04/2018 20:48

Well, isn't the problem that we're stuck in a culture of thinking in terms of gender binaries?

Some First Nations languages don't even have words for men/women male/female - they just don't think in terms of gender binaries. I think that's part of the issue. Because our culture insists on fitting people into one box or another. Even if they don't.

I don't blame trans women for not wanting to be identified as men. They aren't. They have also likely experienced a lot of emotional and physical violence at the hands of cis men, precisely BECAUSE they don't fit into our male/female box and it's been drummed into us over generations that that's wrong.

ItLooksABitOff · 25/04/2018 20:49

You realise some of those MMIW were trans right?

thebewilderness · 25/04/2018 20:50

Considering the history of the gay community in North America in ultimately rejecting the work of Sylvia and Marsha P Johnson in starting Stonewall BECAUSE they were trans...
Zombie lies never die.
The posthumously transitioning of Gays and Lesbians is every bit as despicable as the religious organizations that posthumously baptize them.

Juells · 25/04/2018 20:51

Interesting the way that Oger person phrases it...

"Who is a woman in Canada and British Columbia is not based on their plumbing but on our gender identity."

Well, that makes it pretty clear, who's important and who isn't.

thebewilderness · 25/04/2018 20:52

First Nations people have repeatedly debunked the lies that transgender advocates tell about them, just as the Intersex community spokespersons do but to no avail because it is all about validation of the cult.

thebewilderness · 25/04/2018 20:55

As you can see the transgender advocates have no limits and no decency and no respect for others. They coopt anyone and everyone to promote their beliefs.

ItLooksABitOff · 25/04/2018 20:56

Which First Nations people from which First Nation? There's over 600.

Who are these people? Do they speak for their communities? Because all the indigenous people I know (Haudasaunee, Blackfoot, Metis, etc) acknowledge trans people and acceptance of trans as being a long time thing in their communities.

Wow So Marsha isn't trans to you. LOL got it.

ItLooksABitOff · 25/04/2018 20:58

And yes, I can point you to the exact Blackfoot person who told me about the 2S thing. He lives in Alberta, Canada. I can DM you his twitter name and you can see for yourself. And that's just one.

MrsTerryPratchett · 25/04/2018 20:59

it remains that here anyway trans people are at a higher rate of violence. That's what I'm concerned about. And all this backlash is just making them more vulnerable.

On a day when Canada is reeling from a misogynistic attack in Toronto... missing and murdered aboriginal women. Once every six days a Canadian woman is killed by an intimate partner.

People who experience the worst violence as women: prostituted women, aboriginal women, women with disabilities, immigrant women, care leaving girls.

ItLooksABitOff · 25/04/2018 21:03

2s workshop for Native people in Tkaronto here:

2spiritskillshare.tumblr.com/

apihtawikosisan.com/2012/03/language-culture-and-two-spirit-identity/

ItLooksABitOff · 25/04/2018 21:05

it's not a competition MrsTerry. We can care for both.

ItLooksABitOff · 25/04/2018 21:06

sds.utoronto.ca/event/resilience-representation-and-colonialism-2-spirit-and-indigenous-sexualities/

What's interesting is how much work is going on to decolonize a lot of indigenous sexuality