The MNHQ Moderation Team: Thread 2

[BarrackerBarmer]

Follow on thread regarding the data breach situation:
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Dear MNHQ

I'm very grateful for the commitment to free speech you've publicly taken, and for Justine's courage this week.

A former disgruntled employee of MN is writing on Twitter about the 'transphobia' of MN staff, and calling you TERFs. She is showing a great deal of bias and intolerance towards women with feminist views, this may well be her honest opinion, which is no big deal I suppose, since she is no longer an employee.

At least, it isn't an issue until she calls a shout out to her
'friends who still work at MN' to report and take down posts by 'transphobic scum', by which she appears to be referring to any poster objecting to being called TERF by her friend.

Regardless of the personal views of the MNHQ staff, who should be as free to hold their own views as I am mine, I am disturbed that there may be a small contingent of employees who are invested in unfair moderation and will not be applying fair-handed principles, at least if the claims of this ex-employee are credible.

Can you please give posters some reassurance that the difficult job of fair-handed moderation isn't being abused by the 'friends' of ex-employees who are 'reporting it all' and taking down posts because any gender criticism means the poster is 'transphobic scum'?

Thank you.

It seemed from what was said at the meeting, the intimidation was particularly felt early on when speakers were arriving...
The protest outside can be heard quietening down as the meeting progresses.
It is also described by Jeni Harvey here twitter.com/GappyTales/status/987297188580642816

Fuck off magnetic. I was actually in the area waiting to help out/film if anything happened with friends who were too scared to buy tickets (I don't have a fuck to give). There were loads of Police there (who stood down before 8pm because nowt was happening), Channel 4, Bristol Evening Post and other small crews

Rein in your anger, no need to tell me to fuck off. I asked if you were there, you have now confirmed that you were.

As you say, you have no fucks to give so I doubt you would have seen the intimidation the same way as others. I'm a tough old boot too so it may have had little impact on me but I don't disrespect the feelings of others.

The transman arranging 'cis' friends acknowledged that there was no "need" for escorts, that there was no "fear" but that they were doing it become some people felt unsafe. At least they had the good grace to see it from another person's point of view even though there was no "need".

"Did I say anything about "needing"?

Did I say anything about fear?

I said some of my friends feel unsafe, and I'm doing what I can to help - it's strange so many people object to that - particularly feminists, who know how it feels to not want to walk home alone at night."

Also important to be aware of the motivation for current pressure on the school which hosted WPUK's Cardiff event after the hotel was successfully lobbied to cancel:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3224624-WPUK-Wales-meeting-last-week-help-needed

Family member in the police said their unit eye-roll over this. They know exactly who to worry about when young men are in hoodies towering over old ladies and screaming at them, and they think most are just taking the piss.

Having said that though, their diversity training is forceful, and when they're ordered to do something (arrest, escort etc) they have to do it

The point of diversity training is surely to understand why it may be needed even if they themselves don't perceive the fear.

As law officers they presumably know how many women are murdered and assaulted each week by men. They would know why women have good reason to fear men who may well appear to be no risk to a police officer. They would know that many women attending these events will do so because of their personal experience at the hands of men.

So why the eye rolling?

Magneticman
I have no doubt that the fear that some transgender people fear is very real. A great deal of harm has been done by some who have fuelled these fears in the name of TRA.

Everything thecatfromjapan says is spot on (as usual).

You've really put your finger on something I've been failing to articulate. I just keep boggling "she really thought she was in the right!" without being able to explain WHY this bothers me so much. You've got it.

I REALLY HOPE Emma Healey is reading this.

I also agree that we shouldn't get too into following her around the internets and sneering at her stupidity because - to her as an individual it's the wrong message and puts us on the wrong side - AND she won't learn from it. It is literally unedifying to laugh at where she is silly and foolish in public, and makes us meanies. What she should be doing is reading why she is SO SO WRONG in such deeply patriarchal ways, and thinking about it HARD. She won't have time to do this if she's embattledly spouting an unthink piece about The Time When Mumsnet Turned Against Me, The Martyr.

It's part of the trans narrative to present as oppressed
Poor little 6'3" well built trans woman afraid of a 5' nothing 60 year old woman

Important to step back and try to understand better how people might be influenced.

liesoftransactivists.com

This site is dedicated to exposing the lies and distortions propagated by some transactivists to cause division and hatred. Some are outright untruths, some are deliberate attempts to mislead, and some are just plain stupidity. Trans people, like everyone else, deserve to be listened to and respected. The discussions around trans issues are complex and nuanced, covering biology, psychology, law, medicine, ethics, even philosophy. How can we possibly find the answers to all of those questions when people are demonised for even asking them? When we reject their lies, we might all get the peace, freedom and respect we deserve.

I have no doubt that the fear that some transgender people fear is very real. A great deal of harm has been done by some who have fuelled these fears in the name of TRA.

I agree.

I really don't think so much focus should be on one women... without in anyway legitimising the very serious consequences of what she did for members of Mumsnet or the platform.

@C8H10N4O2

I read the 'eye roll' comment as being aimed at the young men in hoodies screaming at women, then having to be escorted from a pub out of fear of 2 middle aged feminists popping in for a drink.

I may have read that incorrectly though.

Yes. You've misunderstood @C8H10N4O2. That's my point.

@MagneticMan

I may also have read it incorrectly - I hope your interpretation is the correct one.

I have memories of support services eye rolling and sympathising with the very men they had been called to remove from abusive situations. I'd like to think those days are passed but when I look at the misogyny trotted out by activists in this fight I really wonder how far society has progressed.

@Jotspur

Fair enough, apologies!

Bravo thecatfromjapan!

I have no doubt that the fear that some transgender people fear is very real. A great deal of harm has been done by some who have fuelled these fears in the name of TRA.

It's bollocks. There has not ever been physical threats of violence from gender critical women to trans people, even the TRAs. There has been plenty the other way though.

I have met quite a few of the famous frightening TERFs including Magdalen Berns. She is tiny. About 5 foot, 7 stone and walks with a stick these days due to brain surgery. Razor sharp wordsmith of course!

'It's not the 70s anymore'

I leased and ran 5 pubs with my ex in the 2000s for 7 years. We drank real ale so we both trained in how to keep it, it's high maintenance stuff. We were CAMRA recommended. Once a barrel is rolled into your cellar it needs two to three days to settle, then it must be tapped and hand pumped without the gas propulsion used for lagers, the lines from the barrel to the pump cleaned every night because it's "live", and it goes off in a week so if you haven't sold the whole 8 gallons you are chucking it away, and making no profit. Most chains pubs cannot do that as they employ on minimum wage and give them no training.

So that's the reason real ale is declining, it's economically challenging.

Transexual people could have stood with women years ago. They didn't. Women are doing the hard labour of protecting them with the fight against self ID. They can't complain now. They were against women for too long.

AssignedPuurfectAtBirth
I'm not saying they should be fearful.

Im saying that I'm not surprised they are fearful as a direct consequence of the propaganda pumped out by some TRAs.

The extent of manipulation, especially in recent months, is extraordinary!

I know R0wan, sorry if I worded that to suggest otherwise. I have the rage today, especially at the gaslighting re. Lila Perry on the other thread. Going to go to the garden centre to buy some plants then spend the rest of the day doing the garden and drinking

I can see how these buffoons could be seen as intimidating but they really aren't. As one of the speakers said, when she asked one to move they replied in a really posh accent. These young uns are playing at being anarchists, they have no clue. I was an anarchist, many moons ago and it was a working class organisation, the vast majority were working class, in my time fighting against Thatcherism. They are trying to intimidate, while playing the victim card at the same time, they have no idea just how idiotic they look. As we know, from Tara they will attack, but they also know it looks bad and will be reigning in their behaviour to stay within the law. I can see more confrontation, it's escalating and we don't know how far they are prepared to go. Some spotty oink in a mask wouldn't intimidate me at all, please remember these are posh, privileged young people.... They are not in any way scary. I cannot wait to go to a meeting.

@AssignedPuurfectAtBirth I may have to join you with a !!
No problem & I'm happy that the point was made clear!

The conversations here are very important.

Terfragette69
the activists present in Bristol are experienced alongside other activists on social media. Increasingly the implied power lessens as more are aware of what has been happening.